What happens to the Democratic Party now? (1 Viewer)

[Heathen]

I’m sure much of us are having 2016 flashbacks this morning with a sick feeling to our stomachs..

2 of the last 3 elections Democrats have lost to a far right demagogue

Harris didn’t get close in many states to even Biden’s performance. We could very well lose the Presidency, Senate AND House depending on results the next few days…..

What went wrong?
What could’ve been done better?
What can we change in the future to ensure voters are motivated like they were when Obama was elected?

Democrats have no choice but to admit there’s a huge problem with some aspect of their platform— and to do a deep introspection of what’s going wrong..

 

[J-DONK]

Yeah, I don't know or care anything about Joe Rogan, but I recognized a while back that Kamala and Democrats needed to tailor messaging to young men and talk to them directly because it was obvious they were losing young men to the bro culture that Rogan personifies. The tried some, but by them it was probably too late. One interview with Rogan or anybody else wouldn't have changed anything.

If Kamala had done the circuit, it probably makes some kind of difference, but it's not going to win the election.

You have to remember. We are not talking about just winning over political people here. There is going to be a not small number of people that are going to learn from that podcast Joe Biden is not running for re-election but this black lady talking to Joe. The people who were googling Did Joe Biden dropout on election day.

 

[DaveXA]

Yup, I honestly thought all women in this country (what, with their individual freedoms very much on the line and the multiple needless deaths that have occurred since Dobbs) would come out and vote in force as they had appeared to leading up to this election, you know to protect their rights......and it didn't happen.....that is mindboggling to me, did they already forget?

I don't think they forgot. I do think women are more conservative and pro-life than we give them credit for. I mean, 44% voted Trump in Pennsylvania. That's a lot of women. I was thinking it would be 30-35%. 40%+ floored me. I don't know how you address that though.

 

[DaveXA]

Harris chose her VP specifically for this demographic. All her VP choices where for this demographic. How can anybody say they weren't trying to communicate with them? Did it work, obviously not. But they tried.

White people should form groups to advocate for them and come up with policy proposal just for them.

She did, but how many white people got excited about him? Idk, he was pretty vanilla and boring to me. And Harris didn't resonate well for whatever reason.

And yes, maybe they should, lol. Idk though. I really think good faith messaging that resonates with white voters would make a difference. Not to mention she could have gone on these podcasts and made her case. There definitely were some missed opportunities. I don't know that those missed opportunities would have made enough of a difference, but it's clear that Trump basically kept his vote numbers the same while Democratic turnout was down by 10 million+ votes. Where did those voters go? They stayed home because they probably weren't motivated.

 

[coldseat]

She did, but how many white people got excited about him? Idk, he was pretty vanilla and boring to me. And Harris didn't resonate well for whatever reason.

And yes, maybe they should, lol. Idk though. I really think good faith messaging that resonates with white voters would make a difference. Not to mention she could have gone on these podcasts and made her case. There definitely were some missed opportunities. I don't know that those missed opportunities would have made enough of a difference, but it's clear that Trump basically kept his vote numbers the same while Democratic turnout was down by 10 million+ votes. Where did those voters go? They stayed home because they probably weren't motivated.

Actually, thinking about this, I'm going to go against the current thought pattern on this. Trump got the same number of votes as last time, yet we know that Latino men and young men and Arab people didn't vote Democrat this cycle. I think those are the votes that didn't show up for Democrats, they actually did show up, it was just for Trump. The voters that didn't show up were a portion of the Republican voters or else Trump would have gotten a lot more votes. Maybe Haley voters. For all she tried, Kamala couldn't pull in those voters who were probably mostly institutionalist. And she couldn't pull in white women, even with their rights on the line.

I know you will all get mad at me for saying this again, that says a lot more about the US electorate than it does about the failure of Harris or the Democratic party.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

I know you will all get mad at me for saying this again, that says a lot more about the US electorate than it does about the failure of Harris or the Democratic party.

That is where I'm at and there's very little anyone can do to convince me otherwise.

 

[SystemShock]

Why is celebrating diversity bad? Guilt tripping? You all seem to think I actually care if Democrats do or don't have a section for white people or that I would be "offended" if they did. I'd venture to say that the vast majority of minorities that vote Democrat don't care, myself included. If that's what they need to do, then do it. I'm just giving the simple, logical explanation for why it hasn't been done in the past.

What do you put in it? Go!

I am making general comments, they are not directed at you.

Bottom line is, if someone doesn't feel represented by a party, they are less likely to vote for said party.

As for celebrating diversity... it was 1998 when I first began working for a corporation in the U.S. One of the first emails I received from HR was one asking me to RSVP for some diversity celebrating event. I declined the invitation, with a note that said: I don't want to celebrate what makes people different, I want to learn what makes us equals.

And guess who's not considered "diverse"?

 

[J-DONK]

Actually, thinking about this, I'm going to go against the current thought pattern on this. Trump got the same number of votes as last time, yet we know that Latino men and young men and Arab people didn't vote Democrat this cycle. I think those are the votes that didn't show up for Democrats, they actually did show up, it was just for Trump. The voters that didn't show up were a portion of the Republican voters or else Trump would have gotten a lot more votes. Maybe Haley voters. For all she tired, Kamala couldn't pull in those voters who were probably mostly institutionalist. And she couldn't pull in white women, even with their rights on the line.

I know you will all get mad at me for saying this again, that says a lot more about the US electorate than it does about the failure of Harris or the Democratic party.

Blaming the electorate gets nowhere, from a strategy, and campaign build out standpoint. You would always want Biden to have never ran.

In this climate, what wins the primaries: a Bernie type of anti-establishment campaign, or an institutionalist ala Biden?

Harris had only one choice as the VP of the incubment, and even then she had so little time try to put together a clear message to the public.

I think it's insane to look at all the fumbling done by the DNP, and blame it on the voting public.

 

[coldseat]

I am making general comments, they are not directed at you.

Bottom line is, if someone doesn't feel represented by a party, they are less likely to vote for said party.

As for celebrating diversity... it was 1998 when I first began working for a corporation in the U.S. One of the first emails I received from HR was one asking me to RSVP for some diversity celebrating event. I declined the invitation, with a note that said: I don't want to celebrate what makes people different, I want to learn what makes us equals.

And guess who's not considered "diverse"?

I always thought that celebrating diversity is about celebrating what makes us all equal even though we're different.

 

[SystemShock]

I always thought that celebrating diversity is about celebrating what makes us all equal even though we're different.

By definition, it's what makes us different.

Not to mention, why does diversity have to be "celebrated"?

 

[coldseat]

Blaming the electorate gets nowhere, from a strategy, and campaign build out standpoint. You would always want Biden to have never ran.

I'm not the Democratic party. I can blame the electorate when that's what I see happening. I don't expect them to do that.

In this climate, what wins the primaries: a Bernie type of anti-establishment campaign, or an institutionalist ala Biden?

In 2020, it was Biden. In 2016 it was Hillary, even with all of the consternation.

Harris had only one choice as the VP of the incubment, and even then she had so little time try to put together a clear message to the public.

I think there message was clear and it came through. It just wasn't accepted by the electorate. Honestly, I wish all campaigns were no longer than 3 months. That is plenty time.

I think it's insane to look at all the fumbling done by the DNP, and blame it on the voting public.

Okay. I'll still do it.

 

[coldseat]

By definition, it's what makes us different.

Not to mention, why does diversity have to be "celebrated"?

Disagree, but people see things different ways.

Because it's good. For everybody!

 

[Infoman]

I've spoken to some people that have voted Hillary, Biden, and now Trump.... None of them are White Men... (I'm married into a muti-ethnic families - Latin, Black, and E Indian)

Some things I have heard most...

Working people will always put their financial and safety concerns before most other issues. They voted for what they thought was best for their wallet.
They are tired of being call *fill in the blank" Americans - They are Americans, and don't owe a party anything because of their identity - They want their vote earned. Not banked.
Many don't watch or read or trust any main stream media sources - most get information from Podcast, Social Media, and Streaming sources.
Most are moderate and believe in God... And feel like the Dems have gone way too far left on the social scale.
Say - I was better off with the butt crevasse 4 years ago, and something had to change now.
They want better choices, but this is what they got.
Most would have considered voting for a Dem if they thought they would do anything different to address their main concerns, but didn't see anything that would indicate that.
Common themes - Gas, Food, Insurance, House, Rent, Car, School, Kids, Future security - Everything else is secondary at best.

This election was not about Identity... 70% said they wanted change... The Dems "just keep doing what you're doing."

Bernie Sanders called it yesterday - and I hardly ever agree with him on policy - but he mentioned this election was lost by the Dems by ignoring the working class - and He's dead right.

 

[MT15]

Looks like what will happen is.... The Dem party will Congratulate Hitler and Invite him over to the White House to discuss the peaceful transition to Fascism, and their different visions of ending Democracy... Not something I'd be willing to do if that's 100% fact... But to each there own I guess... In unrelated news... This is why I have trust issues with these parties...

Biden congratulates Trump in phone call, invites him to meeting at White House

President Joe Biden spoke on the phone with former President Donald Trump on Wednesday and "congratulated him on his victory," the White House said in a statement.

abcnews.go.com

"President Joe Biden called President Donald J. Trump to congratulate him on his victory and extended an invitation to the White House to ensure a smooth transition between the current Administration and the incoming Administration. President Trump looks forward to the meeting, which will take place shortly, and very much appreciated the call," Cheung said in a statement.

(In case you didn't catch it... I was being sarcastic - I hate the hyperbolic rhetoric party systems - Churchill would never call Adolf over to congratulate him on winning anything, nor work with him on a peaceful transition of anything... Biden ain't Churchill, and Trump ain't Hitler - That's the take away here - This has to stop)

You seem to be a little bit all over the place here.

Sure there is hyperbole and some on each side during the campaign. That has always gone on.

It seems to me that the hyperbole is cast aside after the election and the election results are acknowledged and there will actually be a smooth transition from one side, while the other side never stops demonizing their opponents, refuses to acknowledge an election loss, does illegal shirt to try to overturn a loss, and eventually sends radicals to break into Congress in an attempt to stop certification of said election. Oh, and then after that fails, refuses to do the normal transition steps.

And you seem to be unable to draw a distinction between the 2 sets of actions. Can you admit that one set of actions is more extreme and undesireable than the other?

 

[bird]

This thread by Andy Kim may have some merit for this conversation. The main part is below. There are a few more tweets if anyone wants to read the read of it.

Read what Kim is actually saying.

Remember that all politics is identity politics. Their belief structures are part of their identity.

What is behind the anger? Behind the disgust?

Complaining about PACs is window dressing. Is it meaningless? No. But it is the or even a deciding factor?

What has happened over the last 60 years or so?

The rise of wealth which has accelerated. The rise of people formerly deemed less than full citizens and people deemed less than fully human. Creative destruction cascading through the political economy in the form of automation, computer technology. Financialization, the impact of the PRC and southeastern Asia on the world economy, outsourcing which is tied to financialization and more.

So, change, which humans are resistant to and, more specifically, demographic change.

Radicalization is not limited to religion.

What happened before is not returning.

Exceptionalism is being found wanting.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

Working people will always put their financial and safety concerns before most other issues. They voted for what they thought was best for their wallet.

Then they should do their own research as to the cause of this economic inflation. By every measure, the US has come out of this crisis far ahead of every other nation, and it not even close! We have the strongest and fastest growing economy in the world.

The American economy has left other rich countries in the dust

Expect that to continue, argue Simon Rabinovitch and Henry Curr

www.economist.com

https://www.npr.org/2024/10/30/nx-s1-5165466/economy-gdp-inflation-consumer-spending-sentiment

They are tired of being call *fill in the blank" Americans - They are Americans, and don't owe a party anything because of their identity - They want their vote earned. Not banked.

Me too, here's the thing though, we didn't chose to be singled out like that! The "real" Americans choose those titles for us to signify our differences.

Many don't watch or read or trust any main stream media sources - most get information from Podcast, Social Media, and Streaming sources.

So they prefer opinions over facts. That is not to say msm always get the story right, my trust in their reporting comes from the trust that when they are reporting a story, that story will come from a journalist with some ethical beliefs and if they get their reporting wrong, they will own up to their mistakes.

Most are moderate and believe in God... And feel like the Dems have gone way too far left on the social scale.

Ha. IDK how to even address that other than to say, Ha!

Say - I was better off with the butt crevasse 4 years ago, and something had to change now.
They want better choices, but this is what they got.
Most would have considered voting for a Dem if they thought they would do anything different to address their main concerns, but didn't see anything that would indicate that.
Common themes - Gas, Food, Insurance, House, Rent, Car, School, Kids, Future security - Everything else is secondary at best.

More, me, me, me! Everyone else be damned! JFK would be ashamed of us. What happen to all these Christians that made them turn a blind eye to the many and only look out for themselves.

This election was not about Identity... 70% said they wanted change... The Dems "just keep doing what you're doing."

Bernie Sanders called it yesterday - and I hardly ever agree with him on policy - but he mentioned this election was lost by the Dems by ignoring the working class - and He's dead right.

He's just going on and on with his usual spiel, while completely ignoring the gains that the D's have provided to the "working class" much like the working class has. I'm not going to repeat all that the D's had done because it has been repeated ad nauseum in this thread.

That's just the tip of the iceberg. If anything, he is complicit to the failure for not championing Democrat's efforts to help the "working class".

We want change, we want change, but we don't want to participate in working for the change we want, we want what we want and we want it now. I'm sure you're gonna ignore the above efforts and many other efforts D's have taken to work towards the "changes" you want, just like Bernie has repeatedly done in an effort to further his own agenda.

 

[ktulu909]

So random though,if old Donnie tries to remove the 2 term limit, you got to run Obama again,right?

 

[coldseat]

Then they should do their own research as to the cause of this economic inflation. By every measure, the US has come out of this crisis far ahead of every other nation, and it not even close! We have the strongest and fastest growing economy in the world.

The American economy has left other rich countries in the dust

Expect that to continue, argue Simon Rabinovitch and Henry Curr

www.economist.com

https://www.npr.org/2024/10/30/nx-s1-5165466/economy-gdp-inflation-consumer-spending-sentiment

Me too, here's the thing though, we didn't chose to be singled out like that! The "real" Americans choose those titles for us to signify our differences.

So they prefer opinions over facts. That is not to say msm always get the story right, my trust in their reporting comes from the trust that when they are reporting a story, that story will come from a journalist with some ethical beliefs and if they get their reporting wrong, they will own up to their mistakes.

Ha. IDK how to even address that other than to say, Ha!

More, me, me, me! Everyone else be damned! JFK would be ashamed of us. What happen to all these Christians that made them turn a blind eye to the many and only look out for themselves.

Just a few weeks ago Bernie was saying that Biden was the most progressive and work oriented president ever. Excuse me if I, .

 

[DaveXA]

Actually, thinking about this, I'm going to go against the current thought pattern on this. Trump got the same number of votes as last time, yet we know that Latino men and young men and Arab people didn't vote Democrat this cycle. I think those are the votes that didn't show up for Democrats, they actually did show up, it was just for Trump. The voters that didn't show up were a portion of the Republican voters or else Trump would have gotten a lot more votes. Maybe Haley voters. For all she tired, Kamala couldn't pull in those voters who were probably mostly institutionalist. And she couldn't pull in white women, even with their rights on the line.

I know you will all get mad at me for saying this again, that says a lot more about the US electorate than it does about the failure of Harris or the Democratic party.

Actually pretty good thoughts. I hadn't really done any deep dive into the numbers. Your theory that they voted Trump and that's where they went makes sense. People definitely stayed home, but my first though would have been Democratic voters. That it could be Trump voters who stayed home is a pretty interesting thought.

I will say weay need to peel back the layers of this onion to see what really led to this outcome and start looking at how the party can adjust their strategy during the midterms.

And I'm not at all mad at your comment about the electorate. The electorate always bears some responsibility for outcomes, but I do think messaging, candidate quality, target audience and economic are all important things that need to be considered. And I fully acknowledge I could be wrong on the gender issues, although I still think there's room for discussion of that. And race as well. It's a whole basket of issues and it's complicated.

Ultimately, to win elections, it all needs to be thoroughly addressed before the next election cycle in 2026 (midterms).