General Election 2024 Harris vs Trump (9 Viewers)

[SamAndreas]

Today it begins, Kamala has reached the point that she's the Democratic Party nominee:

There's video from today. this link has video from her first public appearance since Biden endorsed her:

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/07/22/live-updates-harris-democrats-biden-drops-out-trump-campaign.html

She spent yesterday on the telephone for most of the day. I read that yesterday that she called the party leaders in all 50 states. That would take me three days.

She's renamed her YouTube channel, that's the where to go for video: https://www.youtube.com/@kamalaharris

This is her video on her channel from two hours ago:



To play it, start it, and then move it up to 5:47. This was one of those live videos which don't start at zero.

I've named this thread General Election 2024 Harris vs Trump

Trump needs an introduction post as well, a MAGA suporter ought to write it: @Farb, @SaintForLife , @Others, calling for someone to please introduce your GOP candidate for this 2024 general election thread.

 

[DaveXA]

I know this board leans left. I'm a lifelong Republican but #nevertrump. You folks have to have this feeling/thought process:

How in the EVER LIVING FORK can this race be a toss up? My mind races and races about this thought. I have no answers. I'm 100% serious.

I'm with you. Lifelong conservative and basically independent since Trump was nominated prior to his first election.

That it's even close baffles me.

 

[Lapaz]

I’ve taken breaks here and there but IIRC, Lapaz wanted a brokered convention and wasn’t enthusiastic about Harris. Possible I have that wrong or his view has change.

I think you're trying to discredit my opinion about Biden's comment by pointing out that I wasn't enthusiastic about Harris, which I think is misleading. I was also one of the few posters on here that was strongly against Biden continuing after his disastrous debate, and so some people thought I didn't like Biden. I loved Biden, and wanted him to serve another term, until it became clear to me that he wasn't up to it. Biden's slip-up yesterday reinforces that he needed to be replaced, and was not up for another 4 years. It's true that I wasn't enthusiastic about Harris, and initially I did want a brokered convention in the ideal world, but I quickly recognized that that would be too disruptive and the money wouldn't transfer, so I became a strong advocate for Harris to take over from Biden. I never thought that she was the best possible candidate, but she was the most practical, and I thought she would be a much better candidate than Biden. I was very happy that Harris took over, and she has exceeded my expectations, but she has made numerous mistakes that I believe have prevented her from running away with the race.

Most of the same people that are criticizing my take on Biden's comment said Biden would never step aside and that I was overreacting. At the time, I also didn't expect him to step aside, but I said it would be the best thing for the party. I was right, because Harris has a good chance to win. I may not be right about the impact of Biden's comment if they don't get addressed adequately, but it seems to be getting as much negative attention as I expected. Harris has at least started to address it, but she needs to finish the cleanup. I want her to win, and I view this as constructive and practical criticism.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

Here's trump bringing "Real" Americans together at his rally in NC today!

Yeah, frack that guy!

 

[Lapaz]

I have an answer, you may not like the answer but this is the short version of how I believe we got to this point.

There's a majority of right-wing conservatives that has been, for over 5 decades, conditioned to believe what they are being told by conservative media (Radio & TV) instead of believing with their own eyes and witnessing actual progress.

Despite the fact that the US economy is, IN FACT, the largest, fastest growing economy coming out of the pandemic, right-wing media has convinced their listeners that Bidenomics have failed and we are living in a depression!

Until we stop treating MSM and Right-Wing media as equal entities, these false disillusions will continue.

I agree with you, but the Democratic party also has to take some responsibility. They should've known that Biden wasn't capable of another 4 years and then ran a competitive primary. Biden made some mistakes which have hurt, such as acting too slowly to deal with immigration, and he could've also lowered the tariffs to cut down on inflation. Harris hasn't been able to distance herself adequately from those mistakes. A competitive primary might've resulted in a candidate that was more immune to those mistakes. Harris has gotten better at dealing with that, but it is late in the race, and many have already voted.

 

[Taurus]

LOL WET RED BRICK

Bilirubin. His face is the same color as a poo-stained sphincter.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

I agree with you, but the Democratic party also has to take some responsibility. They should've known that Biden wasn't capable of another 4 years and then ran a competitive primary.

Name the ONE sitting VP that did not come out of the primary as the nominee?

Biden made some mistakes which have hurt, such as acting too slowly to deal with immigration, and he could've also lowered the tariffs to cut down on inflation.

Partially agree. From the moment he sat in the Oval Office, Pres Biden tried to address the immigration crisis the right way and that is charging Congress to do their job. They did not and his efforts died in their hands.

President Biden is sending a bill to Congress on day one to restore humanity and American values to our immigration system. The bill provides hardworking people who enrich our communities every day and who have lived here for years, in some cases for decades, an opportunity to earn citizenship. The legislation modernizes our immigration system, and prioritizes keeping families together, growing our economy, responsibly managing the border with smart investments, addressing the root causes of migration from Central America, and ensuring that the United States remains a refuge for those fleeing persecution. The bill will stimulate our economy while ensuring that every worker is protected. The bill creates an earned path to citizenship for our immigrant neighbors, colleagues, parishioners, community leaders, friends, and loved ones—including Dreamers and the essential workers who have risked their lives to serve and protect American communities.

Fact Sheet: President Biden Sends Immigration Bill to Congress as Part of His Commitment to Modernize our Immigration System | The White House

The U.S. Citizenship Act of 2021 establishes a new system to responsibly manage and secure our border, keep our families and communities safe, and better

www.whitehouse.gov

A competitive primary might've resulted in a candidate that was more immune to those mistakes. Harris has gotten better at dealing with that, but it is late in the race, and many have already voted.

Nope, it is never happened and considering what we have seen, it would not have happen in this case.

 

[Booker]

I know this board leans left. I'm a lifelong Republican but #nevertrump. You folks have to have this feeling/thought process:

How in the EVER LIVING FORK can this race be a toss up? My mind races and races about this thought. I have no answers. I'm 100% serious.

I don't get it. Before Jan 6, call it team sports or whatever, but after that? It's sad and absolutely disgusting that people would rally back around him, and I agree 100% with what Biden had to say about them.

 

[Incumbent]

I think you're trying to discredit my opinion about Biden's comment by pointing out that I wasn't enthusiastic about Harris, which I think is misleading. I was also one of the few posters on here that was strongly against Biden continuing after his disastrous debate, and so some people thought I didn't like Biden. I loved Biden, and wanted him to serve another term, until it became clear to me that he wasn't up to it. Biden's slip-up yesterday reinforces that he needed to be replaced, and was not up for another 4 years. It's true that I wasn't enthusiastic about Harris, and initially I did want a brokered convention in the ideal world, but I quickly recognized that that would be too disruptive and the money wouldn't transfer, so I became a strong advocate for Harris to take over from Biden. I never thought that she was the best possible candidate, but she was the most practical, and I thought she would be a much better candidate than Biden. I was very happy that Harris took over, and she has exceeded my expectations, but she has made numerous mistakes that I believe have prevented her from running away with the race.

Most of the same people that are criticizing my take on Biden's comment said Biden would never step aside and that I was overreacting. At the time, I also didn't expect him to step aside, but I said it would be the best thing for the party. I was right, because Harris has a good chance to win. I may not be right about the impact of Biden's comment if they don't get addressed adequately, but it seems to be getting as much negative attention as I expected. Harris has at least started to address it, but she needs to finish the cleanup. I want her to win, and I view this as constructive and practical criticism.

It wasn’t said to discredit you but to provide some background for how I perceive your opinion of her and her campaign. I know you’ve been frequently critical, and I think that frames your outlook differently.

You’ve insisted this is a big deal with undecideds, which is your prerogative and it might turn out to be, but it’s in advance of any data, and I don’t think you’ve presented anything even anecdotal. Of course you don’t have to.

 

[MT15]

Another day, another Republican 4 Harris:

This is huge because early in the campaign I heard him say he wouldn’t support Harris even though he really disliked Trump. That he didn’t feel she was a good candidate, or something. I was very disappointed in him, and I remembered his lack of support.

Good for him for coming around.

 

[MT15]

I agree with you, but the Democratic party also has to take some responsibility. They should've known that Biden wasn't capable of another 4 years and then ran a competitive primary. Biden made some mistakes which have hurt, such as acting too slowly to deal with immigration, and he could've also lowered the tariffs to cut down on inflation. Harris hasn't been able to distance herself adequately from those mistakes. A competitive primary might've resulted in a candidate that was more immune to those mistakes. Harris has gotten better at dealing with that, but it is late in the race, and many have already voted.

You’re just spinning a narrative again. Biden did what almost nobody thought he could do, lower inflation without initiating a recession. Our economic recovery from the pandemic is the best in the world.

Criticizing his economic efforts is just crazy.

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

I have an answer, you may not like the answer but this is the short version of how I believe we got to this point.

There's a majority of right-wing conservatives that has been, for over 5 decades, conditioned to believe what they are being told by conservative media (Radio & TV) instead of believing with their own eyes and witnessing actual progress.

Despite the fact that the US economy is, IN FACT, the largest, fastest growing economy coming out of the pandemic, right-wing media has convinced their listeners that Bidenomics have failed and we are living in a depression!

Until we stop treating MSM and Right-Wing media as equal entities, these false disillusions will continue.

Edit: Case and point...

trump's whole campaign is based off of the belief that Harris has been POTUS for the past +3 years.

If one Trump voter believes that, then they truly are garbaged brained...

 

[samiam5211]

6 days until we find out of the country's ignorance epidemic is past the point of redemption.

If Trump wins, it isn't Kamala's fault. If he wins, there isn't a candidate that would have beat him. We will just have to accept that the country belongs to GED equivalency four wheeler people.

 

[coldseat]

Yea, I realize the polling can be off, but considering the mountain of evidence/reasons/etc. to distance oneself from the former President, he still commands almost half the population of America. We are not talking "fringe group" numbers. We are talking 10's of millions of people.

I can type this thought and be almost 100% certain it would hold true - No October surprise could derail the Trump train. He is so locked in with his base that a video of him sacrificing a baby on the alter of the devil would lose him one vote. This is obviously an exaggeration, but you get the point I'm trying to make.

The answer is simple. There is an entire media apparatus (national tv, local tv, print, radio, bloggers, podcasters, influencers, etc.) dedicated solely to promoting Republican and right wing propaganda. It's created this distortion in our society where 40% of the population lives in this alternate reality of propaganda, 30% tune out of what's going on because of all of the drama, and the other 30% of our country is actively fighting against it. You add to that what has become of traditional media, where the only thing that matters is what sells and sensationalizes, and it's created a real shirt show in our country. There are depressingly few entities that are advocating for a society that's rational and factually infomed so that they can make good decisions for the country.

 

[Lapaz]

It wasn’t said to discredit you but to provide some background for how I perceive your opinion of her and her campaign. I know you’ve been frequently critical, and I think that frames your outlook differently.

You’ve insisted this is a big deal with undecideds, which is your prerogative and it might turn out to be, but it’s in advance of any data, and I don’t think you’ve presented anything even anecdotal. Of course you don’t have to.

I'm frequently critical, but also frequently complimentary. I try to be objective. Many on here seem to think any criticism is treachery. I think it is needed to improve.

Regarding similar anecdotes, I pointed out that I heard a couple of interviews of Puerto Ricans that complained that Trump waited 2 days before his campaign distanced themselves from the comic, and had decided to support Harris, and that the campaign has gotten a lot of flak. I also pointed out that a non-partisan Puerto Rican group just endorsed Harris because of it, and they had never endorsed. My point has been since the first post on this topic is that this will hurt the campaign and neuter the comic's damage unless she quickly repudiated it. She did that this morning, but then lost some ground by not answering the question about how the voters would feel.

I know that Trump has attacked many Americans, but that's accepted by his voters, but some of the wafflers are still up for grabs. It may not have any affect, but the pollster Frank Luntz was just on CNN saying that he thinks it will drive turnout. I was more concerned that it might lower turnout for Harris among the wafflers, but it may also motivate some people to vote for Trump. That's why she needs to finish cleaning up the mess that Biden created. Whether it is fair or not, or whether I can prove it or not, it is best not to take the risk. If we wait for polls to prove it, it'll be far too late. I think it is just sensible to finish cleaning it up. Just say she understands why they would be offended. She could also add that Trump has attacked many Americans too, but she doesn't roll that way.

 

[Lapaz]

You’re just spinning a narrative again. Biden did what almost nobody thought he could do, lower inflation without initiating a recession. Our economic recovery from the pandemic is the best in the world.

Criticizing his economic efforts is just crazy.

You're latching on to a throw-away comment that I added, but I'm not spinning. I agree that Biden did great with the economy. The Chips Act and the inflation reduction act were very effective. The economy is very good, and I've said that many times. However, I don't think it is wrong to point out that Biden could've removed the tariffs which would've helped reduce inflation a little. It's also probably the case that the stimulus packages by both Trump and Biden pushed inflation higher than they would have otherwise risen. I know high inflation was inevitable coming out of the pandemic, but Biden could've helped on the margins with a smaller stimulus package. Nevertheless, inflation is low today, and wages are outpacing inflation, but people are stuck in their anger and perception that the economy is terrible due to the previous inflation. Harris should be able to deal with it by pointing out that wages are rising faster than inflation and that inflation is now low again. She should also point out that the only way to reduce prices is with a recession, but the better option is to keep raising wages, which is her approach. This is her challenge as a member of the incumbent administration.

 

[Bayouboy]

The answer is simple. There is an entire media apparatus (national tv, local tv, print, radio, bloggers, podcasters, influencers, etc.) dedicated solely to promoting Republican and right wing propaganda. It's created this distortion in our society where 40% of the population lives in this alternate reality of propaganda, 30% tune out of what's going on because of all of the drama, and the other 30% of our country is actively fighting against it. You add to that what has become of traditional media, where the only thing that matters is what sells and sensationalize, and it's created a real shirt show in our country. There are depressingly few entities that are advocating for a society that's rational and factually infomed so that they can make good decisions for the country.

I just finished the latest season of Slow Burn (podcast) and the series was about the rise of Fox News. Very applicable to your response.

 

[coldseat]

On the economy, which I'm constantly told by polls of voters is the most important topic.

Economics professor: Facts keep interfering with Trump’s talking points about the economy | CNN Business

University of Michigan professor of economics Justin Wolfers, who is one of the 400 economists backing Kamala Harris’ candidacy, says the facts about the US economy “interfere” with Donald Trump’s claims about the economy.

www.cnn.com

 

[J-DONK]

6 days until we find out of the country's ignorance epidemic is past the point of redemption.

If Trump wins, it isn't Kamala's fault. If he wins, there isn't a candidate that would have beat him. We will just have to accept that the country belongs to GED equivalency four wheeler people.

I understand your overall sentiment. Kamala really has done everything asked of her. She left it all out on the field as the saying goes.

However, if Kamala loses I put that on Joe not dropping out and giving us a primary. A combo of Whitmer/Sharpio with either leading the ticket would have made the blue wall impenetrable.

I do think she is going to win though.