Should we see the removal of statues like George Washington and Thomas Jefferson. (2 Viewers)

[TheRealTruth]

Recently CNN aired an interview where one of the guests suggested what is in the topic.

CNN's Angela Rye: Washington, Jefferson Statues "Need To Come Down"

CNN's Angela Rye called for statues of George Washington and Thomas Jefferson to come down Thursday on the network. "American history is not all glorious... George Washington was a slave owner. We need to call slave owners out for what they are. Whether we think they were protecting American...

www.realclearpolitics.com

I agree with the removal of confederate statues around the country, but should this also be done for founding fathers?

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

again.
these statues were not put up by majority vote or anything close
usually it was a private group funding the construction and placement of these monuments decades after the events they depict
it's political propaganda/mythologizing not a citizenry wishing to commemorate historical events

Ok pay attention to what I am saying. These are statues of people who were famous soldiers before the wat between the states and yes they were confederate soldiers as well. These statues are in most cases over 100 years old and weather you and I like it or not they are part of our history. That history belongs to us all and thank God it’s not up to you to decide the pieces of that history to keep or get rid of. The nations history belongs to every person here and sometimes you might get offended by some of it. Even the government went back and recognized the confederate soldiers as American soldiers. But I guess you think that sucks too. [Mod Edit Rude and inflammatory]

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

None of this has to do with elected representatives in the legislature.

It does when you are answering something that was asked by another member.

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

if we struggle to be better we'll always improve
it we try to be perfect we'll always fail

I totally disagree. Just because you may not achieve perfection doesn’t mean you fail. Settling for good means that you could’ve done better if you had only tried. If you ever played sports at all you’d know that just being good will win you a few games. If that’s what you settle for then fine Trying to achieve perfection even if you come up short of that will guarantee that not only will you win games you will be working your butt off even harder after a loss. I’d bet the farm that every morning Drew wakes up he doesn’t look in the mirror and tell himself that he’s going to be good that day.

 

[samiam5211]

Ok pay attention to what I am saying. These are statues of people who were famous soldiers before the wat between the states and yes they were confederate soldiers as well. These statues are in most cases over 100 years old and weather you and I like it or not they are part of our history. That history belongs to us all and thank God it’s not up to you to decide the pieces of that history to keep or get rid of. The nations history belongs to every person here and sometimes you might get offended by some of it. Even the government went back and recognized the confederate soldiers as American soldiers. But I guess you think that sucks too. [Mod Edit Rude and inflammatory]

They are part of our history. They were erected during the Jim Crow era to remind black people of their place.

That is what these monuments are.

 

[Andrus]

Do not use that "bathing in Biden's bathwater" comment again! Do you not understand what I mean by keep it civil and do not post snide, remarks or partisan triggers that set off partisan bickering?

 

[MT15]

Tony, lets take a look at these statues and memorials and who is removing them. Do you think that cities and owners of these statues and memorials have no right to remove them? I get that you may not like their removal, but the vast majority seem to be being removed by the cities where they reside. I was also curious about how old they were, so I added that information as well.

Here’s a wiki link to the list just recently.

List of monuments and memorials removed during the George Floyd protests - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

If you click on each one, it will tell you when it was erected. So, I can list below the dates I found, in order.

2013, removed by protestors
1905, removed by city
no date given, removed by owner of bust
1953, removed by protestors
1908, removal announced by owner of memorial
1872, plans for removal announced by city
No date given, removal announced by city
1911, removal announced by city
1900, removed by city
no date given, removed by school
1913, removed by city
1898, removed by city
1918, plans for removal announced by county
this one is part of the general removal above in Jacksonville, Florida, no date given
1953, removal approved by vote of county council
giving up, out of time.

So it seems the vast majority are being removed by the local authorities. And a fair number haven’t yet been actually removed. FWIW, I’m fine with these decisions being made, although I’m not a fan of vandalism.

So tell us why you think that the local governing bodies shouldn’t be doing what they are within their rights to do?

 

[GMRfellowtraveller]

Ok pay attention to what I am saying. These are statues of people who were famous soldiers before the wat between the states and yes they were confederate soldiers as well. These statues are in most cases over 100 years old and weather you and I like it or not they are part of our history. That history belongs to us all and thank God it’s not up to you to decide the pieces of that history to keep or get rid of. The nations history belongs to every person here and sometimes you might get offended by some of it. Even the government went back and recognized the confederate soldiers as American soldiers. But I guess you think that sucks too. [Mod Edit Rude and inflammatory]

Would you support a Timothy mcveigh statue?

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

Tony, lets take a look at these statues and memorials and who is removing them. Do you think that cities and owners of these statues and memorials have no right to remove them? I get that you may not like their removal, but the vast majority seem to be being removed by the cities where they reside. I was also curious about how old they were, so I added that information as well.

Here’s a wiki link to the list just recently.

List of monuments and memorials removed during the George Floyd protests - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

If you click on each one, it will tell you when it was erected. So, I can list below the dates I found, in order.

2013, removed by protestors
1905, removed by city
no date given, removed by owner of bust
1953, removed by protestors
1908, removal announced by owner of memorial
1872, plans for removal announced by city
No date given, removal announced by city
1911, removal announced by city
1900, removed by city
no date given, removed by school
1913, removed by city
1898, removed by city
1918, plans for removal announced by county
this one is part of the general removal above in Jacksonville, Florida, no date given
1953, removal approved by vote of county council
giving up, out of time.

So it seems the vast majority are being removed by the local authorities. And a fair number haven’t yet been actually removed. FWIW, I’m fine with these decisions being made, although I’m not a fan of vandalism.

So tell us why you think that the local governing bodies shouldn’t be doing what they are within their rights to do?

They are being removed by the local politicians and that shouldn’t happen. If they are to be removed it should be done by a vote where the citizens decide what is best for their community.

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

Would you support a Timothy mcveigh statue?

No because he was a domestic terrorist. The people who fought in the civil war were recognized as US soldiers. There was a lot more to the civil war than slavery although slavery was high on the list. Would you support taking down statues of Washington and Jefferson? They owned slaves.

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

Research Suggests White Slavery Was Much More Common

Editor's note (3/21/20): For an update on this story, visit: Why is a 16-year-old book on slavery so popular now? A new study suggests that a million or more European Christians were enslaved by Muslims in North Africa between 1530 and 1780 – a far greater number than had ever been...

news.osu.edu

Slavery wasn’t just a black issue even though it was in the US.

 

[Ayo]

They are being removed by the local politicians and that shouldn’t happen. If they are to be removed it should be done by a vote where the citizens decide what is best for their community.

Did you look up the term tyranny of the majority when I pointed it out?

as an American, does they tyranny of the majority not concern you?

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

This is a good article that proves some well known myths about slavery are indeed false. But if you scroll down to the last thing on list you might be surprised.

FACT CHECK: 9 'Facts' About Slavery They Don't Want You to Know

A widely circulated list of historical "facts" about slavery dwells on the participation of non-whites as owners and traders of slaves in America.

www.snopes.com

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

This is a good article that proves some well known myths about slavery are indeed false. But if you scroll down to the last thing on list you might be surprised.

FACT CHECK: 9 'Facts' About Slavery They Don't Want You to Know

A widely circulated list of historical "facts" about slavery dwells on the participation of non-whites as owners and traders of slaves in America.

www.snopes.com

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

Did you look up the term tyranny of the majority when I pointed it out?

as an American, does they tyranny of the majority not concern you?be

To be honest I haven’t looked at your post and I’ve never heard of the term tyranny of the majority. But just guessing until I look it up does it have anything to do with condemning free elections? If it does are you against our election process?

 

[MT15]

They are being removed by the local politicians and that shouldn’t happen. If they are to be removed it should be done by a vote where the citizens decide what is best for their community.

They are elected and represent the people in the town or county. Decisions such as this are exactly their job. This is our system of government at work, I don’t know what else to say about it.

lol, and as I post this you are supporting our election process. You are truly being inconsistent.

 

[Ayo]

To be honest I haven’t looked at your post and I’ve never heard of the term tyranny of the majority. But just guessing until I look it up does it have anything to do with condemning free elections? If it does are you against our election process?

The Founding Fathers wrote about it.

You should invest some time looking into it if you've never heard of it before

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

Ok I looked up the meaning of tyranny of the majority and since it was the first time I had heard of it I understand it now. So if I’m not mistaken the majority in New Orleans is black. So when Mitch Landrieu took down the statues in New Orleans would you agree that it was tyranny of the majority? Would you also agree that it was tyranny of the majority when the mayor of DC renamed an area black lives matter and painted the streets with huge yellow letters spelling out black lives matter?
Like it or not I believe all lives matter and no one is above or below me. I believe in God and he is the only one I’ll ever bow to. But the blm message is lost in the fact that the majority of black people being murdered are killed by other blacks. So with that blacks killing other blacks it seems like it doesn’t matter to them.

 

[Tony1Sainstfan]

They are elected and represent the people in the town or county. Decisions such as this are exactly their job. This is our system of government at work, I don’t know what else to say about it.

lol, and as I post this you are supporting our election process. You are truly being inconsistent.

Not even close. Yes I support the election process and the electoral college. I don’t think two cities should basically determine our elections.