Trump loyalists in Congress to challenge Electoral College results in Jan. 6 joint session (Update: Insurrectionists storm Congress)(And now what?) (1 Viewer)

[superchuck500]

I guess it's time to start a thread for this. We know that at least 140 members of Congress have pledged to join the objection. Under federal law, if at least one member of each house (HOR and Senate) objects, each house will adjourn the joint session for their own session (limited at two hours) to take up the objection. If both houses pass a resolution objecting to the EC result, further action can take place. If both houses do not (i.e. if one or neither passes a resolution), the objection is powerless and the college result is certified.

Clearly this is political theater as we know such a resolution will not pass the House, and there's good reason to think it wouldn't pass the Senate either (with or without the two senators from Georgia). The January 6 joint session is traditionally a ceremonial one. This one will not be.

Many traditional pillars of Republican support have condemned the plan as futile and damaging. Certainly the Trump loyalists don't care - and many are likely doing it for fundraising purposes or to carry weight with the fraction of their constituencies that think this is a good idea.

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL32717.pdf

 

[Taurus]

I don't know what happens, but those leaked text showed the definition of audience capture.

I fear for the future more then most. Demographics, and Republicans unwillingness to change vs overthrowing democracy means we have an insanely high chance of Jan. 6 being a dress rehearsal.

I know people like MT15 don't like to talk about, but everyone should understand, that as a voting block, the people under 40 are vastly more liberal those those over 40. Also, the younger generations are more educated, but have far less money then the older generations at this point in their lives. They are also not converting to conservative ideology, because they have no reason to keep the status quo. As Silents, and Boomers die off, what are Republicans going to do?

They're already doing it. Part of it, SCOTUS, is already done. The rest; illegitimate registration purges, polling-place shenanigans, voter intimidation, straight-up ignoring results and changing the powers of an office depending on who's in it, is ongoing.

The GOP is doing its level best to cement minority rule for the foreseeable future.

 

[Optimus Prime]

get ready Plan C is on the way

the comments in the facebook post are crazy
======================

Three Trump-supporting brothers are preparing to roll out their "plan C" to reinstate him as president after the United States Supreme Court once again declined to hear their case.

In a Facebook post Tuesday, Raland Brunson—one of the plaintiffs in the case seeking to overturn the result of the 2020 presidential election and reinstall former President Donald Trump in the White House—said the Supreme Court had once again rejected an effort to hear the case, all but ending the already slim chance current President Joe Biden would be removed from the White House.

"[Second] Petition denied," Brunson wrote in the Facebook post. "Moving on to plan C. I will say more about that within the next few days. We have been working long and hard on these strategies and there are more to come."..........

MSN

www.msn.com

 

[MT15]

I don't know what happens, but those leaked text showed the definition of audience capture.

I fear for the future more then most. Demographics, and Republicans unwillingness to change vs overthrowing democracy means we have an insanely high chance of Jan. 6 being a dress rehearsal.

I know people like MT15 don't like to talk about, but everyone should understand, that as a voting block, the people under 40 are vastly more liberal those those over 40. Also, the younger generations are more educated, but have far less money then the older generations at this point in their lives. They are also not converting to conservative ideology, because they have no reason to keep the status quo. As Silents, and Boomers die off, what are Republicans going to do?

Well, if your premise is true there won’t be any more Republicans to worry about, right?

 

[Taurus]

Well, if your premise is true there won’t be any more Republicans to worry about, right?

And yet they'll still win elections. And SCOTUS will have no problem with it.

 

[Optimus Prime]

The blatant and open propagandizing between Republicans and Fox News/Tucker Carlson and right wing media overall is so bad for this country. And it is at critical mass. We literally have a huge swath of our population that is activated by all of these forces (all for the sake of power) and that are throwing our country into a tailspin. The Republican base mentality is highjacked, controlled and compliant to this propaganda and thirst for power as large portions of Russian and Chinese citizens are to their respective leaders and governments.

There’s an app that allows you to take a photo of a large pile of Legos and it will show you different things you can construct. I admittedly haven’t tried it, but the concept is fascinating; the more you give it, the more you can construct. Theoretically, given a big enough pile of Legos, including pieces of hundreds of different sets, you could cobble together pretty much anything.


This is how it works with information, too. The explosion of data and facts and comments and rhetoric has allowed people to cobble together all sorts of things, from intricate explanations of the human condition to the QAnon conspiracy theory.

After all, what is QAnon besides the selective interpretation of various pieces of real-world information? It’s mostly pieces of real things assembled into a deranged narrative. A big pile of facts with plenty of available guides for conspiratorial assembly.


What matters here is the instruction set. If the Lego app only showed you how to make functioning weapons (somehow), our assessment of it would probably be quite different. Who is picking out the pieces controls what is being made.

Which, in a nutshell, is why it’s an extremely bad idea to grant Fox News’s Tucker Carlson the power to construct whatever narrative he wants out of the footage captured at the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021.

House Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) granted Carlson access to tens of thousands of hours of footage from the Capitol, as was first reported by Axios on Monday morning. By Monday evening, Carlson was already teasing his team’s examination of the footage on his Fox News show.

“Some of our smartest producers have been there looking at this stuff and trying to figure out what it means and how it contradicts, or not, the story that we’ve been told for more than two years,” Carlson told his viewers. “We think, already, that in some ways it does contradict that story.”


Well, of course. McCarthy dumped a big pile of Legos in front of the “Conspiracy Theory Constructor” app, and it’s already churning out things that can be built.


Carlson assured his audience that his team was reviewing the footage “as honestly as we can,” which is probably true — but not in the way Carlson means it.

Carlson has an extensive record of making dishonest, unchecked claims on his program, with Fox attorneys even admitting he should not be considered an objective source of information. His false claims include a litany of debunked or unfounded assertions about the Jan. 6 riot…….

The entire point is that — given enough pieces of information, a motivated builder and a credulous audience — you can make whatever argument you want.

Take a cache of emails from a senior official with Hillary Clinton’s 2016 campaign and you can create a conspiracy theory that leads to a guy firing a rifle at a D.C. pizza joint. Take 44,000 hours of footage from the Capitol and who knows what you can cobble together.

To extend the Lego analogy, the most important factor is the app you’re choosing. Right-wing voices, including Carlson, criticized the House select committee for offering a motivated presentation of the riot, with some justification.

Imagine, though, if then-House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) had in 2021 given the Capitol riot footage to Rachel Maddow’s team to evaluate. How might McCarthy have viewed that? Carlson?…….

Loading…

www.washingtonpost.com

 

[coldseat]

There’s an app that allows you to take a photo of a large pile of Legos and it will show you different things you can construct. I admittedly haven’t tried it, but the concept is fascinating; the more you give it, the more you can construct. Theoretically, given a big enough pile of Legos, including pieces of hundreds of different sets, you could cobble together pretty much anything.


This is how it works with information, too. The explosion of data and facts and comments and rhetoric has allowed people to cobble together all sorts of things, from intricate explanations of the human condition to the QAnon conspiracy theory.

After all, what is QAnon besides the selective interpretation of various pieces of real-world information? It’s mostly pieces of real things assembled into a deranged narrative. A big pile of facts with plenty of available guides for conspiratorial assembly.


What matters here is the instruction set. If the Lego app only showed you how to make functioning weapons (somehow), our assessment of it would probably be quite different. Who is picking out the pieces controls what is being made.

Which, in a nutshell, is why it’s an extremely bad idea to grant Fox News’s Tucker Carlson the power to construct whatever narrative he wants out of the footage captured at the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021.

House Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) granted Carlson access to tens of thousands of hours of footage from the Capitol, as was first reported by Axios on Monday morning. By Monday evening, Carlson was already teasing his team’s examination of the footage on his Fox News show.

“Some of our smartest producers have been there looking at this stuff and trying to figure out what it means and how it contradicts, or not, the story that we’ve been told for more than two years,” Carlson told his viewers. “We think, already, that in some ways it does contradict that story.”


Well, of course. McCarthy dumped a big pile of Legos in front of the “Conspiracy Theory Constructor” app, and it’s already churning out things that can be built.


Carlson assured his audience that his team was reviewing the footage “as honestly as we can,” which is probably true — but not in the way Carlson means it.

Carlson has an extensive record of making dishonest, unchecked claims on his program, with Fox attorneys even admitting he should not be considered an objective source of information. His false claims include a litany of debunked or unfounded assertions about the Jan. 6 riot…….

The entire point is that — given enough pieces of information, a motivated builder and a credulous audience — you can make whatever argument you want.

Take a cache of emails from a senior official with Hillary Clinton’s 2016 campaign and you can create a conspiracy theory that leads to a guy firing a rifle at a D.C. pizza joint. Take 44,000 hours of footage from the Capitol and who knows what you can cobble together.

To extend the Lego analogy, the most important factor is the app you’re choosing. Right-wing voices, including Carlson, criticized the House select committee for offering a motivated presentation of the riot, with some justification.

Imagine, though, if then-House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) had in 2021 given the Capitol riot footage to Rachel Maddow’s team to evaluate. How might McCarthy have viewed that? Carlson?…….

Loading…

www.washingtonpost.com

Kevin McCarthy is a complete piece of shirt. He knows exactly what he's doing by giving those tapes to Tucker, of all people. The level of irresponsibility with Republican, and Kevin in particular, in power is really hard to fathom and witness. They're going to burn this whole country to the ground. It's like that is their primary goal.

 

[SFIDC3]

Kevin McCarthy is a complete piece of shirt. He knows exactly what he's doing by giving those tapes to Tucker, of all people. The level of irresponsibility with Republican, and Kevin in particular, in power is really hard to fathom and witness. They're going to burn this whole country to the ground. It's like that is their primary goal.

I agree on McCarthy and most R's....but their primary goal is to stay in power, regardless of the consequences (of which burning the whole country down could be one).....

 

[Optimus Prime]

PHOENIX — Nearly a year after the 2020 election, Arizona’s then-attorney general Mark Brnovich launched an investigation into voting in the state’s largest county that quickly consumed more than 10,000 hours of his staff’s time.

Investigators prepared a report in March 2022 stating that virtually all claims of error and malfeasance were unfounded, according to internal documents reviewed by The Washington Post. Brnovich, a Republican, kept it private.

In April, the attorney general — who was running in the GOP primary for a U.S. Senate seat — released an “Interim Report” claiming that his office had discovered “serious vulnerabilities.” He left out edits from his own investigators refuting his assertions.

His office then compiled an “Election Review Summary” in September that systematically refuted accusations of widespread fraud and made clear that none of the complaining parties — from state lawmakers to self-styled “election integrity” groups — had presented any evidence to support their claims. Brnovich left office last month without releasing the summary.

That timeline emerges from documents released to The Post this week by Brnovich’s successor, Kris Mayes, a Democrat. She said she considered the taxpayer-funded investigation closed and, earlier this month, notified leaders on Maricopa County’s governing board that they were no longer in the state’s crosshairs.

The records show how Brnovich used his office to further claims about voting in Maricopa County that his own staff considered inaccurate. They suggest that his administration privately disregarded fact-checks provided by state investigators while publicly promoting incomplete accounts of the office’s work.

The innuendo and inaccuracies, circulated not just in the far reaches of the internet but with the imprimatur of the state’s attorney general, helped make Arizona an epicenter of distrust in the democratic process, eroding confidence not just in the 2020 vote but in subsequent elections.

Brnovich did not respond to questions about his conduct of the probe, his decision not to release additional documents or differences between his public statements and his office’s private findings...........

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/02/22/arizona-election-fraud-claims-mark-brnovich/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F3931988%2F63f648691b79c61f87a25a16%2F5a0cb1ffade4e230f7038273%2F9%2F72%2F63f648691b79c61f87a25a16&wp_cu=104d64de80476c1556d5d0790213672b%7CC0D737332B174969E0430100007FF0C5

 

[Taurus]

I agree on McCarthy and most R's....but their primary goal is to stay in power, regardless of the consequences (of which burning the whole country down could be one).....

I tend to disagree. I think they've seen what life is like for oligarchs in Russia, they realize how easy it would be to replicate that in the US and how very, very much more power and money they could wield than any Ivan could dream of.

 

[SFIDC3]

I tend to disagree. I think they've seen what life is like for oligarchs in Russia, they realize how easy it would be to replicate that in the US and how very, very much more power and money they could wield than any Ivan could dream of.

US = similar to oligarchy in Russia? would require a burn down of this country...IMO....though we are inching closer to this than I ever dreamed.....the R party has lost it's marbles and will likely become more desperate to cling to power in the coming years.....

 

[MT15]

There’s an app that allows you to take a photo of a large pile of Legos and it will show you different things you can construct. I admittedly haven’t tried it, but the concept is fascinating; the more you give it, the more you can construct. Theoretically, given a big enough pile of Legos, including pieces of hundreds of different sets, you could cobble together pretty much anything.


This is how it works with information, too. The explosion of data and facts and comments and rhetoric has allowed people to cobble together all sorts of things, from intricate explanations of the human condition to the QAnon conspiracy theory.

After all, what is QAnon besides the selective interpretation of various pieces of real-world information? It’s mostly pieces of real things assembled into a deranged narrative. A big pile of facts with plenty of available guides for conspiratorial assembly.


What matters here is the instruction set. If the Lego app only showed you how to make functioning weapons (somehow), our assessment of it would probably be quite different. Who is picking out the pieces controls what is being made.

Which, in a nutshell, is why it’s an extremely bad idea to grant Fox News’s Tucker Carlson the power to construct whatever narrative he wants out of the footage captured at the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021.

House Speaker Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) granted Carlson access to tens of thousands of hours of footage from the Capitol, as was first reported by Axios on Monday morning. By Monday evening, Carlson was already teasing his team’s examination of the footage on his Fox News show.

“Some of our smartest producers have been there looking at this stuff and trying to figure out what it means and how it contradicts, or not, the story that we’ve been told for more than two years,” Carlson told his viewers. “We think, already, that in some ways it does contradict that story.”


Well, of course. McCarthy dumped a big pile of Legos in front of the “Conspiracy Theory Constructor” app, and it’s already churning out things that can be built.


Carlson assured his audience that his team was reviewing the footage “as honestly as we can,” which is probably true — but not in the way Carlson means it.

Carlson has an extensive record of making dishonest, unchecked claims on his program, with Fox attorneys even admitting he should not be considered an objective source of information. His false claims include a litany of debunked or unfounded assertions about the Jan. 6 riot…….

The entire point is that — given enough pieces of information, a motivated builder and a credulous audience — you can make whatever argument you want.

Take a cache of emails from a senior official with Hillary Clinton’s 2016 campaign and you can create a conspiracy theory that leads to a guy firing a rifle at a D.C. pizza joint. Take 44,000 hours of footage from the Capitol and who knows what you can cobble together.

To extend the Lego analogy, the most important factor is the app you’re choosing. Right-wing voices, including Carlson, criticized the House select committee for offering a motivated presentation of the riot, with some justification.

Imagine, though, if then-House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) had in 2021 given the Capitol riot footage to Rachel Maddow’s team to evaluate. How might McCarthy have viewed that? Carlson?…….

Loading…

www.washingtonpost.com

Another false equivalency. Maddow has a definite POV, but she doesn’t peddle lies like Tucker does. When she speculates, she disclaims it as speculation. There’s a definite difference, and all these journalists who pretend there isn’t one are doing is boosting the liars.

 

[MT15]

And yet they'll still win elections. And SCOTUS will have no problem with it.

I don’t think they can approach the level of irrelevance that you guys think they will when people my age die off and still win elections. It just cannot be done. They are already struggling with it - see Arizona and Georgia.

What I do think is that people tend to overestimate the progressiveness of young people. It’s true that the overall percentage of progressives among young people is higher than older folks, but that has always been true. And I see so many young people nowadays embracing the MAGA movement - at least around me. It’s very apparent, especially among young men.

I think anyone who thinks this issue will disappear as people my age die off is in for a very rude awakening. I’m only sad I won’t be around to tell you “told you so”, lol.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Another false equivalency. Maddow has a definite POV, but she doesn’t peddle lies like Tucker does. When she speculates, she disclaims it as speculation. There’s a definite difference, and all these journalists who pretend there isn’t one are doing is boosting the liars.

I don’t think the author is making a literal equivalency but a perception one

I do believe the the right thinks Rachel Maddow is and does what Tucker Carlson actually is and does.

The same way they think of George Soros and Michael Moore the same way we think of the Koch Brothers and Rush Limbaugh

 

[DaveXA]

I don’t think they can approach the level of irrelevance that you guys think they will when people my age die off and still win elections. It just cannot be done. They are already struggling with it - see Arizona and Georgia.

What I do think is that people tend to overestimate the progressiveness of young people. It’s true that the overall percentage of progressives among young people is higher than older folks, but that has always been true. And I see so many young people nowadays embracing the MAGA movement - at least around me. It’s very apparent, especially among young men.

I think anyone who thinks this issue will disappear as people my age die off is in for a very rude awakening. I’m only sad I won’t be around to tell you “told you so”, lol.

Yep, I agree with this. The number of young people embracing the stupid is unfortunately higher than you'd think. It's crazy, kids often emulate the ideology they grew up around, or that of their peers. It was like that when I was younger, and it will continue in the future. Human nature.

 

[DaveXA]

I don’t think the author is making a literal equivalency but a perception one

I do believe the the right thinks Rachel Maddow is and does that Tucker Carlson actually is and does.

The same way they think of George Soros and Michael Moore the same way we think of the Koch Brothers and Rush Limbaugh

Indeed.

 

[coldseat]

I don’t think they can approach the level of irrelevance that you guys think they will when people my age die off and still win elections. It just cannot be done. They are already struggling with it - see Arizona and Georgia.

What I do think is that people tend to overestimate the progressiveness of young people. It’s true that the overall percentage of progressives among young people is higher than older folks, but that has always been true. And I see so many young people nowadays embracing the MAGA movement - at least around me. It’s very apparent, especially among young men.

I think anyone who thinks this issue will disappear as people my age die off is in for a very rude awakening. I’m only sad I won’t be around to tell you “told you so”, lol.

I agree with this too, unfortunately. And now with the Republican MAGA push of indoctrination through the education system, you're going to have a lot of teenagers in Florida and most of these Republican controlled states grow up very poorly educated and manipulated. My question is how isolated or wide spread this will be.

The decline in religious affiliation/adherence is something that I think will continue, so maybe that's a forewarning of a right wing demise.

I also hold out a small bit of hope that at some point, the whole right wing echo system will implode. Only because we live in a country were all of the media isn't a propaganda outfit for the right wing. I thought it would have happened after Jan 6th, but since Republicans chose power over the country and didn't impeach Trump it didn't happen. Maybe it will just take longer.

 

[bird]

I agree with this too, unfortunately. And now with the Republican MAGA push of indoctrination through the education system, you're going to have a lot of teenagers in Florida and most of these Republican controlled states grow up very poorly educated and manipulated. My question is how isolated or wide spread this will be.

The decline in religious affiliation/adherence is something that I think will continue, so maybe that's a forewarning of a right wing demise.

I also hold out a small bit of hope that at some point, the whole right wing echo system will implode. Only because we live in a country were all of the media isn't a propaganda outfit for the right wing. I thought it would have happened after Jan 6th, but since Republicans chose power over the country and didn't impeach Trump it didn't happen. Maybe it will just take longer.

Well, I live by the theory of paranoia. Just because I am paranoid that doesn’t mean they’re not out to get me. Humans are complex yet they seem to want simplistic solutions because admitting to complexity means having to dig deeper and engage in diplomacy and compromise. MAGA is an excellent example. It presumes a simplistic understanding of far and near history. It presumes an automatic supremacy without blemish or error. That is a dream world. The end road of MAGA is destruction.

 

[SamAndreas]

get ready Plan C is on the way

the comments in the facebook post are crazy
======================

Three Trump-supporting brothers are preparing to roll out their "plan C" to reinstate him as president after the United States Supreme Court once again declined to hear their case.

In a Facebook post Tuesday, Raland Brunson—one of the plaintiffs in the case seeking to overturn the result of the 2020 presidential election and reinstall former President Donald Trump in the White House—said the Supreme Court had once again rejected an effort to hear the case, all but ending the already slim chance current President Joe Biden would be removed from the White House.

"[Second] Petition denied," Brunson wrote in the Facebook post. "Moving on to plan C. I will say more about that within the next few days. We have been working long and hard on these strategies and there are more to come."..........

MSN

www.msn.com

Oh deer,

I was fradgade of that, a supine wind driven fradgat.

Probably swarming with sea snakes.