What happens to the Republican Party now? (5 Viewers)

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MT15

MT15

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This election nonsense by Trump may end up splitting up the Republican Party. I just don’t see how the one third (?) who are principled conservatives can stay in the same party with Trump sycophants who are willing to sign onto the TX Supreme Court case.

We also saw the alt right types chanting “destroy the GOP” in Washington today because they didn’t keep Trump in power. I think the Q types will also hold the same ill will toward the traditional Republican Party. In fact its quite possible that all the voters who are really in a Trump personality cult will also blame the GOP for his loss. It’s only a matter of time IMO before Trump himself gets around to blaming the GOP.

There is some discussion of this on Twitter. What do you all think?



 
The other side of the coin to the theme of the last few posts on this page is the Dems need to make some corrective changes going in to 2024:



The Dems got a huge gift. I hope they don't squander it with the horrible strategic decisions they've consistently made post-Obama.
 
That’s not a serious article. The Hill leans decidedly R, it’s a hit piece.

Also - why yes I had picked up on the undercurrent of misogyny.

 
My feeling is that Trump is behind this. He would love nothing more than replacing McConnell to prove that he is still king of the R Party.
 
SaulGoodmanEsq said:
And not long after I posted the above I stumbled on to more proof the Dems corner the market on awful strategic decisions:

Click to expand...


What's weird to me is that someone thinks the general population cares who was VP? Newsom is the most likely front runner if Joe doesn't run. He doesn't need to be VP for that.
 
Good read from the Atlantic
==================

Liberals reacted to the election of Donald Trump in 2016 with dismay, horror—and curiosity. Reporters ventured to Trump counties to ask questions. Political scientists studied the voting effect of international trade. Hollywood made a movie out of J. D. Vance’s memoir, Hillbilly Elegy.

Liberals didn’t like what had happened—but for exactly that reason, they wanted to understand it. They strove for understanding until it became a kind of inside joke: the journalist on Trump safari in Pennsylvania diners. But the joke made its own kind of sense. Survival depends upon adaptation. Adaptation depends upon learning.

The question after the 2022 midterms is: Can conservatives learn?

Through the Trump years, the Republican Party has organized itself as an anti-learning entity. Unwelcome information has been ignored or denied.

Trump lost the popular vote in 2016, and by a worse margin than Mitt Romney had in 2012? Not interested: It was a historic landslide victory.

Trump never rose above 50 percent approval (in any credible poll) on any single day of his presidency? Not interested: All that matters is what his base thinks.

Republicans were crushed in 2018 in the highest midterm turnout of eligible voters since before the First World War? Not interested: The result showed only that voters wanted more Trump and more Trumpiness.

Trump got swamped by a margin of 8 million votes in 2020? Joe Biden won the second-highest share of the popular vote than any presidential candidate since 1988, next only to Barack Obama’s blowout win in 2008? No need to pay attention: After all, Rudy Giuliani and Dinesh D’Souza said the election was stolen! Besides, check out those Latino votes for Trump.

Democrats won two Senate seats in formerly bright-red Georgia after winning the state’s electoral votes in the presidential contest? Only a temporary setback; wait ’til next time. By then, Trump will have helped get elected a bunch of “America First” secretaries of state who will rewrite the rules so that a Democrat can never win again.

“Next time” is now. In every way you can measure, 2022 was a crushing repudiation—not only of Trump personally or of Trump’s allegations that the 2020 election was corrupted, but of the larger Republican Party. For the first time since 1934, the party of the president lost not a single state legislature in a midterm year—and actually made gains in the Midwest: Michigan, Minnesota, and Wisconsin.

Every last one of the candidates running for offices to control elections who endorsed Trump’s Big Lie about the 2020 election went down in defeat, as did up-ballot election deniers such as Blake Masters in the Arizona Senate contest and Lee Zeldin, who ran for governor in an otherwise good Republican year in New York.............

So you’d think the time would be right for Fox News to organize some safaris of its own. Maybe the podcast hosts and newsletter writers who argued that “woke” politics was alienating former Democrats will ask why Republican authoritarianism and reactionary culture warring has even more offensively alienated their former voters.

Perhaps that soul-searching will happen—it’s early days. But if it does, it will be a break from past practice.

In their anti-learning culture, conservatives have come to view everything that happens, however unwelcome, as proof simply that the most extreme people were the most correct.

In the state of Florida, Republicans are proceeding postelection with more of the draconian anti-abortion laws that cost their colleagues so dearly across the country. Conservative pundits are gamely insisting that they did not really lose the 2022 elections but were once again cheated by a rigged system.

Should conservatives start noticing that they lag among unmarried women and the young? No, instead: Ridicule and insult unmarried women, especially the young. Having hooted and jeered Mitt Romney, John McCain, and George W. Bush, and pushed Liz Cheney and other principled Republicans out of Congress, the right now expresses bafflement and outrage that those rejected leaders did not rally to help candidates who condoned the January 6 insurrection and opposed aid to Ukraine.

The historian Bernard Lewis once offered sage advice to any group that faces adverse circumstances: “The question, ‘Who did this to us?’ has led only to neurotic fantasies and conspiracy theories. The other question—‘What did we do wrong?’—has led naturally to a second question, ‘How do we put it right?’ In that question … lie the best hope for the future.”.............

MSN

www.msn.com
 
Optimus Prime said:
Good read from the Atlantic
==================

Liberals reacted to the election of Donald Trump in 2016 with dismay, horror—and curiosity. Reporters ventured to Trump counties to ask questions. Political scientists studied the voting effect of international trade. Hollywood made a movie out of J. D. Vance’s memoir, Hillbilly Elegy.

Liberals didn’t like what had happened—but for exactly that reason, they wanted to understand it. They strove for understanding until it became a kind of inside joke: the journalist on Trump safari in Pennsylvania diners. But the joke made its own kind of sense. Survival depends upon adaptation. Adaptation depends upon learning.

The question after the 2022 midterms is: Can conservatives learn?

Through the Trump years, the Republican Party has organized itself as an anti-learning entity. Unwelcome information has been ignored or denied.

Trump lost the popular vote in 2016, and by a worse margin than Mitt Romney had in 2012? Not interested: It was a historic landslide victory.

Trump never rose above 50 percent approval (in any credible poll) on any single day of his presidency? Not interested: All that matters is what his base thinks.

Republicans were crushed in 2018 in the highest midterm turnout of eligible voters since before the First World War? Not interested: The result showed only that voters wanted more Trump and more Trumpiness.

Trump got swamped by a margin of 8 million votes in 2020? Joe Biden won the second-highest share of the popular vote than any presidential candidate since 1988, next only to Barack Obama’s blowout win in 2008? No need to pay attention: After all, Rudy Giuliani and Dinesh D’Souza said the election was stolen! Besides, check out those Latino votes for Trump.

Democrats won two Senate seats in formerly bright-red Georgia after winning the state’s electoral votes in the presidential contest? Only a temporary setback; wait ’til next time. By then, Trump will have helped get elected a bunch of “America First” secretaries of state who will rewrite the rules so that a Democrat can never win again.

“Next time” is now. In every way you can measure, 2022 was a crushing repudiation—not only of Trump personally or of Trump’s allegations that the 2020 election was corrupted, but of the larger Republican Party. For the first time since 1934, the party of the president lost not a single state legislature in a midterm year—and actually made gains in the Midwest: Michigan, Minnesota, and Wisconsin.

Every last one of the candidates running for offices to control elections who endorsed Trump’s Big Lie about the 2020 election went down in defeat, as did up-ballot election deniers such as Blake Masters in the Arizona Senate contest and Lee Zeldin, who ran for governor in an otherwise good Republican year in New York.............

So you’d think the time would be right for Fox News to organize some safaris of its own. Maybe the podcast hosts and newsletter writers who argued that “woke” politics was alienating former Democrats will ask why Republican authoritarianism and reactionary culture warring has even more offensively alienated their former voters.

Perhaps that soul-searching will happen—it’s early days. But if it does, it will be a break from past practice.

In their anti-learning culture, conservatives have come to view everything that happens, however unwelcome, as proof simply that the most extreme people were the most correct.

In the state of Florida, Republicans are proceeding postelection with more of the draconian anti-abortion laws that cost their colleagues so dearly across the country. Conservative pundits are gamely insisting that they did not really lose the 2022 elections but were once again cheated by a rigged system.

Should conservatives start noticing that they lag among unmarried women and the young? No, instead: Ridicule and insult unmarried women, especially the young. Having hooted and jeered Mitt Romney, John McCain, and George W. Bush, and pushed Liz Cheney and other principled Republicans out of Congress, the right now expresses bafflement and outrage that those rejected leaders did not rally to help candidates who condoned the January 6 insurrection and opposed aid to Ukraine.

The historian Bernard Lewis once offered sage advice to any group that faces adverse circumstances: “The question, ‘Who did this to us?’ has led only to neurotic fantasies and conspiracy theories. The other question—‘What did we do wrong?’—has led naturally to a second question, ‘How do we put it right?’ In that question … lie the best hope for the future.”.............

MSN

www.msn.com
Click to expand...

Appealing to voters is for the weak. The answer is clearly to make sure that only Republicans get to vote.
 
MT15 said:


Click to expand...


I don't find this thought out very well. It's not that it stopped working. It's that a chunk of the base wasn't ok with going full blow authoritarian. They would gladly still vote Republican, and for Trump if he had conceded the 2020 election. That's what sucks.

You should always forgive if someone truly bends the knee. We become one nation after the civil war, and so did Westeros after Robert's Rebellion.
 
Last edited:
superchuck500 said:
Good piece from David Frum in the Atlantic - Trump is a loser and now is the time for the GOP to end his control, but will they have the nerve?





www.theatlantic.com

Trump Lost the Midterms. DeSantis Won.

If the Florida governor ever intends to wrest control of the GOP from Trump, now is his moment.
www.theatlantic.com www.theatlantic.com
Click to expand...
The problem is that they don't have the nerve. They only have 'some nerve'.
 
J-DONK said:
I don't find this thought out very well. It's not that it stopped working. It's that a chunk of the base wasn't ok with going full blow authoritarian. They would gladly still vote Republican, and for Trump if he had conceded the 2020 election. That's what sucks.

You should always forgive if someone truly bends the knee. We become one nation at the civil war, and so did Westeros after Robert's Rebellion.
Click to expand...
There’s a difference between forgiving and forgetting. I don’t think she addresses forgiving at all, one way or the other. What she is addressing is forgetting - as in we know who these people are now and we don’t have to listen to them again.

And she is also making the point that this isn’t a true conversion just like you said in your first paragraph. That’s what she meant when she says - you’re not sorry for what you did, you’re just sorry it stopped working. She is specifically talking to pundits and religious influencers, not ordinary people. People who knew (or absolutely should have known) better, but danced with the devil anyway to get a little extra juice or a few more followers.

so, I guess I’m not really seeing what you are objecting to here. She agrees with your first paragraph completely, and if your and her contention there is true, then your second point is moot. We don’t have any true contrition here.
 
J-DONK said:
I don't find this thought out very well. It's not that it stopped working. It's that a chunk of the base wasn't ok with going full blow authoritarian. They would gladly still vote Republican, and for Trump if he had conceded the 2020 election. That's what sucks.

You should always forgive if someone truly bends the knee. We become one nation at the civil war, and so did Westeros after Robert's Rebellion.
Click to expand...

Except it has to be sincere.
The history of Civil Rights will show you that the South only conceded on the battlefield. They're still fighting the Civil War everywhere else.

'I'm sorry I got caught," isn't sincere.
 

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