All Things LGBTQ+ (3 Viewers)

[Farb]

Didn't really see a place for this so I thought I would start a thread about all things LGBTQ since this is a pretty hot topic in our culture right now

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/sup...y-that-refuses-to-work-with-lgbt-couples.html

• The Supreme Court on Thursday delivered a unanimous defeat to LGBT couples in a high-profile case over whether Philadelphia could refuse to contract with a Roman Catholic adoption agency that says its religious beliefs prevent it from working with same-sex foster parents.
• Chief Justice John Roberts wrote in an opinion for a majority of the court that Philadelphia violated the First Amendment by refusing to contract with Catholic Social Services once it learned that the organization would not certify same-sex couples for adoption.

I will admit, I was hopeful for this decision by the SCOTUS but I was surprised by the unanimous decision.

While I don't think there is anything wrong, per se, with same sex couples adopting and raising children (I actually think it is a good thing as it not an abortion) but I also did not want to see the state force a religious institution to bend to a societal norm.

 

[Farb]

Lol, I've never championed identity politics. You love to go on tangents when your original argument isn't going well.

But also, this is different. This is more a tactic of creating schism in a group that shares the same identity with the purpose of weakening said group.

So a trans person shares the same identity of as a gay man? Do you also think men can give birth? If not, then the schism is not created but exist naturally. When we point it out, we are bigots but as a cis white guy, we are usually lumped together for the sake of identity politics. Why is that? Because we share a the same identity? For someone who never champions identity politics, you sure do follow it.

 

[Farb]

Slavery was common throughout most cultures in history.

If you can't come up with something better than that's how it's always been to justify something, then you aren't really justifying it.

Are all values from the past that were common now unjustifiable or are there some values from our past that are still needed today?

 

[CoolBrees]

If you as the spouse, don't consider that betrayal, then your marriage was a sham from the very beginning.

Are you married?

 

[Farb]

Are you married?

I am not. You?
I am also comfortably single and not looking for anything at the moment, but I am flattered though.

 

[CoolBrees]

Yep. 15 years.

I was just wondering your lens to make such a comment on their marriage

 

[coldseat]

So a trans person shares the same identity of as a gay man? Do you also think men can give birth? If not, then the schism is not created but exist naturally.

What are you even taking about? If we're discussing the LGBTQ community, then G and T are both in the acronym. So yes, it's a shared identity. You really are throwing everything at the kitchen sink.

When we point it out, we are bigots but as a cis white guy, we are usually lumped together for the sake of identity politics. Why is that? Because we share a the same identity? For someone who never champions identity politics, you sure do follow it.

Again, what are you talking about? This doesn't even follow with your previous statement. In your first statement your trying to force divisions in LGBTQ and in this one your comparing that to cis gendered white guys being lumped together. What?

Tell me is there a thread on this board called "The evils of cis gendred white guys" with 128 pages of post like this "All things LGBTQ+" thread that has constant post by you about evil LGBTQ people and policy? No, there isn't. One side is definitely more obsessed than the other with identity politics and its not the side I'm on.

 

[wardorican]

Maybe, I am pretty sure several of my friends and immediate family are far left, so if you want to classify them as 'right' that on you, but during our conversations they are pretty far left. But you might be on to something, but more than likely it is just your usual projection on what I should 'actually think'.

Ignoring your friends and family, since I don't know anything about them or what news they consume... I'm not projecting anything. I'm strongly assuming you mostly read stuff from Breitbart news and probably certain fox news commentary and lord knows what online video sources. You seem to parrot a lot of the same tired, unthoughtful things those sites do. So, I just challenge your assertions to see if you are willing to apply some rational thought towards them to better define your position and reasons. It's not my fault you fail to provide convincing points, and decide to play 'whatabout' games. Asking "why" you think something isn't an attempt to get you to think my way. Just to re-evaluate based on better information or better define why you think the way you do.

 

[wardorican]

This is not Jon Stewart or the British actor from Community so I am sure it is not acceptable on a political message board.

Comedian making a joke vs a politician appealing to people. Not the same thing. I don't get my politics from Bill, but I am curious about the rest of his point.

 

[samiam5211]

Are all values from the past that were common now unjustifiable or are there some values from our past that are still needed today?

The fact that something was done in the past is of no value.

If you are arguing in support of a specific tradition, it should stand on its own merit. Bringing up the fact that it was that way for thousands of years has nothing to do with why it is relevant today.

 

[Bolo]

I hate the fact that corporations have turned pride month into a cringe fest. They change their social media logos to rainbow logos and are like "See, see, WE SUPPORT YOU! PLEASE BUY OUR STUFF" then pull the cya next year on July 1st. It just never sat right with me, it feels awfully cheap for such a serious subject.

 

[coldseat]

I hate the fact that corporations have turned pride month into a cringe fest. They change their social media logos to rainbow logos and are like "See, see, WE SUPPORT YOU! PLEASE BUY OUR STUFF" then pull the cya next year on July 1st. It just never sat right with me, it feels awfully cheap for such a serious subject.

It's like Christmas for the Gays... over commercialized. I see constant complaints about that, especially from LGBTQ people. To me it's just what happens in a consumer driven society like we have. Better than the alternative of being shunned and ignored.

 

[Optimus Prime]

I've never thought about this, never heard about it, never knew about it

And now that I do know, I'm not sure what I think about it
=======================================

Disney villains are an institution for the Mouse House. Far more interesting than the studio’s heroes and often the most memorable part of its films, villains are as important to Disney’s success as the princesses that built the company. Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs was the studio’s first film, but the Evil Queen is far more enduring than the weak and nearly inconsequential girl at the center of the story. The Little Mermaid, the film that launched the Disney Renaissance and established the modern slate of princesses, features a precocious redhead as the protagonist, but it’s the villain, the larger-than-life octopus/woman Ursula, that secured the film a place in the pantheon of animated classics.

Yes, villains are often one of the best parts — if not the best — of these stories. The best Disney films always have a great protagonist, but they often have an even greater villain. Their songs are the catchiest, their designs the most striking, and their behaviors instantly iconic. They are also, for the most part, queer-coded.

Queer coding is the practice of imbuing queer traits into a character without outright declaring them part of the LGBTQ community. Queer coding has long been a way of including LGBTQ-adjacent characters without stating their sexuality openly, and we can trace it back to literary classics like Jane Austen’s Emma and Pride and Prejudice, Virginia Woolf’s Orlando and Mrs. Dalloway, and F. Scott Fitzgerald’s The Great Gatsby. Queer coding became prominent in cinema during the Golden Age of Hollywood, especially after the rise of the Hays Code. However, whereas queer coding in classic literature served to include the oppressed voices and perspectives of LGBTQ people, Disney’s use of it on its villains added further stigma to a community already struggling to be seen and accepted.

Is he … you know?​

We could interpret Disney’s use of queer coding on its villains as the studio trying to reaffirm the negative connotations most closely associated with the LGBTQ community. “If you’re gay, you’re evil. And then you die.” Certainly, Disney villains thrived on their queerness, savoring the wickedness of their actions and almost getting off on it. Think of Ursula shaking her hips during Poor Unfortunate Souls, Scar toying with the mouse he’s about to eat in The Lion King, or Governor Ratcliffe gleefully proclaiming his superiority and greed during Mine, Mine, Mine from Pocahontas.

It’s unclear if Disney’s actions were deliberate or if the studio simply went along with the general consensus and voiced what many people already believed about the LGBTQ community, but the overt queerness of their villains is undeniable. If their distinctive designs weren’t enough, their larger-than-life personas drove the point home. Yet, in painting the LGBTQ+ community in a negative light, Disney unintentionally popularized the very same traits it was trying to vilify.

Sure, the queerness of these characters might’ve still been “evil,” but it was also more mainstream than ever. And for a community that spent so long hiding in the shadows out of shame and fear, any representation worked, even when closely associated with villains. Perhaps that’s why villains became so beloved during the new millennium. With LGBTQ representation as scarce as it was back during the Hays Code, villains became the leaders of a community striving to find anything that resembled them in major motion pictures. This reception, in turn, led to the reframing of the villains as complex and perhaps misunderstood characters rather than one-dimensional creatures of greed and hatred, leading to the modern state of Disney villainy...............

The problem with Disney and its queer-coded villains

 

[Farb]

Yep. 15 years.

I was just wondering your lens to make such a comment on their marriage

If I married a woman or a man for that matter and then my spouse decides they are not that, then how can I stay in it? How am I suppose to be sexually attracted to the other sex that I am attracted too?

 

[Farb]

What are you even taking about? If we're discussing the LGBTQ community, then G and T are both in the acronym. So yes, it's a shared identity. You really are throwing everything at the kitchen sink.



Again, what are you talking about? This doesn't even follow with your previous statement. In your first statement your trying to force divisions in LGBTQ and in this one your comparing that to cis gendered white guys being lumped together. What?

Tell me is there a thread on this board called "The evils of cis gendred white guys" with 128 pages of post like this "All things LGBTQ+" thread that has constant post by you about evil LGBTQ people and policy? No, there isn't. One side is definitely more obsessed than the other with identity politics and its not the side I'm on.

You don't find it disingenuous to say I am obessed with LGTBQ issues when literally everywhere is pride month? You guys are literally asking everyone to notice you and celebrate you. LOL.
If the entire LGTBQ shares an identity then you also share parts of those communities stupid ideas and policies, right?
Do you think men can get pregnant?
You don't see any threads about republicans, conservatives or Trump supporters being evil? Are we on the same board? Sounds like victimization to me.

 

[Farb]

Ignoring your friends and family, since I don't know anything about them or what news they consume... I'm not projecting anything. I'm strongly assuming you mostly read stuff from Breitbart news and probably certain fox news commentary and lord knows what online video sources. You seem to parrot a lot of the same tired, unthoughtful things those sites do. So, I just challenge your assertions to see if you are willing to apply some rational thought towards them to better define your position and reasons. It's not my fault you fail to provide convincing points, and decide to play 'whatabout' games. Asking "why" you think something isn't an attempt to get you to think my way. Just to re-evaluate based on better information or better define why you think the way you do.

I can't remember if I have ever read anything from Breitbart. That is the Glen Beck platform right? Yeah, I don't read them at all. I don't subscribe to any news service or platform.
What exactly do I parrot that those other sites do?
I enjoy rational thoughts and the truth.
I think I provide great points and back mine up with logic. Like men can not get pregnant or current systemic racism/sexism is a myth of victimhood.

I do love how most of the left tend to focus on what news I consume and from where. It is as if you are under the impression someone can't look around and say "you know, these people are just fing crazy". But I also understand that it makes it easier for the left to ingest obviously incorrect ideas based on the news they consume. Based on your inflated sense of intelligence, I assume you listen to NPR, correct?

 

[Farb]

Comedian making a joke vs a politician appealing to people. Not the same thing. I don't get my politics from Bill, but I am curious about the rest of his point.

With this large of 'jump' in the LGTBQ community, something has to be there, correct? Bill makes a good point and one that should be asked and studied.

 

[Farb]

Yep. 15 years.

I was just wondering your lens to make such a comment on their marriage

https://news.yahoo.com/gay-trans-panic-defense-leads-192127947.html

A Virginia man has been acquitted of murder after using what amounted to a gay/trans “panic” defense, outlawed in the state just a month after the victim’s death.

A jury Friday found former Virginia Tech football player Isimemen Etute, 19, not guilty of second-degree murder in the beating death of Jerry Paul Smith, The Roanoke Times reports. The trial took place over three days in Montgomery County Circuit Court in Christiansburg, Va.

Smith, 40, had had a sexual encounter with Etute in Smith’s apartment in Blacksburg, Va. They met on Tinder, and Etute believed Smith was a woman named Angie. Smith performed oral sex on Etute when they hooked up April 10, 2021, with Etute still believing Smith was a woman. It is unknown if Smith identified as transgender; his family has said he was a gay man.

Etute returned to Smith’s home May 31, 2021, with the intention of determining Smith’s gender. He realized Smith was a man and became enraged. He began beating Smith.

Not that murder is the best option, but I think this goes back to the basics of being human.

 

[coldseat]

You don't find it disingenuous to say I am obessed with LGTBQ issues when literally everywhere is pride month? You guys are literally asking everyone to notice you and celebrate you. LOL.
If the entire LGTBQ shares an identity then you also share parts of those communities stupid ideas and policies, right?
Do you think men can get pregnant?
You don't see any threads about republicans, conservatives or Trump supporters being evil? Are we on the same board? Sounds like victimization to me.

So now we're talking about pride month? Smh. As soon as your arguments have been shown to be ridiculous, you go on to another tangent. As if I'm singularly responsible for pride month, lol.

Trans men who haven't transitioned can get pregnant. Biological males can not get pregnant. Not really confusing or controversial at all. You constantly trying to bring this up as some "gottach" is stupid, but it's a perfect illustration of the way you think.

Yes, because many Republicans and Trump supporters are evil. But all cis gendered white men are not Republicans or Trump supporters, and you brought up cis gendered white men.