Will “mass deportation” actually happen (1 Viewer)

[superchuck500]

It’s so repulsive to see people cheering for what is basically 80% the same thing as the Holocaust - different end result but otherwise very similar.

Economists have said it would tank the economy and cause inflation - notwithstanding the cost.

Is it going to actually happen or is this Build The Wall 2.0?

 

[UriUT]

And, as I pointed out on my thread, it's not just crime.

Are you still going on about remittance's effect on US's inflation and the lack of education from immigrants? You understand that that's not at all persuasive right? I try to be evidence based, and from the past links I've posted, they all conclude that immigration is a net positive on the US economy. In terms of inflation, if anything, it's likely net deflationary as they work on jobs like farms that keep produce's prices low or construction. You seem to find conclusions from Mexico's perspective, and from a US citizen, I don't give a damn. So why do I care that remittance causes inflation in Mexico? That's Mexico's problem. Their central banks reacted how they reacted. Just like I don't give a rats arse that India receives the highest total each year at a whopping 100 billion. That's money that these people earned, and I don't care to dictate how they spend their money. They have already contributed to our economy for their work, sales tax and consumption. Are we communists now?

In case you missed it:

What caused the U.S. pandemic-era inflation?

Ben Bernanke, Distinguished Senior Fellow at the Hutchins Center at Brookings, and Olivier Blanchard, Senior Fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics, answer a timely question: What caused the increase in U.S. inflation during and after the COVID-19 pandemic?

www.brookings.edu

Find remittance as the cause in there. The conversation centered on supply disruption and the demand shock in the early period to likely a labor issue contributing in the later period driving inflation. In case you don't know, tight labor is the wage increase, and if immigration adds competition to labor costs, it drives wages down...but we all know that's bullshirt right? They are taking jobs Americans refuse to take.

How many pages has there been on immigration? I have yet to find any real objective "immigration crisis". Yeah, the germans, those italians, the irish, the chinese. All past immigration have really done a number throughout US history hasn't it. Oh right, they have contributed to the US success story. And each time, they faced zenophobia.

The biggest irony, one of the argument that explains America's resilience and success story in response during the post pandemic period has been immigration. Another irony? Visa overstay is as much a problem. Instead maga and the likes who try to push this as some emotional trigger aren't even talking about it. It's the southern border 24/7.

 

[UriUT]

A person being in a country without the proper permit isn't a perspective.



Ok?

Then why not stick to this? Why bring up gangs and crimes? What's the intention?

 

[Optimus Prime]

Since President-elect Donald Trump won the election earlier this month, Haitian residents of Springfield, Ohio, have been living with a renewed fear of what may come should he follow through on his vow to terminate their temporary legal immigration status.

Many have packed their bags and left, while those who’ve called the Dayton suburb home for years and can't easily relocate scramble for information on their options for remaining in the United States as the threat of deportation during Trump's second term looms.

"Every place here — at church, at school, at work, everywhere — people are talking about what's gonna happen after [Temporary Protected Status] expires," said Evens Edouard, a Haitian resident of Springfield who works as a quality inspector for an automotive safety glass company in a nearby town. "We don't know. We don't know the plan."

Edouard, who said he received the status after losing his immediate relative visa following his divorce from a U.S. citizen he said abused him during their marriage, told Salon in a phone interview that he's most concerned about what his kids' lives will look like if Trump strips his legal status. Three of the 38-year-old's six children, five of whom are minors, hold temporary legal status. His other three children are U.S. citizens.

"I cannot take my kids who were born in the USA, and go back with them to Haiti. How are they gonna leave?" he said, adding: "When you say you have to send them back home, you send your own kids to a country that they don't know. They have the right to live here."

Though he said he believes Trump's campaign trail promise to end Temporary Protected Status was little more than political posturing to win over voters critical of immigration, he does feel the weight of what the election results could mean for his community.

"I think this election blocked our progress. This election blocked our future in this country," he said, asserting that they're unable to plan for the future because of the uncertainty around what Trump will ultimately do with their legal status and what will happen after.

"We don't know exactly if we're gonna have a chance to stay or not. We don't know if we have to move to Canada. We don't know if we have to plan to go back to our country. We don't know if we have to plan to go to another country — that's the impact of this election for the Haitian community," he added. "We don't see our future."..............

Haitian immigrants in Springfield, Ohio "panicking" after Trump's win

Amid false smears, Trump threatened to revoke Temporary Protected Status for people who fled Haiti to US.

www.salon.com

 

[coldseat]

Good for you.
I did specify headline.

Like someone being in the country without the proper permits?


... which should be the headline.


Again, this should be the headline.

How is the mayor of Denver or Democrats supposed to control the headlines of an article?

People relying on a reactionary headline instead of actually reading the article and applying critical thinking is exactly why the US elected Trump. The people of this country are turning it into shirt with their ignorance and the media is all too happy to play along for the clicks. The problem isn't immigration or "WOKE" or "the economy", it's the forking stupid people who can't think their way out of a forking paper bag when they're being suffocated.

 

[J-DONK]

How is the mayor of Denver or Democrats supposed to control the headlines of an article?

People relying on a reactionary headline instead of actually reading the article and applying critical thinking is exactly why the US elected Trump. The people of this country are turning it into shirt with their ignorance and the media is all too happy to play along for the clicks. The problem isn't immigration or "WOKE" or "the economy", it's the forking stupid people who can't think their way out of a forking paper bag when they're being suffocated.

America needs legislation around algo's. TikTok should be banned, along with twitter, and facebook.

If Trump caps at doubling the current removal. I don't think it will have much of an impact. If we are talking about getting rid of all illegals in year or two? The impact on some industries is going to be massive.

Great graph not sure if it was posted:

 

[Optimus Prime]

en. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) said he thinks the mayor of Denver could be removed from office if he attempts to block President-elect Trump’s plan for mass deportations.

“I would say that the mayor of Denver, if he’s going to resist federal law — which, there’s a long-standing history of the supremacy of federal law — he’s going to resist that, it will go all the way to the Supreme Court,” Paul said Sunday on CBS’s “Face the Nation.”

“And I would suspect that he would be removed from office.”

Denver Mayor Mike Johnston (D) has vowed to protect migrants in his community as the Trump transition team promises it will crack down on immigration after taking office, particularly in sanctuary cities.

Sanctuary cities are municipalities that generally limit or prevent their local authorities from cooperating with the federal government in enforcing immigration laws.

In an earlier interview with Denverite, Johnston said he would use Denver’s police force to stop federal forces from deporting migrants. In an interview Friday with 9News, he walked back those comments but said he believes local citizens will help stop the planned deportations............

MSN

 

[Eeyore]

Or they can just execute you on the spot... plant a knife or other weapon after the fact... or better yet, just dump the bodies in designated mass graves... saves a lot of money on processing and knives, no?

They already do that

 

[Lapaz]

I think this is the wrong play. I think protesting inhumane treatment is fine... but if the deportations are humane, but just expensive and stupid... I think you let them go, and point out the damage it causes. The Democrats should be relentlessly talking about issues that matter to US citizens, and make the Republicans look like they are focused on the wrong stuff. "Look the Republicans spent $100 billion dollars deporting people, and now our groceries have gone up 20%". "Look the Republicans keep talking about people's genitals, while xxx is happening". and so on...

I think this is the wrong play. I think protesting inhumane treatment is fine... but if the deportations are humane, but just expensive and stupid... I think you let them go, and point out the damage it causes. The Democrats should be relentlessly talking about issues that matter to US citizens, and make the Republicans look like they are focused on the wrong stuff. "Look the Republicans spent $100 billion dollars deporting people, and now our groceries have gone up 20%". "Look the Republicans keep talking about people's genitals, while xxx is happening". and so on...

Denver’s Democrat mayor, Mike Johnston, has said he will encourage people to protest mass migrant deportations planned by president-elect Donald Trump in Colorado, as civic leaders in “sanctuary cities” begin to plan their response to the threat.

In an interview with Denver’s channel 9, Johnston, 50, said he is willing to go to jail to stop any deportation efforts. Denver’s neighboring city of Aurora has been a focus of the debate over migration after three apartment complexes were allegedly taken over by Venezuelan prison gang Tren de Aragua.

In comments, Aurora city council member Danielle Jurinsky, a Republican, said she had spoken with Trump’s transition team about “Operation Aurora” and warned city leaders that “I hope that we are taking this seriously. This is coming.”

Metropolitan areas, including Denver, New York and Los Angeles, have offered mixed responses to Trump’s promise to deport a vast number of immigrants in the US illegally. “Sanctuary city” laws typically forbid city employees and resources from being involved in federal immigration enforcement.


On Friday, Tom Homan, Trump’s incoming “border czar”, vowed to send “twice as many” Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents to Los Angeles to enact mass deportations. LA city council members have warned that Los Angeles will not be collaborating.……

Denver mayor says he will urge protests against Trump’s mass deportations

Mike Johnston also says he is prepared to go to jail in protest, although he is not opposed to all deportations

www.theguardian.com

Homan's initial comments about sending police to the county borders to stop federal agents was definitely going too far, but he retracted that statement. He stated that Denver will simply not provide their resources to help the deportations of non-violent illegal immigrants. LA and NYC majors have said the same thing. That is reasonable. Why waste resources chasing and deporting immigrants that are contributing to their cities, rather than focus their resources on people that are committing crimes? If red cities want to waste their money, then more power to them. This whole deportation plan would be a waste of resources at a time when the Trump administration purportedly wants to reduce waste, and purportedly wants to reduce inflation. It doesn't pass the common sense test.

 

[SystemShock]

How is the mayor of Denver or Democrats supposed to control the headlines of an article?

Don't say things that can be used as headlines for hit pieces?
The Mayor of Denver is obviously feeding his base, but Dems need to be smarter than that... especially after what happened this last election. He could've simply agreed that violent criminals need to be deported, but that he'll work to make sure legal immigrants aren't negatively affected.

People relying on a reactionary headline instead of actually reading the article and applying critical thinking is exactly why the US elected Trump. The people of this country are turning it into shirt with their ignorance and the media is all too happy to play along for the clicks. The problem isn't immigration or "WOKE" or "the economy", it's the forking stupid people who can't think their way out of a forking paper bag when they're being suffocated.

You met the American voter, I see.

 

[SystemShock]

Are you still going on about remittance's effect on US's inflation and the lack of education from immigrants? You understand that that's not at all persuasive right?

Everything I posted on that thread is factual.

Find remittance as the cause in there. The conversation centered on supply disruption and the demand shock in the early period to likely a labor issue contributing in the later period driving inflation. In case you don't know, tight labor is the wage increase, and if immigration adds competition to labor costs, it drives wages down...but we all know that's bullshirt right? They are taking jobs Americans refuse to take.

In case I don't know... can't help yourself either, huh?

Since you are fixed on remittance, first, let me remind you of what I posted:

Many people would argue that migrants are "good for the economy", but that is not always the case. Billions of dollars leave the U.S. economy every year, because migrants send money from the U.S. to other countries to support families there. The biggest destinations are India and MX, to the tune of 100 billion dollars in 2023 alone, according to the Bank of México (kind of like the MX version of the Fed). These billions of dollars do not circulate in the U.S. economy.

Speaking of inflation, the past year, the U.S. dollar has lost ~20% of its value against the MX peso. One of the main reasons for it, is the amount of money being sent to MX from the U.S. And MX is the U.S. 2nd largest trading partner.

As you can see, I didn't say anything specific to the pandemic. We can speak specifically about the pandemic (although I doubt all of those work absences were all illegal immigrants).

Also, those statements are factual. In case you don't know, when your currency loses its value against the currency of your biggest trading partner, and you have an import deficit (in case you don't know, that means you buy more stuff than you sell) your domestic prices likely go up.

 

[Dragon]

Everything I posted on that thread is factual.



In case I don't know... can't help yourself either, huh?

Since you are fixed on remittance, first, let me remind you of what I posted:

Many people would argue that migrants are "good for the economy", but that is not always the case. Billions of dollars leave the U.S. economy every year, because migrants send money from the U.S. to other countries to support families there. The biggest destinations are India and MX, to the tune of 100 billion dollars in 2023 alone, according to the Bank of México (kind of like the MX version of the Fed). These billions of dollars do not circulate in the U.S. economy.

Speaking of inflation, the past year, the U.S. dollar has lost ~20% of its value against the MX peso. One of the main reasons for it, is the amount of money being sent to MX from the U.S. And MX is the U.S. 2nd largest trading partner.

As you can see, I didn't say anything specific to the pandemic. We can speak specifically about the pandemic (although I doubt all of those work absences were all illegal immigrants).

Also, those statements are factual. In case you don't know, when your currency loses its value against the currency of your biggest trading partner, and you have an import deficit (in case you don't know, that means you buy more stuff than you sell) your domestic prices likely go up.

First, sources for your number are critical. Where did you get those from?

Secondly

• Labor as a Commodity
  Labor, much like goods such as rice or steel, can be "imported" when people migrate for work. In this sense, foreign workers "export" their labor to another country.
• Economic Outflow and Remittances
  A portion of their earnings is sent back to their home countries as remittances. While this does result in monetary outflows, these workers often reinvest a significant share of their income into the local economy through consumption.
• Taxes and Limited Benefits
  Many migrant workers, particularly undocumented ones, pay taxes (such as income, sales, and property taxes) but have limited access to social services. This dynamic often results in a fiscal surplus for the host country.
• Value Creation and Economic Contribution
  The value produced by workers typically exceeds their wages. This surplus benefits employers, enhances productivity, and contributes to the broader economy. Their labor fills gaps in sectors where there are shortages, such as agriculture, construction, and hospitality.
• Net Positive Economic Impact
  Studies (e.g., by the Cato Institute and the National Academies of Sciences) have consistently shown that immigrants contribute positively to economic growth, innovation, and labor market dynamism over time.

Labor should be viewed as a tradable commodity akin to raw materials. While migrant workers may send some of their earnings abroad, their presence results in a net positive effect on the U.S. economy. They generate value that exceeds their wages, pay taxes they often don't fully benefit from, and support industries essential to economic stability.

 

[coldseat]

Don't say things that can be used as headlines for hit pieces?
The Mayor of Denver is obviously feeding his base, but Dems need to be smarter than that... especially after what happened this last election. He could've simply agreed that violent criminals need to be deported, but that he'll work to make sure legal immigrants aren't negatively affected.

So Dems need to be "politically correct" and perfect while Republicans get so say whatever bat shirt crazy shirt comes out of their mouths. Got it!

You met the American voter, I see.

Yes, they're everywhere.

 

[J-DONK]

First, sources for your number are critical. Where did you get those from?

Secondly

• Labor as a Commodity
  Labor, much like goods such as rice or steel, can be "imported" when people migrate for work. In this sense, foreign workers "export" their labor to another country.
• Economic Outflow and Remittances
  A portion of their earnings is sent back to their home countries as remittances. While this does result in monetary outflows, these workers often reinvest a significant share of their income into the local economy through consumption.
• Taxes and Limited Benefits
  Many migrant workers, particularly undocumented ones, pay taxes (such as income, sales, and property taxes) but have limited access to social services. This dynamic often results in a fiscal surplus for the host country.
• Value Creation and Economic Contribution
  The value produced by workers typically exceeds their wages. This surplus benefits employers, enhances productivity, and contributes to the broader economy. Their labor fills gaps in sectors where there are shortages, such as agriculture, construction, and hospitality.
• Net Positive Economic Impact
  Studies (e.g., by the Cato Institute and the National Academies of Sciences) have consistently shown that immigrants contribute positively to economic growth, innovation, and labor market dynamism over time.

Labor should be viewed as a tradable commodity akin to raw materials. While migrant workers may send some of their earnings abroad, their presence results in a net positive effect on the U.S. economy. They generate value that exceeds their wages, pay taxes they often don't fully benefit from, and support industries essential to economic stability.

To add to this:

Baby Boomers are retiring at the rate of 10k a day.

This is why you have a 4% unemployment rate that won't really tick higher.

We need migrant, and immigrant workers for two things: 1. To cover the shortfall of jobs that shrinking labor force can't cover. 2. To provide a growing tax base to pay for increaseing social services as Baby Boomers retire.

This is why mass deportation at the clip of approx 3 million a year would be a disaster.

You are going to create a labor shortage in housing, and AG. This will increase food, and housing prices.

The right way is to figure out how to bring migrants in for seasonal work, and blue collar employment visa for sectors that need it.

Systemshock's fundmental need to villianize these people means he will never understand this, or agree with it.

 

[UriUT]

Everything I posted on that thread is factual.

This is interesting. So let's examine this. So you deal in facts right?

Many people would argue that migrants are "good for the economy", but that is not always the case. Billions of dollars leave the U.S. economy every year, because migrants send money from the U.S. to other countries to support families there. The biggest destinations are India and MX, to the tune of 100 billion dollars in 2023 alone, according to the Bank of México (kind of like the MX version of the Fed). These billions of dollars do not circulate in the U.S. economy.

Sure this is factual. Combined, remittance by BOTH India and Mexico exceeds 100 billion. As a matter of fact, 155.9 billion actually, estimated by various sources. As I've mentioned before, I can care less with what they do with their money. My question is, why didn't you care to express Mexico's remittance to Mexico strictly (55.9 billion) since you are comparing the peso's valuation? Further, why aren't you talking about India's rupee vs the dollar (hint, it fluctuated and was pretty flat...and considering remittance to india is 2x that to mexico)? Are you purposely ignoring the the trade deficit between these countries against the US? Is it because we trade half as much with India as we do with Mexico? We have a trade deficit of $150 billion, estimated, against Mexico. Could that also contributed to a stronger peso vs the dollar?

And I'll let you into something else. The fees for remittance has been increasing over these years. Not all of the 55.9 billion reach Mexico. These exchange companies are exhorting these people. Yes, remittance to Mexico makes up 4.something towards Mexico's gdp. Again, which weighs more heavily towards the dollar? Trade with the US or remittance?

Tell you what. Go to excel and graph remittance vs the US inflation since 2010 when remittance has been increasing each year. I'll help you. Us inflation didn't freaking fluctuated that much. Why? Because the US does trade with the EU, China, and the rest of the world. [edit. And domestic weight such as interest rates, employment, gdp, etc factors much much more.] And when the studies says inflation is due to the supply chain, it's not just freaking Mexico. If you are strictly relying on Mexico, I can see a stronger peso having some effect. The back log was China, which does almost 2x the trade we did with Mexico.

[edit: here's another reason why linking our inflation rate to mexico's peso is absurd. We had a chips scarity during the pandemic due to taiwan's issue ( yeah i was too quick to say it was strictly china). With the chips shortage, domestic manufacturing of cars and aplliances ceased. Prices for those items soared. As anyone can see, inflation can happen insependent of exchange rates due to scarcity.

Also, I should ve updated my info..and looked more carefully. The rupee actually lost value against the dollar. Again, other factors.]

"Immigration is completely out of control" is a dead giveaway that you are trying to advance some narrative. The nerve to question these people's intelligence and education level. Do you also understand that you are all over the place attacking immigration? At some point you separate migrants by attacking central americans, but in this post you reference, you attack Mexicans. Seriously, why????

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

Homan's initial comments about sending police to the county borders to stop federal agents was definitely going too far, but he retracted that statement. He stated that Denver will simply not provide their resources to help the deportations of non-violent illegal immigrants. LA and NYC majors have said the same thing. That is reasonable. Why waste resources chasing and deporting immigrants that are contributing to their cities, rather than focus their resources on people that are committing crimes? If red cities want to waste their money, then more power to them. This whole deportation plan would be a waste of resources at a time when the Trump administration purportedly wants to reduce waste, and purportedly wants to reduce inflation. It doesn't pass the common sense test.

I agree that the right play is to neither help, nor interfere. But the messaging should always be about why what they are doing (or not doing) is good for American citizens. Democrats got hammered because there was a perception in some circles that they cared more about undocumented immigrants than American citizens. So everytime the topic comes up, they need to be relentless on the message that they believe why the money being spent (or not spent) is helping the average American citizen.

"We aren't going to pay for the wasteful Trump deportation plan. We believe law enforcement should be focused on protecting the safety and property of American citizens, and not to carry out a vendetta. We welcome a chance to craft a comprehensive immigration policy that allows safe legal immigration into this country which will help spur economic growth for all Americans."

Something to that effect.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Just a phone call and problem solved

That was easy
===========

…….Meanwhile, Donald Trump said he spoke with the president of Mexico on Wednesday, who he said promised to stop migration through the country.

The announcement came after the Republican threatened to tariff trade with the U.S. partner over complaints about immigration and drugs…….

Trump claims Mexico has vowed to ‘stop migration’ amid tariff threats: Live

FBI on case as president-elect’s nominees and appointees victims of bomb threats and ‘swatting’ incidents this week

www.independent.co.uk

 

[MT15]

Just a phone call and problem solved

That was easy
===========

…….Meanwhile, Donald Trump said he spoke with the president of Mexico on Wednesday, who he said promised to stop migration through the country.

The announcement came after the Republican threatened to tariff trade with the U.S. partner over complaints about immigration and drugs…….

Trump claims Mexico has vowed to ‘stop migration’ amid tariff threats: Live

FBI on case as president-elect’s nominees and appointees victims of bomb threats and ‘swatting’ incidents this week

www.independent.co.uk

Exactly like his first term isn’t it? Empty promises, nothing actually happens.

 

[Huntn]

Just a phone call and problem solved

That was easy
===========

…….Meanwhile, Donald Trump said he spoke with the president of Mexico on Wednesday, who he said promised to stop migration through the country.

The announcement came after the Republican threatened to tariff trade with the U.S. partner over complaints about immigration and drugs…….

Trump claims Mexico has vowed to ‘stop migration’ amid tariff threats: Live

FBI on case as president-elect’s nominees and appointees victims of bomb threats and ‘swatting’ incidents this week

www.independent.co.uk

FL Trump… MAGA, the CULT swallows.