President Trump and First Lady have tested positive for Virus (Update: Trump to undergo televised ‘medical exam’ Friday night) (1 Viewer)

[MT15]

 

[N.O.Bronco]

It's not good for the country. It's not good for him personally, being high risk as he is, or his family. The politics involved are obvious. With how lax they have been with preventative protocols I'm not surprised but it certainly isn't something that I'm excited about or celebrating. This is unsettling for the country and my hope is that this FINALLY gets all Americans on board with how serious this virus is and the responsibility we all have to take preventative measures to mitigate its spread. It is way past time to stop forking around about your rights and mask up. Just a bad night all around imho.

I hope you are right, but short of him dying it will only embolden their ignorance. Because anything short of that and it will be massaged and manipulated into the current narrative that downplays the seriousness of the virus and turned scientific ignorance into a cultural identity. And Trump will be right out in front to push it. That is the legacy and path dependency of Trump’s absolutely toxic disinformation and inaction that has directly contributed to 200,000 dead Americans.

So I hope you are right, but my sense is that unless it is really bad, the right wing toxicity will only get more emboldened and more dangerous. And that dynamic that was set forth by Donald Trump illustrates pretty clearly why he is unfit to lead this country. As we are in a place where it will take the president’s literal death or severe suffering to undo the damage his corrosive narcissism has done to 40% of the country.

 

[First Time Poster]

@First Time Poster -

I normally agree with you but you left me at the last off ramp.

How is this not good for America? At worst, it should give pause to some of the troglodytes who think it is a hoax. At best, well I am not going to get ahead of myself.

National security for one. How do foreign bad actors respond to this? What about his decision making? Do any of us sincerely believe this Administration has prepped for such a scenario? They couldn't even get him to wear a mask routinely. How will his most radical supporters handle this? The markets are going to react with hostility towards this which causes financial distress. The country is knee deep in turmoil right now and POTUS and FLOTUS are positive for one of the most deadly viruses in ever. I don't see how any partisan political "gains" are worth the uncertainty and potential disastrous fallout we are facing.

 

[GrandAdmiral]

I don’t think we should celebrate this, either.

The Twitter world would disagree. #TrumpHasCOVID has been trending #1 and it might get worse once the rest of the world wakes up.

 

[Neworleansfan]

He’s partly responsible for more American deaths than it needs to be. No sympathy from here.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

National security for one. How do foreign bad actors respond to this? What about his decision making? Do any of us sincerely believe this Administration has prepped for such a scenario? They couldn't even get him to wear a mask routinely. How will his most radical supporters handle this? The markets are going to react with hostility towards this which causes financial distress. The country is knee deep in turmoil right now and POTUS and FLOTUS are positive for one of the most deadly viruses in ever. I don't see how any partisan political "gains" are worth the uncertainty and potential disastrous fallout we are facing.

You want me to be cruel?

If he dies or becomes incapacitated Pence is acting leader for a couple months. Frankly, that would likely be a lot better than Trump’s current leadership and attempt of tearing down democracy in cahoots with foreign dictators so he doesn’t lose in a fair and free election. At a minimum though, I don’t see any cause for moral panic.

Let’s also not pretend Trump is actually forking doing anything of note in the foreign policy space. The piece of shirt watches Fox News 6 hours a day and melts over The simplest domestic provocations. Hasn’t demonstrated even the simplest of understanding of foreign disputes unless it concerns his financial assets. Foreign policy would go on as it has, minus his ad hoc interjections, conducted by the career civil servants overseen by mostly incompetent Trump toadies. The markets may tank for a minute, but you know what? They aren’t reflecting Main Street and haven’t for decades.

Want me to be really honest? If this is in fact a place for deep discussion? Honest, real political discussion. Trump becoming severely incapacitated or dying would probably be the only thing that could truly shock the soul of his cult and actually foster/fracture/incapacitate the opposition enough so that necessary things could actually get done in this country(separate question of whether they would rise to the occasion and I have my doubts). Like robust stimulus, healthcare reform, climate legislation, Supreme Court reform, infrastructure spending, regulatory reform, political ethics reform etc. And if we are looking at a longer term view of this country it is far more preferable to the one where Trump either doesn’t get the virus or does so as an asymptomatic carrier. Where he simply use the situation to embolden ignorance and his toxic tribal identity politics. This reap what you sow moment would potentially break that. And that’s the cold political reality.

People can virtue signal all they want to show how objective they are by showing their deep concern for an evil president or liberals that don’t feign emotional support for the man that locked kids in cages, encouraged racial violence, and stood silent as Russians put bounties on our troops, but it is the cold truth of the American political reality Trump and his Republican Party has put us in. So I’ll preface because of the audience but not apologize.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

Beyond that seriousness though, I’m just really not gonna shame someone for having their catharsis moment.

200,000 are dead, 100’s of thousands unemployed or seeing reduced income because of this monster’s poor leadership, and the man most directly responsible for it now has it due to his own ghoulish ignorance ...IMO, make a meme if you want.

 

[LA - L.A.]

People can virtue signal all they want ...

This phrase has no place in any civil discussion. It is exclusively used insultingly and dismissively. It's always used to imply that a person is not being honest about their expressed opinions and values, and that they are just saying things to get the approval of others. Accusing someone of "virtue signalling" is purely a personal attack.

If anyone of us on here are guilty of "virtue signalling," then we are all guilty of "virtue signalling," because we are all expressing to others our opinions and our values. So even if people are "virtue signalling" calling someone else out for it is always going to be a "pot meet kettle" situation.

I'd very much like to see this phrase banned from usage on this board.

 

[DaveXA]

I'm not really shocked, but, this really isn't good news for a wide variety of reasons. FTP covered some of them. I can't stand Trump, but this isn't about him, right now all I'm thinking about is the Presidency and the impact this will have on a number of current, ongoing issues that remain urgent. Not to mention there were supposed to be 2 other debates before the election.

I'm a bit ambivalent about Trump getting CV19. But, I am concerned about the office he occupies and the impact on the country.

Either candidate winning isn’t a foregone conclusion. Everyone needs to get out and vote and not take the process for granted.

Clearly, 2020 isn't done with us yet.

 

[Taurus]

This phrase has no place in any civil discussion. It is exclusively used insultingly and dismissively. It's always used to imply that a person is not being honest about their expressed opinions and values, and that they are just saying things to get the approval of others. Accusing someone of "virtue signalling" is purely a personal attack.

If anyone of us on here are guilty of "virtue signalling," then we are all guilty of "virtue signalling," because we are all expressing to others our opinions and our values. So even if people are "virtue signalling" calling someone else out for it is always going to be a "pot meet kettle" situation.

I'd very much like to see this phrase banned from usage on this board.

It would be personal, if it was directed at a particular person.

Thing is, I know damn well I'm going to hear a ton of virtue signaling tomorrow. The public face/comments from some people will be 180* from what they've privately said to me.
So saying a general "people" is just addressing that phenomenon.

 

[Taurus]

I'm not really shocked, but, this really isn't good news for a wide variety of reasons. FTP covered some of them. I can't stand Trump, but this isn't about him, right now all I'm thinking about is the Presidency and the impact this will have on a number of current, ongoing issues that remain urgent. Not to mention there were supposed to be 2 other debates before the election.

I'm a bit ambivalent about Trump getting CV19. But, I am concerned about the office he occupies and the impact on the country.

Either candidate winning isn’t a foregone conclusion. Everyone needs to get out and vote and not take the process for granted.

Clearly, 2020 isn't done with us yet.

I can't think of a single issue where Trump's continued involvement is a good thing. Anyone who fears chaos or instability at POTUS being incapacitated hasn't, IMO, been paying attention to this particular POTUS.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

This phrase has no place in any civil discussion. It is exclusively used insultingly and dismissively. It's always used to imply that a person is not being honest about their expressed opinions and values, and that they are just saying things to get the approval of others. Accusing someone of "virtue signalling" is purely a personal attack.

If anyone of us on here are guilty of "virtue signalling," then we are all guilty of "virtue signalling," because we are all expressing to others our opinions and our values. So even if people are "virtue signalling" calling someone else out for it is always going to be a "pot meet kettle" situation.

I'd very much like to see this phrase banned from usage on this board.

It’s a term used where people try to express their adherence to the perceived normative values and preferences of a community and extol how aligned they are within it.

You can interpret it derogatorily or however you want, I would argue it’s largely human nature and when aligned right it’s a very good social reinforcement mechanism toward positive change. In this case it’s meant simply to address what I feel is the inevitable and predictable cycle of media and pundit-brain enthusiasts that see moments like this as a bat signal to let the world know how objective they are by stepping to their right and waging their fingers at their left in hopes of getting some good boy shoulder rubs from the right.

That nonsense is just over and done with to me. The president of the US is openly inciting violence and seeking to undermine and over rule the US electoral process and has played a major role in killing 200,000 Americans. The problem of this moment is not momentary catharsis from people rejoicing that chickens may have come home to roost, and it’s not that Americans are being too rude to the person leading that charge. Which I will gladly take over the people that, no matter the circumstance, no matter the obvious moral failures, reflexively seek out some fake moral middle ground to equivocate, slippery slope, or both sides an obviously one-sided calamity.

 

[LonghornSaint]

How can we be sure he actually has it? Would he really have tweeted this news? Could it not be some gimmick where in 3 or 4 days he tweets "have recovered and it was no big deal"? He has always been looking to downplay the severity and undermine the science dealing with this.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

How can we be sure he actually has it? Would he really have tweeted this news? Could it not be some gimmick where in 3 or 4 days he tweets "have recovered and it was no big deal"? He has always been looking to downplay the severity and undermine the science dealing with this.

Certainly wouldn’t put it past him based on his history of lying and disinformation to shift the short term news cycle. Seeing as he and his wife have several things it would be beneficial for the media to move on from.

The multiple reports from his physicians as well make me think it would be hard to get so many to lie for him, but maybe.

But your point about him coming out and declaring it no big deal sort of reinforced the sense of the dynamic I see at work. Where, unfortunately, anything short of life threatening or debilitating for Trump will be spun by his allies and used to embolden his supporters ignorance. Which will likely just make any future governance that much harder. As much as I loath the man with every fiber and see him as the potential ruin of this country, I don’t want him to die, and would rather see him live to face justice and serve the time, it’s just the shirtty dynamic that has been set up by this president and his party.

 

[barbar]

Certainly wouldn’t put it past him based on his history of lying and disinformation to shift the short term news cycle. Seeing as he and his wife have several things it would be beneficial for the media to move on from.

The multiple reports from his physicians as well make me think it would be hard to get so many to lie for him, but maybe.

But your point about him coming out and declaring it no big deal sort of reinforced the sense of the dynamic I see at work. Where, unfortunately, anything short of life threatening or debilitating for Trump will be spun by his allies and used to embolden his supporters ignorance. Which will likely just make any future governance that much harder. As much as I loath the man with every fiber and see him as the potential ruin of this country, I don’t want him to die, and would rather see him live to face justice and serve the time, it’s just the shirtty dynamic that has been set up by this president and his party.

I personally don't think he has it.

Is everyone still talking about the debate or his taxes??

There is the answer. Another distraction from the master.

 

[LA - L.A.]

I personally don't think he has it.

Is everyone still talking about the debate or his taxes??

There is the answer. Another distraction from the master.

I don't think he's as masterful as he's seen to be and this really doesn't fit his normal behavior. When he does distract, he does it by projecting strength and greatness. In his mind getting infected is a sign of weakness, so I really don't think he'd fake that.

Earlier today, my initial thought was that if he got infected he would struggle due to his age and general health. Having given it more thought, I think he's going to be fine.

He's been getting tested frequently which means they caught his infection early. He's going to get the best treatments and care medically available early enough that the viral load and subsequent level of illness will be kept to a minimum.

After he recovers, I fully expect him to use his recovery as "proof" that the testing and treatments we have make the virus no big deal. That would be true if we all had the same frequency of testing and access to medical treatments that he has as the president. We don't, which is why the virus is still very much a big deal.

 

[RobF]

He can't possibly have it. He told us he was taking hydroxychloroquine.

But seriously, I'd say he almost certainly does have it - I get why people are skeptical, but while on the one hand we have the fact that Trump can't be trusted about anything, on the other hand, he also bungles pretty much everything, so it seems inevitable that he'd catch this highly contagious virus, where discipline and alertness are necessary to limit the risks, at some point.

And he'll probably be absolutely fine. I'm seeing a lot of people pointing to the statistics about age and weight increasing risk, but those statistics might look a bit different if everyone could have their own personal 24/7 medical staff, on demand round the clock testing, and any antiviral treatment that might be beneficial provided immediately.

No certainties with disease of course. And while I don't wish harm on anyone, I kind of hope he does have as bad a time of it as many of the "almost nobody affected by it" have had, before making a recovery. Because if he doesn't, it seems likely he'll go straight back to saying it's nothing (while probably also contradictorily claiming he fought it off because of his 'good genes'), and he'd probably start behaving even more recklessly because he'd think he's definitely immune.

 

[barbar]

He can't possibly have it. He told us he was taking hydroxychloroquine.

But seriously, I'd say he almost certainly does have it - I get why people are skeptical, but while on the one hand we have the fact that Trump can't be trusted about anything, on the other hand, he also bungles pretty much everything, so it seems inevitable that he'd catch this highly contagious virus, where discipline and alertness are necessary to limit the risks, at some point.

And he'll probably be absolutely fine. I'm seeing a lot of people pointing to the statistics about age and weight increasing risk, but those statistics might look a bit different if everyone could have their own personal 24/7 medical staff, on demand round the clock testing, and any antiviral treatment that might be beneficial provided immediately.

No certainties with disease of course. And while I don't wish harm on anyone, I kind of hope he does have as bad a time of it as many of the "almost nobody affected by it" have had, before making a recovery. Because if he doesn't, it seems likely he'll go straight back to saying it's nothing (while probably also contradictorily claiming he fought it off because of his 'good genes'), and he'd probably start behaving even more recklessly because he'd think he's definitely immune.

Oh yes. If he doesn't get deathly ill he will use it as justification. I still lean towards publicity stunt, but as lax as he is about it, it is also possible that it's true.

Anyway, if he does get very ill we will never hear about it. He is ONLY going to project a positive outlook regardless.

As you say, it is hard to trust anything that he or anyone who works for him says.

 

[Krodwhodat]

One thing this will show us is that a lot of people who hate him for how he treats people or what he says will show everyone they are no different than he is. It doesn’t take a lot to be a compassionate decent human being regardless of who the person you show compassion to is. Because someone is a piece of shirt doesn’t make it ok for you to act like one also. With that said I pray he and his family a speedy recovery and that they come away unscathed.