First presidential debate (2 Viewers)

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    Optimus Prime

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    Since we usually have a separate thread for these
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    NEW YORK (AP) — President Joe Biden begins an intense period of private preparations Friday at Camp David for what may be the most consequential presidential debate in decades.

    The 81-year-old Democrat’s team is aware that he cannot afford an underwhelming performance when he faces Republican rival Donald Trump for 90 minutes on live television Thursday night. Biden’s team is expecting aggressive attacks on his physical and mental strength, his record on the economy and immigration and even his family.

    Trump, 78 and ever confident, will stay on the campaign trail before going to his Florida estate next week for two days of private meetings as part of an informal prep process.

    The former president’s allies are pushing him to stay focused on his governing plans, but they’re expecting him to be tested by pointed questions about his unrelenting focus on election fraud, his role in the erosion of abortion rights and his unprecedented legal baggage.

    Thursday’s debate on CNN will be full of firsts, with the potential to reshape the presidential race. Never before in the modern era have two presumptive nominees met on the debate stage so early in the general election season. Never before have two White House contenders faced off at such advanced ages, with widespread questions about their readiness.

    And never before has a general election debate participant been saddled with a felony conviction. The debate-stage meeting comes just two weeks before Trump is scheduled to be sentenced on 34 felony counts in his New York hush money trial.

    “You can argue this will be the most important debate, at least in my lifetime,” said Democratic strategist Jim Messina, 54, who managed former President Barack Obama’s 2012 campaign.

    PRESSURE ON BIDEN


    The ground rules for Thursday’s debate, the first of two scheduled meetings, are unusual.

    The candidates agreed to meet at a CNN studio in Atlanta with no audience. Each candidate’s microphone will be muted, except when it’s his turn to speak. No props or prewritten notes will be allowed onstage. The candidates will be given only a pen, a pad of paper and a bottle of water.

    There will be no opening statements. A coin flip determined that Biden would stand at the podium to the viewer’s right, while Trump would deliver the final closing statement.


    The next debate won’t be until September. Any stumbles Thursday will be hard to erase or replace quickly.………..

     
    Nobody has come up with a very compelling scenario that it isn’t too late.

    My concern is that we’ll take this to a contested convention, fight it out to pick a winner in front of America, missing completely on the biggest event to contrast Trump and MAGA and to showcase a nominee and their accomplishments and platform, emerge splintered, and then scramble to unify and regain ground over four months.

    Starting to think Mt15 was right, if they have to go in a different direction, it’s probably best for Biden to step down, let Harris assume the presidency, and hope all the competing interests within the Democratic ranks don’t object to her and **** this up.

    I agree Momala is probably the easiest, and safest choice forward. I personally don't see a lot of downside. I find it hard to believe there are any "Biden or Bust" people out there.

    If I would wave a magic wand, I would pick Whitmer/Shapiro for the EC advantage. That's MI + PA. You only need WI to get to 270.

    I imagine there are party insiders talking about that second option as well.
     
    I agree Momala is probably the easiest, and safest choice forward. I personally don't see a lot of downside. I find it hard to believe there are any "Biden or Bust" people out there.

    If I would wave a magic wand, I would pick Whitmer/Shapiro for the EC advantage. That's MI + PA. You only need WI to get to 270.

    I imagine there are party insiders talking about that second option as well.

    Yeah, I like the thought but can’t see it working in a real scenario.
     
    I'm not sure if I'm for it or not yet. I've only seen some bullet points and haven't really looked into it yet. I understand why the left is familiar with it.

    In general, I'm for reducing the size of government and spending, eliminating any unnecessary agencies, and anything that will rein in the out of control federal government.

    Something has to be done with 35 trillion in debt and us supporting multiple wars.

    Why do you think the Biden administration forgot to charge Trump with participating in a coup?

    First, if you're "not sure" whether you're for or against Project 2025, you may need to be more demanding of your tribe. After all, don't you want to know what "you" stand for?

    Second, you surely realize the GOP has no interest in reducing the size of government or the deficit. The main difference between the parties has nothing to do with what you say, and is mainly about which constituencies the government is going to favor. "Something has to be done with 35 trillion in debt" - please. I could give you a hard question and ask the last GOP administration that actually knocked the debt down in any substantial way. Instead, I'll ask you to name me a GOP administration that didn't significantly add to the debt.

    Third, the Biden administration didn't "forget" to charge Trump because the Biden administration remembered it's not supposed to be dictating policy to the DOJ. The J6 congressional hearing tells us all we need to know, criminal prosecutions or not.

    But I'm guessing you're in the camp that think what happened on J6 was "no big deal."
     


    In 2024, after Biden was seen wandering around at the G7, Raskin claimed that Biden's age was bringing solidarity to the world.
     


    In 2024, after Biden was seen wandering around at the G7, Raskin claimed that Biden's age was bringing solidarity to the world.

    Being unfit because of age and being unfit because you are and always have been mentally incompetent are two different things.

    So we can put you on board for a mental fitness test for Presidential candidates? I'll sign on if you do - Biden might fail at this point, but Trump will definitely fail. Your party doesn't care about "mental fitness."
     
    On stage stood the two oldest presidential candidates the country has seen.

    President Joe Biden, 81, stood to the right. It was supposed to be a night where he reassured voters that he, already America’s oldest president, is up for another four years. His campaign hoped the night would dispel fears about him being closer to 100 than 50.

    He did anything but. Biden mumbled, stumbled and rambled throughout the 90-minute debate leaving the world stunned at the performance.

    On the left was 77-year-old former president Donald Trump. He spoke crisply, authoritatively and didn’t get sucked into his usual name-calling that has become a trademark of his political career. He was on stage to take on the ‘worst president ever’ and show he was ready for another term.

    But he lied nonstop. Trump blabbered on, refusing to answer questions and spewing lies that have become trademarks of his 2024 campaign. Yet, for some reason, the media — and the world — only care about one half of the equation.

    Donors, media pundits, editorial boards and even 11 House Democrats so far have called on the president to drop out of the race. In the post-debate frenzy, through his energetic, passionate interviews and rallies, Biden has tried to eclipse his tired performance. Still, calls for him to step aside have only grown louder.

    But no one is talking about Trump - and he is escaping accountability.……..

     
    On stage stood the two oldest presidential candidates the country has seen.

    President Joe Biden, 81, stood to the right. It was supposed to be a night where he reassured voters that he, already America’s oldest president, is up for another four years. His campaign hoped the night would dispel fears about him being closer to 100 than 50.

    He did anything but. Biden mumbled, stumbled and rambled throughout the 90-minute debate leaving the world stunned at the performance.

    On the left was 77-year-old former president Donald Trump. He spoke crisply, authoritatively and didn’t get sucked into his usual name-calling that has become a trademark of his political career. He was on stage to take on the ‘worst president ever’ and show he was ready for another term.

    But he lied nonstop. Trump blabbered on, refusing to answer questions and spewing lies that have become trademarks of his 2024 campaign. Yet, for some reason, the media — and the world — only care about one half of the equation.

    Donors, media pundits, editorial boards and even 11 House Democrats so far have called on the president to drop out of the race. In the post-debate frenzy, through his energetic, passionate interviews and rallies, Biden has tried to eclipse his tired performance. Still, calls for him to step aside have only grown louder.

    But no one is talking about Trump - and he is escaping accountability.……..

    The only reason the D's are in disarray is because we know our country is at a crossroad right now, and know the moment is extremely important. We also know that there are tens of millions like SFL who either welcome what's coming down the tracks (whether they'll regret it later or not), or think it's a joke (again, whether they'll regret it later or not).
     
    On stage stood the two oldest presidential candidates the country has seen.

    President Joe Biden, 81, stood to the right. It was supposed to be a night where he reassured voters that he, already America’s oldest president, is up for another four years. His campaign hoped the night would dispel fears about him being closer to 100 than 50.

    He did anything but. Biden mumbled, stumbled and rambled throughout the 90-minute debate leaving the world stunned at the performance.

    On the left was 77-year-old former president Donald Trump. He spoke crisply, authoritatively and didn’t get sucked into his usual name-calling that has become a trademark of his political career. He was on stage to take on the ‘worst president ever’ and show he was ready for another term.

    But he lied nonstop. Trump blabbered on, refusing to answer questions and spewing lies that have become trademarks of his 2024 campaign. Yet, for some reason, the media — and the world — only care about one half of the equation.

    Donors, media pundits, editorial boards and even 11 House Democrats so far have called on the president to drop out of the race. In the post-debate frenzy, through his energetic, passionate interviews and rallies, Biden has tried to eclipse his tired performance. Still, calls for him to step aside have only grown louder.

    But no one is talking about Trump - and he is escaping accountability.……..

    Trump is betting that enough American voters are rubes, period.
     
    This came out today.


    I want to see the Democratic Party hold four historic town halls between now and the Democratic National Convention in August — one each in the South, the Northeast, the Midwest and the West. We can recruit the two most obvious and qualified people in the world to facilitate substantive discussions: Barack Obama and Bill Clinton. They may not represent every faction under our party’s big tent. But they care as much about our democracy as our nation’s first president, they understand what it takes to be president, and they know how to win.

    Town halls — high-stakes job interviews for the toughest job in the world — would surely attract television and cable partners and generate record numbers of viewers. Think the Super Bowl with Taylor Swift in the stands. The young, the old and everyone in between will tune in to see history being made in real time.

    How will potential nominees be chosen to participate in the town halls? There is no answer here that will satisfy everyone, but hard choices must be made, given the tight timetable, and I think leaning on the input of former presidents makes good sense. So I would advise Presidents 42 and 44 to select eight leading contenders out of the pool of those who choose to run, with Ms. Harris most definitely getting a well-earned invite.

    I believe the vice president would be a formidable opponent for Mr. Trump. She has spent the past four years crisscrossing the country and the globe, serving the American people. She has a hell of a story — one that more people should know. She stood up for ordinary Americans against big banks. She locked up sexual predators. You want the prosecutor, or you want the criminal? Not the worst question to put to the American public this November.

    Maybe Presidents 42 and 44 can make the candidate selection even more democratic by consulting the nation’s 23 Democratic governors in the town hall selection process. Governors deal in the practical, not the theoretical. But I’m not a details guy. I say we leave it up to 42 and 44.

    To be clear, we have a lot more than eight Democrats who could beat the pants off Mr. Trump. But if we don’t limit the town halls to a manageable number of people, we’ll get sound bites, not substance.

    Town halls will give Americans a fresh look at Ms. Harris and introduce them to our deep bench of smart, dynamic, tested leaders. In addition, Democratic delegates will get to further grill and stress-test these leaders in public and private meetings before a formal vote of all the delegates at the Democratic convention.

    A word about those delegates: I trust them to reach a majority decision at the convention after a public and substantive process like this one, and you should, too. Sure, we’ve got some folks on the fringes, God love ’em. But an overwhelming majority of Democratic delegates are pragmatic patriots. They work hard and care deeply about their communities and our country. They come from small towns and big cities and everywhere in between.
     
    First, if you're "not sure" whether you're for or against Project 2025, you may need to be more demanding of your tribe. After all, don't you want to know what "you" stand for?
    I just made a post on it in the Project 2025 thread.
    Second, you surely realize the GOP has no interest in reducing the size of government or the deficit. The main difference between the parties has nothing to do with what you say, and is mainly about which constituencies the government is going to favor. "Something has to be done with 35 trillion in debt" - please. I could give you a hard question and ask the last GOP administration that actually knocked the debt down in any substantial way. Instead, I'll ask you to name me a GOP administration that didn't significantly add to the debt.
    I agree 100% that the establishment wing of the Republican Party has zero interest in reducing the size and spending of government. The establishment Republicans only care about the debt when they aren't in power.

    There aren't many Republicans who do support reducing the size and spending of the government, but those who do like Rep Massie I fully support.
    Third, the Biden administration didn't "forget" to charge Trump because the Biden administration remembered it's not supposed to be dictating policy to the DOJ. The J6 congressional hearing tells us all we need to know, criminal prosecutions or not.
    That's funny that you can type that with the Biden administration and Democrat prosecutors trying to jail Biden's political opponent.

    Are you saying the only reason why Trump didn't get charged with participating in a coup was because the Biden administration didn't direct his DOJ to prosecute him?

    For as many times as Democrats repeat over and over that Trump participated in a coup, I've yet to see one credible reason why Trump wasnt charged for it.

    It reminds me about when Mueller included the supposed instances of obstruction, but the Democrats forgot to put one single obstruction charge in the impeachment.

    It seems like the Democrats know they can't prove their hyperbolic claims in court.

    January 6th committee? Soviet style show trial is more like it.


    It was Goldston who envisioned this as a miniseries"
    "We knew how high the stakes were. We were either going to make people realize that this was important or once you've lost them you've lost them for good."


    But I'm guessing you're in the camp that think what happened on J6 was "no big deal."
    Not at all. I think it was a horrible day in our history and anyone who committed any violence should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Having said that, it's obvious and transparent that the Democrats and the media have greatly exaggerated the threat for political reasons.

    They over prosecuted many people who were nonviolent protesters by turning misdemeanors into felonies by incorrectly using laws that were passed to deal with a financial crisis.
     
    No, it’s just he will go with whoever says what he wants to hear. And he wants Biden out very badly, it seems. I think Trump does too.
    Confirmation bias wants its fix, and propaganda is a hell of a drug.
     
    I agree 100% that the establishment wing of the Republican Party has zero interest in reducing the size and spending of government. The establishment Republicans only care about the debt when they aren't in power.
    What on earth gives you the idea that Trump has any real interest in the above? His record shows the exact opposite.
     
    This is all well and good, although I am queasy about Harris being passed over and the political consequences of that. But does he say how he proposes to get Biden to step aside?

    It’s just words if Biden doesn’t step aside.

    He starts the piece with this:

    Mark my words: Joe Biden is going to be out of the 2024 presidential race. Whether he is ready to admit it or not. His pleas on Monday to congressional Democrats for support will not unite the party behind him. Mr. Biden says he’s staying in the race, but it’s only a matter of time before Democratic pressure and public and private polling lead him to exit the race.
     

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