First presidential debate (2 Viewers)

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    Optimus Prime

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    Since we usually have a separate thread for these
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    NEW YORK (AP) — President Joe Biden begins an intense period of private preparations Friday at Camp David for what may be the most consequential presidential debate in decades.

    The 81-year-old Democrat’s team is aware that he cannot afford an underwhelming performance when he faces Republican rival Donald Trump for 90 minutes on live television Thursday night. Biden’s team is expecting aggressive attacks on his physical and mental strength, his record on the economy and immigration and even his family.

    Trump, 78 and ever confident, will stay on the campaign trail before going to his Florida estate next week for two days of private meetings as part of an informal prep process.

    The former president’s allies are pushing him to stay focused on his governing plans, but they’re expecting him to be tested by pointed questions about his unrelenting focus on election fraud, his role in the erosion of abortion rights and his unprecedented legal baggage.

    Thursday’s debate on CNN will be full of firsts, with the potential to reshape the presidential race. Never before in the modern era have two presumptive nominees met on the debate stage so early in the general election season. Never before have two White House contenders faced off at such advanced ages, with widespread questions about their readiness.

    And never before has a general election debate participant been saddled with a felony conviction. The debate-stage meeting comes just two weeks before Trump is scheduled to be sentenced on 34 felony counts in his New York hush money trial.

    “You can argue this will be the most important debate, at least in my lifetime,” said Democratic strategist Jim Messina, 54, who managed former President Barack Obama’s 2012 campaign.

    PRESSURE ON BIDEN


    The ground rules for Thursday’s debate, the first of two scheduled meetings, are unusual.

    The candidates agreed to meet at a CNN studio in Atlanta with no audience. Each candidate’s microphone will be muted, except when it’s his turn to speak. No props or prewritten notes will be allowed onstage. The candidates will be given only a pen, a pad of paper and a bottle of water.

    There will be no opening statements. A coin flip determined that Biden would stand at the podium to the viewer’s right, while Trump would deliver the final closing statement.


    The next debate won’t be until September. Any stumbles Thursday will be hard to erase or replace quickly.………..

     
    A group that can't be ignored...

    1720728294551.png
    They say they can't vote for Trump and they are concerned about voting for Biden. It sounds like they may not vote for Biden, but they also aren't voting for Trump. If Trump doesn't get the vote of the Republicans who voted for Haley, he can't win.

    Trump needs those votes worse than Biden does.
     
    If Biden exits, he gets to negotiate his terms.
    No, he doesn't. That's not how it works at all. Some state laws require their delegates to vote for the candidate that won the primary in their state for a certain number of voting rounds, even if that candidate has withdrawn from the race. There's nothing Biden or the Democratic party can do to get around that legal obligation that delegates from those sates have.

    If he does press forward, you will hear soft whimpers, and crying from the halls of Congress though.
    What will we hear from you?
     
    No, he doesn't. That's not how it works at all. Some state laws require their delegates to vote for the candidate that won the primary in their state for a certain number of voting rounds, even if that candidate has withdrawn from the race. There's nothing Biden or the Democratic party can do to get around that legal obligation that delegates from those sates have.

    This has nothing to do with negotiating your resignation.
     
    Might feel like splitting hairs to you but there are a couple of points I think we are understanding differently. I didn’t say growing sentiment, I said a growing number of Christofascist politicians are winning elections. I think their popularity with voters in certain places is the result of tapping into beliefs that already existed. I think the relationship between Christianity and fascism has been simmering a long time in this country.
    Fascists always have to gain a little bit of power, before people take their threat seriously. The key is how we respond when they make it clear they are a threat. The UK, France and Germany have stepped up. The Netherlands, not so much yet. It's time for us to step up and I literally mean every single one of us who can legally vote.

    Don't think they have to stop them, think I have to stop them. Our vote is the most powerful tool we have to stop the fascists.
     
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    I'm Thunderstruck, I just saw 9 New York Times headlines which were descriptive, not snarky. That's significant editorial shift happening there over 24 hours.

     
    I wonder at least a little bit if the "elites" comment by Biden was actually a reference to Obama considering what apparently is going on behind the scenes.

    He said that, and then called on his strongest support: The Black Caucus. It was a desperate play to portray the division as rich white guys vs minorities.


    “Team Biden made it clear what their strategy was: ignore the problem, run out the clock, and force the rest of us to live with it,” said Rep. Adam Smith (D-Wash.), who has publicly called on Biden to step aside. “I felt a certain urgency to upset that strategy.”

    To stem the debate backlash, Biden quickly staged a phone call with members of the Congressional Black Caucus (CBC), perhaps his strongest support base in the Capitol, but not other groups or the full Democratic Caucus.

    Pelosi, some Democrats said, is giving voice to other lawmakers who felt like the decision regarding Biden’s future was being rammed down their throats without a chance to weigh in.

    “Pelosi speaks for the sense that, if you’re going to circle the wagons, you need a lot more wagons in the circle,” said a third Democratic lawmaker familiar with her efforts. “You have to have a real conversation with people to decide it all together. And you can’t present people with a judgment.”
     
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    This has nothing to do with negotiating your resignation.
    You implied that while negotiating his resignation, Biden could make Harris as his replacement happen as seen below:

    If Biden exits, he gets to negotiate his terms. If he wants Harris, that's what will happen.​

    Biden can not make Harris happen as his replacement, so my comment has everything to do with what you said. You're flat out wrong in what you implied.

    Virtually every opinion you state on this issue is false and not grounded in reality at all.
     
    You implied that while negotiating his resignation, Biden could make Harris as his replacement happen as seen below:



    Biden can not make Harris happen as his replacement, so my comment has everything to do with what you said. You're flat out wrong in what you implied.

    Virtually every opinion you state on this issue is false and not grounded in reality at all.

    He can absolutely negotiate that as part of his terms. Please educate yourself, and stop arguing over the internet.

    Read this and just be quiet.

     
    Maybe a gaffe, maybe his meds are wearing off and it’s why the press conference is delayed.
    Every single grandparent, great uncle, great aunt, parent, uncle and aunt I've mixed up their own children's names throughout their lives and it happened more frequently the older they got. The majority of them never had any type of neurological condition or any kind of actual cognitive decline.

    Who hasn't experienced that in their family?
     
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    Every single grandparent, great uncle, great aunt, parent, uncle and aunt I've mixed up their own children's names throughout their lives and it happened more frequently the older they got. The majority of them never had any type of neurological condition or any kind of actual cognitive decline.

    Who has experienced that in their family?

    I do it all the time. I am not declining cognitively.
     
    #President Joe Biden and #Listen to him, are both trending on Twitter. They are Biden positive stuff.

    In my home feed there are also loads of very positive comments.

    Folks at home clearly saw tonight's presser as a Biden positive.

    Folks are riding with Biden again.
     
    He can absolutely negotiate that as part of his terms. Please educate yourself...
    I am fully educated my friend. You're the one who's only partially educated.

    It's a fact that some states require their delegates to vote for the winner of that states primary for a certain number of rounds of voting, even if the candidate withdraws from the race. Nothing you or anyone says changes that fact. Those delegates have no choice but to vote for Biden for a certain number of voting rounds.

    Nothing in the article you posted refutes that truth. Nothing.

    It's also a fact that some states don't have those requirements. Biden could negotiate with delegates from those states, but there's no guarantee that they will all agree to Biden's terms, so there's not guarantee that Harris would win the nomination.

    ...and stop arguing over the internet.
    Why me? Why not you?

    And for the record, I've never pitched a hissy fit asking you to bow out of this thread or stop arguing with me. That's all you, my brother. Unlike you, I have no need to ask you to go away.

    I'm perfectly comfortable and confident with you arguing with me. I'm staying right here and will keep arguing over the internet as I see fit. If you don't like that, well, you can always stop coming here. I hope you don't, but you could.

    ...just be quiet.
    Who's really the one telling people to shut up?

    Every accusation is a confession.
     
    He can absolutely negotiate that as part of his terms. Please educate yourself, and stop arguing over the internet.

    Read this and just be quiet.

    I read that article front to back, a good article btw.

    It doesn't back your statement up. It describes what LA -LA, I, and Dragon have said, with more details and 12 years newer information than I had to work with.

    Biden can suggest what he would like the delegates do, but he can't negotiate from a position of power.
     
    Exactly how does that work? Once he releases his delegates, they can vote for whoever they want, can they not? I mean, he could ask them to vote for Harris, but I don’t know of a way to force them to.
    You're correct.

    It doesn't work like he's saying it does. Some delegates are legally obligated by their state's laws to vote for Biden for a certain number of rounds of voting, because Biden won their state's primary. They have to do that even if Biden withdraws from the race. No one can release those delegates from their legal obligation, except maybe their state, but they have to change their laws to make an exception.

    The delegates that are legally bound by their states to vote for the primary winner in their state are free to vote how they want if Biden withdraws, but Biden can not make them vote for anyone.

    He can try to negotiate an agreement with those delegates, but there's no guarantee they will reach an agreement with Biden, there's no guarantee the delegates would be bound by that agreement, and there's no guarantee that would give Harris enough votes to win the nomination.

    It's just more, "this is the fantasy I want, so I'm going to believe it's true while ignoring to hear anything about the actual reality of the situation."
     
    I'm not sure this was posted. Obama didn't endorse Clooney's letter, but he didn't discourage it either.
    Obama's a wise man for choosing to stay out of it.

    It doesn't change the fact that Obama is still supporting Biden and it's unlikely that he would if Biden was in the condition some people say he's in.

    That's just good old common sense that doesn't require a whole bunch of mental gymnastics and illogical pretzeling to do.

    Occam's razor all the way baby. The simplest explanation is more often than not, the correct explanation.
     
    I read that article front to back, a good article btw.

    It doesn't back your statement up. It describes what LA -LA, I, and Dragon have said, with more details and 12 years newer information than I had to work with.

    Biden can suggest what he would like the delegates do, but he can't negotiate from a position of power.

    You missed the part that talked about the delegates being loyal to Biden. That's why he can negotiate his exit.

    This is not even up for debate. It's why people say Biden can gets decide if there is an open primary or if Harris takes over. It's his decision because of that fact.

    I won't argue you with you and LA-LA on this. You are wrong if you don't agree.
     

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