Will “mass deportation” actually happen (4 Viewers)

[superchuck500]

It’s so repulsive to see people cheering for what is basically 80% the same thing as the Holocaust - different end result but otherwise very similar.

Economists have said it would tank the economy and cause inflation - notwithstanding the cost.

Is it going to actually happen or is this Build The Wall 2.0?

 

[Optimus Prime]

Jesus

This is what people voted for and fork everyone who did

I hope there is proof they informed the school and nothing was done and sue the hell out of the district

The adults who knew and did nothing, fired

If they identify the classmates who did this, expelled

And I wonder if those kids feel even the slightest bit of remorse about driving this girl to this, and what their parents are feeling and saying to their children

Sadly I wouldn’t be surprised if the kids feel nothing and neither do the parents (or worse than nothing, happy about it)
=======================

An 11-year-old girl took her own life in Texasafter she was tormented by classmates who threatened to call Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) authorities and have her family deported from the US, her grieving parents have said.

Jocelynn Rojo Carranza passed away on February 8 after spending five days being treated in a Dallas hospital.

This came after she was taunted with deportation threats for weeks by sixth-grade classmates at Gainesville Intermediate School, around 70 miles north of Dallas, her mother Marbella Carranza told Univision.

Her death comes amid president Donald Trump’s ordering for the “largest deportation operation in American history,” prompting agents with ICE and other federal authorities to launch targeted raids on approximately 12 million undocumented immigrants nationwide.

For Jocelyn however, the climate of fear became all too grave.

Classmates allegedly harassed the young girl by telling her she would be left alone without her family once they were deported.

But the alleged abuse spiraled, and despite reportedly informing school officials on numerous occasions, no action was taken to stop it.

When asked to comment on this story, the Gainesville Independent School District did not acknowledge Carranza’s death but rather issued a statement pointing to its strict anti-bullying code…….

11-year-old took her own life over deportation threats, family says

‘I waited a whole week for a miracle that my daughter would be well, but unfortunately, nothing could be done,’ despaired her mother

www.independent.co.uk

The mother of an 11-year-old girl, who took her own life after her family says she received a barrage of deportation threats from fellow classmates, has spoken out about her catastrophic loss.

Jocelynn Rojo Carranza passed away on February 8 after spending five days being treated in a Dallas hospital with unknown injuries, according to a Gainesville Police Department press release Thursday.…..

In a new interview, her mother, Marbella Carranza, spoke to CNN affiliate KUVN about the devastating loss of her child and claimed the school kept her in the dark about her daughter being bullied: “[I want] justice because it’s not fair – the school was negligent for not keeping me informed of what was going on with my daughter.”

Carranza, who declined to comment on her family’s immigration status, said she had received “nothing concrete” from investigators on the moments prior to her daughter taking her own life.

Classmates allegedly harassed Jocelynn by telling her she would be left alone without her family once they were deported.

The news of her death came amid President Donald Trump’s push for the “largest deportation operation in American history,” prompting agents with Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) and other federal authorities to launch targeted raids on the approximately 12 million undocumented immigrants in America.

Her mother is now directing her anger at her daughter’s school.

“My daughter never showed changes. I mean, there was never anything that gave me a sign that she was suffering from bullying.”

Jocelynn reportedly told her teachers that she was being bullied on numerous occasions, and even received regular counseling multiple times a week, but no action was taken to stop it and her mother was never informed, shared Carranza.……

Mother of 11-year-old who took her own life over ICE threats speaks out

‘My daughter never showed changes. I mean, there was never anything that gave me a sign that she was suffering from bullying’, Marbella Carranza said

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Sendai]

They were all Venezuelans in that group of 177, and Venezuelans were granted temporary protected status in 2021. We have one relative who says her brother came here from Venezuela and had applied for asylum. Her brother had come here and immediately surrendered to Border Patrol and had made his appointment with Immigration. She also said he had never been in trouble with the law. And he ended up at Gitmo because of a sports-related tattoo.

Why do you think none of them had applied for asylum, when that was readily available to them? How do you think they were found so easily? As is the case for a lot of the people Trump is deporting, these are the folks who are easy to find, because they are following the rules. They keep up with their appointments and they register their addresses.

The Admin whisking them out of the country so abruptly means they were not afforded any of the rights they are due by US immigration law. No legal representation, not even the ability to contact family.

“However, of the 299 undocumented migrants - from India, China, Uzbekistan, Iran, Vietnam, Turkey, Nepal, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Sri Lanka - only 171 have agreed to return to their countries of origin.”

I don’t see Venezuela listed among those in Panama.

 

[Sendai]

This is complete gaslighting. They were transported there against their will, and only allowed to leave under certain circumstances-some of which could put them in danger.

They are definitely detainees. To say they are not is dishonest. Extremely so.

This is complete gaslighting. They were transported there against their will, and only allowed to leave under certain circumstances-some of which could put them in danger.

They are definitely detainees. To say they are not is dishonest. Extremely so.

“According to the government, this group will be transferred to a camp in the province of Darién, which has temporarily housed migrants crossing the jungle en route to the US.”

“He also warned that those migrants who did not wish to return to their country of origin would have to choose a third country.

In that case, he said, the International Organization for Migration (IOM) and the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) would be responsible for their repatriation.”

It’s temporary. With the option not to return to their home country with the support of international agencies.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Donald Trump’s presidential administration has reassigned its top official at US Immigration and Customs Enforcement (Ice) after the agency’s arrests and deportations have been slower than expected, Reuters reported, citing a senior administration official and two other sources familiar with the matter.

The official, Caleb Vitello, was in the role in an acting capacity and had been grappling with pressure to step up enforcement after other top Ice officials were reassigned days earlier.

According to a spokeswoman for the homeland security department who spoke to the Wall Street Journal, Vitello is “actually being elevated so he is no longer in an administrative role, but is overseeing all field and enforcement operations: finding, arresting, and deporting illegal aliens”

The outlet went on to report that Vitello will remain at Ice and lead the office that is responsible for arrests and deportations.


Speaking to the Wall Street Journal, one Trump administration official said that the White House is expected to announce a new acting director. Another administration official told the outlet that the Ice team was going to be expanded.

Vitello was hand-picked by Trump last December and has 23 years of experience with Ice.……..

Trump removes Ice chief amid apparent frustration over rate of deportations

Caleb Vitello reassigned as administration reportedly unhappy that arrests and deportations have been slower than expected

www.theguardian.com

 

[SystemShock]

Come on, don't do that. Don't do the (willfully?) missing the point and mindlessly repeating yourself thing.

I am not missing any point. I am repeating a question that you refuse to answer. But that's par for the course.... kind of like arguing with apologists, "you don't understand, you miss the point"... yeah...

 

[SystemShock]

To be fair, he didn’t say it WAS the Holocaust, but referenced it as partially there.

H said it was "80% the Holocaust". So I guess I'll wait for ~5,000,000 dead detainee bodies to agree with that statement.

 

[MT15]

H said it was "80% the Holocaust". So I guess I'll wait for ~5,000,000 dead detainee bodies to agree with that statement.

You’re nitpicking IMO. 80% of the way to the gas chambers and firing squads is an equally valid way to interpret that statement rather than your way of interpreting it as 80% of the deaths. We all know he doesn’t mean that - they aren’t executing people as of yet.

 

[MT15]

“According to the government, this group will be transferred to a camp in the province of Darién, which has temporarily housed migrants crossing the jungle en route to the US.”

“He also warned that those migrants who did not wish to return to their country of origin would have to choose a third country.

In that case, he said, the International Organization for Migration (IOM) and the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) would be responsible for their repatriation.”

It’s temporary. With the option not to return to their home country with the support of international agencies.

Sendai, you just keep regurgitating the exact same sentences over and over. It’s actually a bit condescending don’t you think? I read it and understood the words the first time you posted them. It’s the Administration’s CYA speech. I don’t believe this Admin, because they are not reliably truthful in their statements. In fact they have been caught in gross lies many times.

You have never acknowledged that these people were deported so quickly they were deprived of their legal rights under US immigration law. We have no way of knowing what the conditions are at the camp, we know kids were grabbed and deported as well as adults. We have good reason to suspect that there are legitimate asylum cases among the people grabbed.

It might be they aren’t being mistreated, but I doubt it. Why do you put so much stock in these statements? From known liars? Is it because you just want it to happen so bad and you want to think it’s all just fine?

If it were all fine, they would be following US laws, and not grabbing people and shipping off to a camp in the jungle in Panama.

 

[MT15]

“However, of the 299 undocumented migrants - from India, China, Uzbekistan, Iran, Vietnam, Turkey, Nepal, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Sri Lanka - only 171 have agreed to return to their countries of origin.”

I don’t see Venezuela listed among those in Panama.

The Venezuelans were being held at Gitmo. It’s the same process though - just grab people and throw them in a plane and send them somewhere where they have no representation and no contact with family. We don’t know how many were here in an asylum program. We don’t have any transparency whatsoever about the conditions at the camp.

Defending this process is the opposite of conservative, IMO. It’s an authoritarian lawless act to grab these people and remove them from the US like they are doing. They are not following the laws as they currently exist, and you are okay with that.

 

[MT15]

“According to the government, this group will be transferred to a camp in the province of Darién, which has temporarily housed migrants crossing the jungle en route to the US.”

“He also warned that those migrants who did not wish to return to their country of origin would have to choose a third country.

In that case, he said, the International Organization for Migration (IOM) and the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) would be responsible for their repatriation.”

It’s temporary. With the option not to return to their home country with the support of international agencies.

Are you saying they are not being detained? Please explain your thought process here.

Because it’s temporary, it doesn’t count? This is laughable.

They are being detained. Come on, you’re either gaslighting yourself, or being gullible.

 

[SystemShock]

You’re nitpicking IMO. 80% of the way to the gas chambers and firing squads is an equally valid way to interpret that statement rather than your way of interpreting it as 80% of the deaths. We all know he doesn’t mean that - they aren’t executing people as of yet.

I am not nitpicking. Y'all just want to make this comparison, and rationalize the comparison, when there really isn't one. You could compare what's happening in the U.S. now with previous events in Chile, Cuba (Cuban revolution), Venezuela, the U.S. (Japanese concentration camps in the U.S. during WWII), China, I can keep on going, but you go straight to the most brutal, systematic, and efficient attempt at exterminating an entire ethnic group that humanity has ever seen, that saw the death of 6,500,000+ Jews in a 2-3 year period. You could call the Panama camp a detention camp, an interment camp, but no, you choose to specifically call it a concentration camp, like the Nazis called their camps, because you want to make this association.

But y'all do you.

 

[Sendai]

Are you saying they are not being detained? Please explain your thought process here.

Because it’s temporary, it doesn’t count? This is laughable.

They are being detained. Come on, you’re either gaslighting yourself, or being gullible.

They are caught in a process where international aid agencies are trying place them in new home countries. Odds are they are among those who have deportation orders against them or recent illegal border crossings caught and immediately removed. They have the option of returning to their country of origin or waiting in a temporary encampment for assistance from international aid agencies to find a new home country.

 

[MT15]

They are caught in a process where international aid agencies are trying place them in new home countries. Odds are they are among those who have deportation orders against them or recent illegal border crossings caught and immediately removed. They have the option of returning to their country of origin or waiting in a temporary encampment for assistance from international aid agencies to find a new home country.

Everything you just said is relying on the words of people who are known liars. We don’t know who was deported because they aren’t being transparent about their actions and have been caught lying numerous times in the past.

We know for sure that one person sent to Gitmo was returned to the US, which suggests they were wrongly detained and imprisoned. We have a credible account of a person with a legit asylum claim being sent to Gitmo and then deported back to Venezuela.

The family from Afghanistan that has been sent to Panama wasn’t in either of those two positions you have cited, as far as I can tell.

We have zero confirmation that any international aid agencies have been involved. The people swept up haven’t been allowed to contact families so far.

It’s pretty gullible to take all that verbiage as fact with zero independent confirmation and zero transparency from the Administration. And considering the amount of lying they have been doing so far.

 

[MT15]

I am not nitpicking. Y'all just want to make this comparison, and rationalize the comparison, when there really isn't one. You could compare what's happening in the U.S. now with previous events in Chile, Cuba (Cuban revolution), Venezuela, the U.S. (Japanese concentration camps in the U.S. during WWII), China, I can keep on going, but you go straight to the most brutal, systematic, and efficient attempt at exterminating an entire ethnic group that humanity has ever seen, that saw the death of 6,500,000+ Jews in a 2-3 year period. You could call the Panama camp a detention camp, an interment camp, but no, you choose to specifically call it a concentration camp, like the Nazis called their camps, because you want to make this association.

But y'all do you.

I do see your point. I think the Nazi salutes by some MAGAs and the support from actual Nazis plays into the selection of that example though.

 

[Sendai]

Everything you just said is relying on the words of people who are known liars. We don’t know who was deported because they aren’t being transparent about their actions and have been caught lying numerous times in the past.

We know for sure that one person sent to Gitmo was returned to the US, which suggests they were wrongly detained and imprisoned. We have a credible account of a person with a legit asylum claim being sent to Gitmo and then deported back to Venezuela.

The family from Afghanistan that has been sent to Panama wasn’t in either of those two positions you have cited, as far as I can tell.

We have zero confirmation that any international aid agencies have been involved. The people swept up haven’t been allowed to contact families so far.

It’s pretty gullible to take all that verbiage as fact with zero independent confirmation and zero transparency from the Administration. And considering the amount of lying they have been doing so far.

I have no reason to believe the government of Panama are “known liars”. And the international aid organizations haven’t stepped forward and denied they are involved. That usually happens if they are identified in print and not actually involved. And the journalists involved would likely let us know that.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

I have no reason to believe the government of Panama are “known liars”.

Oh...the irony!

 

[Sendai]

Oh...the irony!

Deported by US to Panama, 12 illegal migrants reach India - The Times of India

A group of 12 undocumented Indian immigrants deported from the US to Panama reached Delhi, facilitated by the International Organisation for Migration

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

Clearly the IOM is actively involved in Panama.

 

[UriUT]

I do see your point. I think the Nazi salutes by some MAGAs and the support from actual Nazis plays into the selection of that example though.

So the traditional criticism of repeatedly referencing the holocaust is that it tends to numb the population to that possibility. A chicken little scenario. This comes from a person who argues against actions that make it amenable towards a final solution. Right? The fear is that if we use the holocaust as an example repeatedly, we lose that shock value and our argument fails. So that person wouldn't say, abuse is transactional to the solution. Worse, that person wouldn't say the solution, cruel as it may be, is the only possible solution. Therefore, the ends justifies the means. No. Someone to the cause would object based on the dulling of holocaust. Rather, it's the opposite. Repeatedly referencing the holocaust insults their sensibilities.

Take a step back a little. Reflect on what he says. Imagine, a typical german in the 20s and 30s. These nutjobs are grabbing all the jews. That german, convinced that jews are the bad guys, just because and telling himself, "Is it ruthless? Sure. Will there be abuses? Of course, there always are ( I mean, just look at our penal system and police depts around the country)".

So as you see, there is a Hannah arendt's banality of evil right there. The typical acceptance of evil acts by bureaucrats and common citizens. The lack of empathy! Acceptance that a human being will be raped, molested, tortured, abused, etc. It's ok. It's transactional. It's part of the process. How depraved can one be? This is not corruption as transactional to government business. A few dollars are lost here and there. No big deal. Rather, we are talking about human beings here. The moment that one accepts these behavior is when nazi german is most apt. This is quintessentially Hannah arendt's observation of nazi Germany. Just as we don't accept police brutality and work towards ending it, we cannot, must not accept, dehumanizing abuse.

So this begs the question. There's acceptance for a certain level depravity from him. Obviously, the final solution is frowned upon...and is a line we cannot cross. That's his bar. Rather, it's ok to reference the myanmar or african genocide. A touch below the final solution? Maybe? Not because this will numb us and make us complacent. How could it? Why use one example or the other if it does? They're both nasty stuff? So...again, the question is...does bringing in the holocaust insult his sensibilities? "No, we are not at the level of the holocaust as we are dehumanizingly detaining people in far off jungle or island. After the rape, no we are not at the level of the holocaust, so don't use reference the holocaust. After the killings, no we are not at the level of the holocaust" so on and so on. The objection isn't that it gets old. No we use the holocaust as it's well known and even the most uninformed of Americans will know what it is.

So yeah. I find that he's right that he didn't misinterpret what yall are saying. He is telling you in plain text. [Edit]. He didn't argue why we will not reach the holocaust level. He accepts the abuse. Nope, it's the use of the holocaust per se.

Ps. I remember the use of nazi Germany in that israel thread. What these people who objects to that use always fails to consider is that there are forces working against the final outcome. And as such, we get to avoid repeating such acts. Some here found biden insufficient, but he was an opposing force against Israel's draconian solution. Now we find that israel will be allowed ethnic cleansing. Some here may not even be aware of it and suggest in that thread possibly moving the Palestinians to say somewhere in America. Ethnic cleansing....and even then...."lol. He used the holocaust". Strange how evil some humans can be to one another. Sometimes without even knowing it.