General Election 2024 Harris vs Trump (2 Viewers)

[SamAndreas]

Today it begins, Kamala has reached the point that she's the Democratic Party nominee:

There's video from today. this link has video from her first public appearance since Biden endorsed her:

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/07/22/live-updates-harris-democrats-biden-drops-out-trump-campaign.html

She spent yesterday on the telephone for most of the day. I read that yesterday that she called the party leaders in all 50 states. That would take me three days.

She's renamed her YouTube channel, that's the where to go for video: https://www.youtube.com/@kamalaharris

This is her video on her channel from two hours ago:



To play it, start it, and then move it up to 5:47. This was one of those live videos which don't start at zero.

I've named this thread General Election 2024 Harris vs Trump

Trump needs an introduction post as well, a MAGA suporter ought to write it: @Farb, @SaintForLife , @Others, calling for someone to please introduce your GOP candidate for this 2024 general election thread.

 

[SamAndreas]

If this was true we wouldn't see so much split ticket.

Candidate quality will always matter. I think Harris did a great job with a horrible situation. I'm not going to pretend she didn't have massive flaws, or questionable overall campaign strategy.

I don't know how anyone looks at this and doesn't blame Biden.

I blame you.

 

[zztop]

Democrats usually don't run again. It's done dude.

That and what will "someday" look like 4 years from now? After he, his lackeys and stacked SC has laid waste to everything. There might not be much left of the country to recognize

 

[SamAndreas]

As if SCOTUS couldn't be more forked up, wait until Aileen Cannon is sitting there. That is the direction we are headed in.

The direction we are headed is spinning round and round. The good thing, and bad, is no one knows where it will stop it's spin.

Imagine all the thing which might happen next. A few of them could be good.

 

[SamAndreas]

Democrats usually don't run again. It's done dude.

I'll tell you when it is done.

 

[sailorsaint]

The direction we are headed is spinning round and round. The good thing, and bad, is no one knows where it will stop it's spin.

Imagine all the thing which might happen next. A few of them could be good.

Is there an asteroid hurtling towards us?

I'm calling it for the night. Goodnight democracy, you had a good run.

 

[SamAndreas]

Is there an asteroid hurtling towards us?

I'm calling it for the night. Goodnight democracy, you had a good run.

Of course there is. I can't tell you if it will hit in a year, or a billion years.

 

[DaveXA]

If this was true we wouldn't see so much split ticket.

Candidate quality will always matter. I think Harris did a great job with a horrible situation. I'm not going to pretend she didn't have massive flaws, or questionable overall campaign strategy.

I don't know how anyone looks at this and doesn't blame Biden.

I'm not sure if the lions share of the blame lies with Biden or the DNC, but one of them made the decision to run again. Whoever it was is on the hook for that decision. I think Biden had good intentions, but he should have said he's not running again or the DNC tell him he shouldn't run again. I don't know how it happened, but I always thought him running again was a mistake from day 1. And fwiw, Biden loses even worse if he stays instead of dropping out. They needed a "normal" open primary.

I do agree with candidate quality mattering tho.

 

[RobF]

Me waking up in the UK and rejoining the thread:



This is definitely the darkest timeline.

 

[RobF]

What I will say is I don't think some of the factors I've seen mentioned - candidate, identity politics, etc. - are actually the underlying reason for this.

I think this is very much a product of being in the age of misinformation. It doesn't matter who your candidate is when what too many people learn about them has little connection to who they are in reality. It doesn't matter if your platform isn't about identity politics when too many people will believe that it is whether it is or not.

You need checks and balances: strong levels of critical thinking in the population, objective - not falsely balanced - media that's trusted.

But we haven't got those. So it's psychological warfare and we're all losing.

 

[Bolo]

Harris was by far one of the dumbest candidates I have ever seen enter a general election. Literally everything she did came with strings attached. She wouldn't go on Rogan because she wanted him to fly out to her and she would only do an hour. Bad Look when your opponent and his running mate goes and chills with Rogan for 3 hours. Rogan is huge with minority men and young men voters.

She wanted the mics turned on at the debate, fought tooth and nail but ultimately wasn't successful in doing it. Strings attached

She ducked most of the hostile media outside of the one fox interview with Brett Baier. Trump went into the lions den knowing he'd get interrupted nonstop and took punches to the face. Vance followed into those same interviews.

She looked and sounded horrible every time she had to talk off the cuff, bad look. At least Trump sounds drunk when rambles, Harris sounds like she's on serious drugs.

Kamala comes off incredibly fake, micromanaged, corporate, plastic, she never once looked nor did she sound genuine to me.


All the Democrats had was the abortion issue and January 6th. Most people don't give a crap about January 6th when bags of chips are 6+$. I don't know a single person in the real world that wasn't terminally online who even cared about January 6th anymore in 2024.

 

[The moose]

What I will say is I don't think some of the factors I've seen mentioned - candidate, identity politics, etc. - are actually the underlying reason for this.

I think this is very much a product of being in the age of misinformation. It doesn't matter who your candidate is when what too many people learn about them has little connection to who they are in reality. It doesn't matter if your platform isn't about identity politics when too many people will believe that it is whether it is or not.

You need checks and balances: strong levels of critical thinking in the population, objective - not falsely balanced - media that's trusted.

But we haven't got those. So it's psychological warfare and we're all losing.

This mess is the direct result of the repeal of the fairness doctrine. The exact reason it was installed in the first place was to stop this mess we have. When news outlets are allowed to cater to one political side you have no chance. Critical thinking is learned by seeing two sides.

 

[barbar]

Me waking up in the UK and rejoining the thread:



This is definitely the darkest timeline.

Same in Germany. The USA is lost, IMO.

 

[barbar]

All the Democrats had was the abortion issue and January 6th. Most people don't give a crap about January 6th when bags of chips are 6+$. I don't know a single person in the real world that wasn't terminally online who even cared about January 6th anymore in 2024.

These 2 issues should honestly be enough. Unfortunately half the country doesn't care that Trump incited a riot and tried to stop the transfer of power. They definitely don't care about democracy anymore.

 

[LA - L.A.]

I agree with all of that, but you still ultimately have to look in the mirror and ask why people aren't choosing the Democratic Party platform.

Because they wanted Trump. Full stop. Harris was a better candidate who said and promised better things than Trump. The people that chose Trump didn't care that Harris was better than Trump.

There's this myth that we buy into in our relationship with others that "if we just say and do the right thing, then other people will do what's right or what we want them to do." None of us can control other people. There were no magical words or actions that Harris could have used to make people who chose Trump over her to choose her.

Ever known someone with an addiction issue or who remaining in an abusive relationship? You can reason with them, show them reality of their situation and offer them all the support in the world, but you can't make them let you help them. There's no magical words you can say or actions you can take that will make them do something different. Whether or not they do something different is entirely their choice and there's nothing anyone can do about that other than some type of forced treatment.

Harris doesn't have an option of forcing anyone to vote a certain way. How they vote is each individual's choice and there is nothing magical that Harris or any other candidate can do or say that make people vote a certain way.

Also don't overlook the reality that anything Harris said or did differently that would have gotten some to vote for her instead of Trump could very well cause others who voted for her not to voter for her. Nothing and candidate does or says happens in a vacuum and it all has unintended effects. For instance, if Harris took a harder stance against Israel's atrocious treatment of Palestinians, then I have no doubt she would have lost a substantial amount of votes from people who are Jewish. If she had been less vocal about protecting the rights of LGBTQIA+, she might have gotten some votes she lost to Trump, but I have no doubt she would have also lost votes.

That's true for any issue. There's no different stance that Harris could have taken on any issue that would not have cost her some votes. The only person responsible for how they voted is the individual that voted. No one else is responsible for how a person votes or acts and the blame game is an unproductive waste of time. Assigning blame is only for emotional gratification, and it hinders the ability to be fully open minded and rationally considering all possible solutions.

I'm a believer in personal responsibility,

You are putting all of the responsibility for the actions of others on the candidates and the party. The voters have all of the power over their vote and the only power over their vote. Were is their personal responsibility and accountability for their choices and their actions?

 

[samiam5211]

lol now we fighting about who we nominated…

90 million stupid donut lips voted for Donald
Trump.

This country is about to get what it deserves.

 

[LA - L.A.]

That's what you're going with, that the process was flawed? Are you shirtting me right now?

By every objective measure, Harris is an infinitely better candidate than Trump. I don't give two shirts about how she came to be the nominee. Hilary, Biden, and Kamala were all infinitely better. Only Joe won. That speaks volumes about the misogyny of this country. The biggest thing the Democrats did wrong was run a female candidate because this backward-arse electorate can't get behind a woman in charge.

Everyone with two brain cells to rub together and a 10th-grade education can see that what the Republicans are doing that works for them is lying their arses off and stirring up fear and hate. If that's what wins them elections, this country is even more forked than we thought.

I want to say this as clearly as possible: The Democrats did not lose this election. The fascists won and America lost.

The thing is an old white man, or a rich white man, or a black man, or a gay white man probably would not have gotten all the votes that Harris got.

Too many people make the false assumption that another candidate would have gotten all of the votes that Harris got and then some more.

It very rarely works that way and it's something that can not be known until we figure out time travel and a way to avoid time paradoxes so we can run controlled time experiments in which we go back in time and change just one variable to see the new outcome. Are we able to do that, because I'm pretty sure we aren't able to do that yet?

 

[MT15]

Tariffs are not inherently bad; on the contrary, they are meant to protect national business/manufacturing, and bring prices of foreign goods on a level with prices of U.S. goods.

Back in 2010? the Obama administration put a very high tariff on Chinese tires. China was flooding the U.S. market with extremely cheap tires, and U.S. tire manufacturers could not compete price-wise. The quality of the Chinese tires was pretty much on a par with the cheapo versions of U.S. tires.

How many Chinese car brands are there in the U.S.? I don't remember one. Here in MX, there are 25. MX doesn't have a national brand, all cars manufactured here are either U.S., German, Japanese, or Korean. The Chinese cars still under-cut every other brand in price. They even steal the looks and logos of other brands. (The Chinese even stole the logo for IMSS, the MX social healthcare program, just made it red instead of green).

Can tariffs be abused/mishandled? Sure. But they are not inherently bad.

Trump cannot, and has never said he would, handle tariffs properly. We shouldn’t assume he will grow an ability to do so. He has said repeatedly he will apply them indiscriminately.

 

[LA - L.A.]

If this was true we wouldn't see so much split ticket.

Candidate quality will always matter. I think Harris did a great job with a horrible situation. I'm not going to pretend she didn't have massive flaws, or questionable overall campaign strategy.

I don't know how anyone looks at this and doesn't blame Biden.

Was Harris a better quality candidate than Trump? That was the only choice on the ballot. The choice was not "Harris is perfect" or Trump. It was simply who is better, Harris or Trump. Too many voters chose Trump as a better quality candidate over Harris.