What happens to the Democratic Party now? (4 Viewers)

[Heathen]

I’m sure much of us are having 2016 flashbacks this morning with a sick feeling to our stomachs..

2 of the last 3 elections Democrats have lost to a far right demagogue

Harris didn’t get close in many states to even Biden’s performance. We could very well lose the Presidency, Senate AND House depending on results the next few days…..

What went wrong?
What could’ve been done better?
What can we change in the future to ensure voters are motivated like they were when Obama was elected?

Democrats have no choice but to admit there’s a huge problem with some aspect of their platform— and to do a deep introspection of what’s going wrong..

 

[SystemShock]

That's funny considering the whole Bible is just made up stories.

They have a point, though. A true Christian will see LGBTQ+ as aberrations, evil, immoral beings not deserving of eternal life but deserving of death (even death by stoning), because that's what their manual says, both in the old texts and new texts.

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

A true Christian will see LGBTQ+ as aberrations, evil, immoral beings not deserving of eternal life but deserving of death (even death by stoning), because that's what their manual says, both in the old texts and new texts.

Let me give you an example that may give you some pause for thought. I only say this as an example of how wrong and bigoted the above comment is. I know that what I'm about to write is compete bullshirt that no one should ever believe, just like the statement above.

A true Mexican is a lazy, drug dealing rapist and murderer, because that's what their gang leader teaches them to be.

 

[SystemShock]

Actually stoning of gays does not appear in the NT.

Yes, the OT specifically says stoning. In the NT, Jesus said "I'm not here to change the law but to fulfil it".

If some other punishment does, kindly show it.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Revelation 21:8
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

Jude 1:7
Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.

3 enough?

 

[SystemShock]

Let me give you an example that may give you some pause for thought. I only say this as an example of how wrong and bigoted the above comment is. I know that what I'm about to write is compete bullshirt that no one should ever believe, just like the statement above.

A true Mexican is a lazy, drug dealing rapist and murderer, because that's what their gang leader teaches them to be.

Man, you are trying way too hard. There's no equivalency there. Seriously, read the Bible. It's all right there. I posted a few verses above, from the NT, about the subject. Of course, you can listen to a number of apologists that will tell you what you are reading is not what the words mean (even though they do) and feel good about yourself and your religion. But that's been the case since the Enlightenment, every time a verse or a law doesn't align with modern secular morality, suddenly the verses don't mean what they do.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Revelation 21:8
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

Sorcerers?

 

[Optimus Prime]

A gen Z influencer, a former state lawmaker and the daughter of a former representative are facing off in a special Democratic primary in Arizona on Tuesday that showcases the party’s internal debate in the run-up to the midterm elections.

Longtime Arizona representative and progressive stalwart Raúl Grijalva died in office from complications of lung cancer treatment in March at age 77, leaving open a seat representing southern Arizona and its borderlands.

His daughter, Adelita Grijalva, herself a longtime elected official in southern Arizona, is the frontrunner in the race and has a laundry list of endorsements.

But Deja Foxx, a 25-year-old who’s made her name in viral moments standing up to politicians and who would become the youngest member of Congress, is surging in recent polls.

Daniel Hernandez, a former state lawmaker who was at the 2011 shooting of then representative Gabby Giffords, is also pulling in significant support.

“It’s a fascinating encapsulation of the different factions and factors that will define all Democratic primaries in 2026,” said Arizona progressive lobbyist Gaelle Esposito.

“Adelita represents the progressive wing, Deja’s the blank-slate outsider, Daniel has that big donor lane locked down. Do people want a progressive leader, do they just want to shake up the system or do they want someone who knows how to navigate the DC backrooms?”

The district is solidly blue, meaning that whoever wins the Democratic primary is the likely victor in the general election.

National Democratic infighting has brought extra attention to the race, as the left wrangles over how to fight Donald Trump and win back voters while the Democratic party brand is flagging.

It’s also the first time this seat has been open in more than two decades. Questions over seniority and age in the party have loomed over the race – three Democrats died in office this year, and Trump’s “big, beautiful bill” passed by only one vote. Grijalva’s opponents have attacked her “legacy” last name.

“The thing that I need to push back on is this idea that the three members of Congress died because of age,” Grijalva, 54, said. “They died because of cancer. My dad lived in a Superfund site and drank poison water for two decades.”

After Zohran Mamdani’s upset win in the Democratic primary for New York City mayor, Democrats are looking across the country at how candidates who buck the status quo, and who communicate well to voters and on social media, will fare.

Leaders We Deserve, David Hogg’s Pac, endorsedFoxx in the race, saying “she has translated her story to represent a new vision of generational change that speaks truth to Trump’s cruel policies”.

His group is spending in Democratic primaries in safe blue districts to support younger progressive candidates and drive out Democratswho are “asleep at the wheel”

The candidates say voters are concerned about immigration, deportations and detentions – the district contains three major ports of entry on the US-Mexico border.

The economy looms large, especially with Trump’s new bill that could devastate rural areas in particular, as does the dismantling of democracy.

But the race hasn’t dwelled much on the issues; instead it’s zoomed in on an old-versus-new, established-versus-insurgent dynamic that’s played out across the country and will mark the midterms.……..

Arizona Democratic race for House seat highlights party’s internal debate – and previews the midterms

Gen Z activist Deja Foxx takes on Adelita Grijalva, a local official and daughter of the late Arizona congressman Raúl Grijalva

www.theguardian.com

 

[SystemShock]

Sorcerers?

Depends on the version you are reading... some versions say those who practice witchcraft, some versions say those who practice the magic arts, some versions add "with intoxicating drugs"...

biblehub.com is a good source for this... you look up a verse, and they give you all of the versions.
This is the page for Revelation 21:8

Revelation 21:8 - A New Heaven and a New Earth

But to the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and sexually immoral and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their place will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur. This is the second death.

biblehub.com

 

[Dragon]

There are plenty of things in the bible that reflects more on the times they were written but has no actual connections to what Jesus actually said or did. I’ve always wondered why Revelations was included in the Bible. In fact it was not a part of the orthodox church until after the 17th century. Revelations were written sometimes around 86 AD by someone with no direct contact with Jesus or any of his disciples, but by someone who "dreamed" therefor the name revelations. But it fit the norms of society at that time

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

There's no equivalency there.

Bigotry is bigotry. The people targeted and why they are targeted changes, but all bigotry is dynamically equivalent.

Seriously, read the Bible.

I have read the entire bible. I've already told you that.

That's what I personally know that the bible is misunderstood and misinterpreted. I've also studied some history of the bible. The bible wasn't originally considered a literal text or as you put it "a user's manual." Do you know when the bible started being treated as a literal text and why it started being treated that way?

It's all right there.

What's also in the bible are passages that directly contradict what you quoted. That's all right there in the bible too. The bible is a hodge podge of a lot of different ideas from a lot of different people cobbled together, but there is consistent and prevailing message in the new testament.

To use your false "user manual's" analogy, the bible is like someone took the user manuals for all the different brands of smart phones and all of the different smart phone operating systems and tried to cobble them together as one unified manual.

If you read that manual it would tell you on one page to follow a certain sequence of commands to send a photo to someone using bluetooth, but then on another page it would give you a different sequence of commands to do the same thing. That's the bible and it's why anyone can find any quote to support the bible saying anything they want people to believe it says.

Another really important point, not every Christian considers and treats the bible like a user's manual. You're simply trying to impose that belief on everyone, because that's what fits your belief system about anyone who follows a religion.

You're arguing from the logical fallacy of authority. You are wrongfully saying that only your interpretations and conclusions are the only valid interpretations and conclusions. That's false and stupid, because interpretation is strictly subjective. That's why there's so many different interpretations and conclusions on what the bible is really trying to say.

You mistakenly think that you get to decide for everyone else what they take away from the bible. You have the audacity to tell Christians and Muslims they are wrong about what their religion means to them and what they believe about their religion. It's both ignorant and arrogant.

I posted a few verses above, from the NT, about the subject. Of course, you can listen to...

What part of "I've read the entire bible for myself" do you not understand? The only part I skimmed through was all the begetting stuff. My interpretation and understanding of the bible comes from my direct and complete reading of it. The old testament is useless as far as I'm concerned. The old and new testament shouldn't even be in the same religious text.

The central message that speaks above all the random noise, from the biased individuals who clearly had an agenda and were not inspired by any god, is to have empathy and compassion for others and to work together instead of fighting. It's all right there in the bible if you read it with an open heart and open mind.

The reason I'm not a Catholic or a Christian, is because they are too focused on the same noise you are, so they miss the prevailing and recurring message being taught by the person referred to as Christ. Again, this is based on my reading of the bible, not anyone else telling me what it means and what's important in it.

On top of all that is the fact that a group of men, literally men, got together and decided what writings to include and what writings to leave out. They left out the best writings, which I have read quite a few of for myself. For instance, the original concept of sin came from an archery concept of missing one's target. The original idea of sin was to miss one's target, to fall short of being one's true self. Translations from one language to another and to another with variations in each translation is another reason the bible has so many internal inconsistencies.

But that's been the case since the Enlightenment, every time a verse or a law doesn't align with modern secular morality, suddenly the verses don't mean what they do.

What you are describing was actually push back against the Catholic church switching to teaching the bible as a factual text. Most of the bible is not factually based and it was never intended to be. The Catholic church was scared to death that the Age of Reason/Enlighment was going to pull people away from Catholicism, because people started putting more stock into observable and verifiable facts over blind faith. The Catholic church shifted toward teaching the whole bible as literal and historic fact to try the force fit the bible into the Age of Reasoning. Of course they failed miserably and that was the beginning of the mess we have today.

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

Depends on the version you are reading... some versions say those who practice witchcraft, some versions say those who practice the magic arts, some versions add "with intoxicating drugs"...

You do realize this supports everything I've been saying about there not being one single objective and authoritative interpretation of what anything in the bible means, or what is important and what is not? Everyone choose to believe what they think it means and what's important. Religion is a matter of choice, preference and belief. It's not a matter of objective fact.

It's completely subjective. You understand that, except for when it's inconvenient for you want to prejudge and entire group of people as all being the same.

biblehub.com is a good source for this... you look up a verse, and they give you all of the versions.
This is the page for Revelation 21:8

It's better to read the entire bible or just the entire new testament in my opinion, than it is to just look up and read quotes. It's also important to do some basic research into who decided what went into the bible. why they made those choices and to read some of what got left out. It's also good to study the evolution of the bible. It is not a static or fixed document in any way. There are many substantially different translations and variations of the bible, and there will continue to be many more new ones in the future.

 

[Dragon]

One of the many ways that religion has been distorted is the prosperity gospel

The prosperity gospel promotes the idea that faith and obedience lead to personal success, wealth, and health—implying that those who struggle are somehow lacking in faith or favor. This belief can foster an individualistic mindset that downplays systemic injustice and blames people for their hardships. It is a twisted ideology that is the complete opposite of what Jesus taught!

In politics, it reduces empathy for marginalized groups—such as immigrants or LGBTQ+ people—by framing them as morally inferior or outside God’s blessing. Combined with elements of Christian nationalism, this outlook justifies harsh policies and promotes a sense of moral superiority, making it easier to accept or ignore cruelty toward those who are different.

 

[bird]

A gen Z influencer, a former state lawmaker and the daughter of a former representative are facing off in a special Democratic primary in Arizona on Tuesday that showcases the party’s internal debate in the run-up to the midterm elections.

Longtime Arizona representative and progressive stalwart Raúl Grijalva died in office from complications of lung cancer treatment in March at age 77, leaving open a seat representing southern Arizona and its borderlands.

His daughter, Adelita Grijalva, herself a longtime elected official in southern Arizona, is the frontrunner in the race and has a laundry list of endorsements.

But Deja Foxx, a 25-year-old who’s made her name in viral moments standing up to politicians and who would become the youngest member of Congress, is surging in recent polls.

Daniel Hernandez, a former state lawmaker who was at the 2011 shooting of then representative Gabby Giffords, is also pulling in significant support.

“It’s a fascinating encapsulation of the different factions and factors that will define all Democratic primaries in 2026,” said Arizona progressive lobbyist Gaelle Esposito.

“Adelita represents the progressive wing, Deja’s the blank-slate outsider, Daniel has that big donor lane locked down. Do people want a progressive leader, do they just want to shake up the system or do they want someone who knows how to navigate the DC backrooms?”

The district is solidly blue, meaning that whoever wins the Democratic primary is the likely victor in the general election.

National Democratic infighting has brought extra attention to the race, as the left wrangles over how to fight Donald Trump and win back voters while the Democratic party brand is flagging.

It’s also the first time this seat has been open in more than two decades. Questions over seniority and age in the party have loomed over the race – three Democrats died in office this year, and Trump’s “big, beautiful bill” passed by only one vote. Grijalva’s opponents have attacked her “legacy” last name.

“The thing that I need to push back on is this idea that the three members of Congress died because of age,” Grijalva, 54, said. “They died because of cancer. My dad lived in a Superfund site and drank poison water for two decades.”

After Zohran Mamdani’s upset win in the Democratic primary for New York City mayor, Democrats are looking across the country at how candidates who buck the status quo, and who communicate well to voters and on social media, will fare.

Leaders We Deserve, David Hogg’s Pac, endorsedFoxx in the race, saying “she has translated her story to represent a new vision of generational change that speaks truth to Trump’s cruel policies”.

His group is spending in Democratic primaries in safe blue districts to support younger progressive candidates and drive out Democratswho are “asleep at the wheel”

The candidates say voters are concerned about immigration, deportations and detentions – the district contains three major ports of entry on the US-Mexico border.

The economy looms large, especially with Trump’s new bill that could devastate rural areas in particular, as does the dismantling of democracy.

But the race hasn’t dwelled much on the issues; instead it’s zoomed in on an old-versus-new, established-versus-insurgent dynamic that’s played out across the country and will mark the midterms.……..

Arizona Democratic race for House seat highlights party’s internal debate – and previews the midterms

Gen Z activist Deja Foxx takes on Adelita Grijalva, a local official and daughter of the late Arizona congressman Raúl Grijalva

www.theguardian.com

I get the needing younger people. I also think that not having positions on issues or not stating what those positions are might be a bit dangerous. The big issue with that is swimming against wealth and against the xenophobia/racist/misogynist forces in our dumbazz country.

 

[Optimus Prime]

I get the needing younger people. I also think that not having positions on issues or not stating what those positions are might be a bit dangerous.

That hasn’t really hurt Trump with his concepts of plans

You can argue that being to detailed has hurt democrats in the past

GOP: Build that wall!!!

DEMS: if you go to our website you will see our twenty point immigration plan complete with footnotes citing decades of immigration data, studies and analysis

Have to find that middle ground between style and substance

I also appreciate needing a younger generation with new ideas, new energy and new approaches

Have to be mindful of Mr Smith goes to Washington situations

Go in bright eyed and bushy tailed only to be blindsided with how things actually work

The old guard will vigorously defend the old ways but the younger folks coming in need to identity which things are the way they are because that’s they way they’ve always been versus the things that are they way they are because those are the ways that work

 

[SFIDC3]

Sorcerers?

Yup, not made up fairy tales at all.......I bet it was really sorcerers that came up with the notion of separation of church and state!!!!!

 

[zztop]

I wonder why old people in the DNC don't want to listen more to the younger generation (David Hogg for example). Whatever the DNC has been doing hasn't worked very well, they need new, fresh ideas that resonates with more groups of people

 

[Optimus Prime]

I wonder why old people in the DNC don't want to listen more to the younger generation (David Hogg for example). Whatever the DNC has been doing hasn't worked very well, they need new, fresh ideas that resonates with more groups of people

The same reason they never do

Like being in charge, in control, in power

Like the way they do things and if those ways aren’t working the ways just need to tweak a few things not scrap the whole system

Completely forgotten when they were the younger generation and they were the ones with new ideas and wanted to upset the apple cart

 

[Optimus Prime]

As Democrats reckon with a deep intra-party divide that threatens their ability to repair the party’s image and win back voters, Ken Martin said he not focused on “internal bullshirt” because “most people could care less about the internal drama and soap opera of the Democratic party.”

Martin, the chair of the Democratic National Committee, told the Guardian that he knows Democrats have to earn back trust from communities across the country before the midterms.

But, as part of his job leading the party, he has to manage dissenting voices who are trying to chart a way forward for the Democrats after the bruising 2024 loss to Donald Trump.

So far, the left is unified in its opposition to Trump – but not on their vision for their own party.

Trump’s spending plan will serve as the uniting force behind the Democratic Party’s push toward the midterms.

To that end, the DNC launched an effort to organize at events like book clubs and county fairs to ring the alarm about Trump’s so-called “big, beautiful bill” and tell voters what Democrats stand for, well ahead of the next elections.

Dubbed “organizing summer”, the party is engaging volunteers well before the midterms for on-the-ground meetups with voters.

It has sent more money to local and state parties to use in key 2025-26 battlegrounds and is recruiting new leaders in these areas.

The party will also restart its partisan voter registration programs, which have been done by third-party nonpartisan groups in recent years.

Martin said one reason voters have lost trust is because the party has only been showing up in the months before an election to ask for a vote, Martin said. Democrats have to put in the work and the face time to re-earn that trust.

“The first conversation that you should have with voters is just listening to them and hearing their hopes and aspirations, and eventually building a relationship of trust around shared values,” he said.

“One of the ways we re-earn it is by actually showing them that we give a damn about their community, about their family, being present and having conversations when it’s not a transaction, where we’re asking them to do something for me.”……….

DNC chair Ken Martin says ‘re-earning trust’ is key to unifying party before midterms

Martin says the party has to show voters that ‘Everything we’re for is exactly what the American people are for’

www.theguardian.com

 

[SystemShock]

There are plenty of things in the bible that reflects more on the times they were written but has no actual connections to what Jesus actually said or did. I’ve always wondered why Revelations was included in the Bible. In fact it was not a part of the orthodox church until after the 17th century. Revelations were written sometimes around 86 AD by someone with no direct contact with Jesus or any of his disciples, but by someone who "dreamed" therefor the name revelations. But it fit the norms of society at that time

It's Revelation, not Revelations.
What Jesus is alleged to have said and done; the gospels weren't written by Jesus.
The old testament doesn't have Jesus in it either, but it is in the Bible too.
Revelation is there as the prophesy of the messiah's return and the end of the world as we know it.