Pence / Does he have ANY chance? (1 Viewer)

[SteveSBrickNJ]

Mike Pence seems to be laying the groundwork for a presidential run.
His plan apparently is to try to tie himself to the policies that were/are popular with Republican voters....yet...
greatly distance himself from former President Trump.
Hmmmm.
Good luck with that.

Pence unveils 'Freedom Agenda' as he weighs 2024 run

Former Vice President Mike Pence is offering a “Freedom Agenda” platform for Republicans ahead of this year's midterm elections, presenting a framework for GOP candidates — and possibly himself for a 2024 presidential run. Pence’s platform, released Thursday, combines traditional Republican...

www.yahoo.com

 

[Snarky Sack]

@Snarky Sack , I appreciate that you interact in a seemingly tireless manner with the posters on this forum. In the past, those same posters focused on me. I felt like it was 7 of them vs me and it was exhausting. I told them so and I often left them frustrated because I didn't respond to some of their posts.
Yet you've come along and answer everything. If you post something and someone challenges you they DO get the satisfaction of reading your response to their critique of your post.
So those are all positive things that I admire about you.
*

Thank you for those kind words!

*
But.......WHY do you support the candidate who is 1)Putin liking....2)morally bankrupt ......3)narcissistic.......and 4)unelectable in General Election.......Trump?
Why?
We conservatives need younger and higher quality leadership than him.
Your support of him is part of our country's problem.
You....just....make it worse.

I'll repost this to avoid some typing:

Trump Indictment ( includes NY AG and Fed documents case )

Former President D. Trump has been indicted by a New York Grand Jury. There will be much to talk about on this topic because this is just the first step in a lengthy process. Possibly it is worthy of its own thread here rather than posting about Trump's indictment in already existing threads...

madaboutpolitics.com

First of all, this is why I, Snarky Sack, support Trump. To understand why other support Trump, others should be consulted.

Secondly, I support Trump because he puts America first. I thought his candidacy was a joke, pretty much until he was elected and then I wondered how the heck this guy is going to govern?

Sure enough, he governed by acting on his promises. “Acting on,” not fulfilling completely, and I fault him for that.

He negotiated the remain in Mexico agreement, which was great for American citizens. He used tariffs of our own to negotiate more favorable agreements with other countries. This is the key difference between Trump and most presidents before him other than Reagan: Trump negotiated to either get a favorable deal for the U.S. or no deal at all.

Thirdly, at some point, the full extent of the DOJ/FBI pursuit of Trump during and after the election started to become known to the public. That galvanized me and many other Trump supporters. Nothing worse than a government within the government trying to overturn the results of an election.

Since that time, the phrase Illegitimi non carborundum has been reason enough to support Trump.

DeSantis would probably be a better president, depending on how tolerant the Entrenched Bureaucracy would be of him and how much he stood up to them. But I’ll support Trump in the primary.


If I wrote this today, I would probably include more reasons like his slowing the growth of regulations, how great his economy was before COVID, especially for African-American men, and how he managed not to get us into another war, while at the same time staying Putin's hand from invading Ukraine. Also, I would speak in stronger terms about the corruption of those in the DOJ/FBI who tried to overturn the 2016 election and influenced the 2020.

I'm also not so sure about DeSantis as I was then.

If I wanted to vote for a candidate with strong moral values, including a good record all his life, and with no questionable financial ties that could lead him to act to the detriment of the nation, who would I pick?

 

[bird]

Thank you for those kind words!

I'll repost this to avoid some typing:

Trump Indictment ( includes NY AG and Fed documents case )

Former President D. Trump has been indicted by a New York Grand Jury. There will be much to talk about on this topic because this is just the first step in a lengthy process. Possibly it is worthy of its own thread here rather than posting about Trump's indictment in already existing threads...

madaboutpolitics.com

First of all, this is why I, Snarky Sack, support Trump. To understand why other support Trump, others should be consulted.

Secondly, I support Trump because he puts America first. I thought his candidacy was a joke, pretty much until he was elected and then I wondered how the heck this guy is going to govern?

Sure enough, he governed by acting on his promises. “Acting on,” not fulfilling completely, and I fault him for that.

He negotiated the remain in Mexico agreement, which was great for American citizens. He used tariffs of our own to negotiate more favorable agreements with other countries. This is the key difference between Trump and most presidents before him other than Reagan: Trump negotiated to either get a favorable deal for the U.S. or no deal at all.

Thirdly, at some point, the full extent of the DOJ/FBI pursuit of Trump during and after the election started to become known to the public. That galvanized me and many other Trump supporters. Nothing worse than a government within the government trying to overturn the results of an election.

Since that time, the phrase Illegitimi non carborundum has been reason enough to support Trump.

DeSantis would probably be a better president, depending on how tolerant the Entrenched Bureaucracy would be of him and how much he stood up to them. But I’ll support Trump in the primary.


If I wrote this today, I would probably include more reasons like his slowing the growth of regulations, how great his economy was before COVID, especially for African-American men, and how he managed not to get us into another war, while at the same time staying Putin's hand from invading Ukraine. Also, I would speak in stronger terms about the corruption of those in the DOJ/FBI who tried to overturn the 2016 election and influenced the 2020.

I'm also not so sure about DeSantis as I was then.

If I wanted to vote for a candidate with strong moral values, including a good record all his life, and with no questionable financial ties that could lead him to act to the detriment of the nation, who would I pick?

Trump does not put America first. He is busy buttering up Xi, Putin, Kim. He has no moral compass, no set of principles beyond whatever he can do to enrich himself.

Don’t flatter yourself by thinking he is a conservative although based upon Empty Greene, Boebert, Gosar, Vance, Jordan, Tuberville et al he certainly is a conservative for today. Conservatism has become mental illness.

 

[SteveSBrickNJ]

I see. IF he is actually thinking that thru and everything you say is true....then I can agree. I am skeptical.

Happy to address the point. I get that Trump praising Putin upset a lot of Biden supporters and that they prefer Biden's criticisms of Putin. Here is my take on that:

Trump's approach to negotiations is much different from any other U.S. politician. Trump praises the foreign leaders that he negotiates with and gets what he wants out of them. One way he does that is to give them a way to save face. Most U.S. leaders prefer public bluster that interferes with negotiations but provides red meat to their supporters. Trump trusts his supporters to be smart enough to realize what he is doing.

Putin invaded the Crimea under Obama, and Ukraine under Biden, but no country that I know of under Trump. Biden publicly criticizes Putin, but he gave Putin the gift of authorizing the Nord Stream pipeline. At the time, he vowed to "bring an end to it" if Putin invaded Ukraine. He decline to answer how he would do that.



Say this for Biden: he apparently kept his word. Russia invaded, and an end was brought to the Nord Stream 2 in one of the worst ecological disasters in this decade. I hope no SEALs were harmed in getting that done.

I greatly prefer a president who praises a dictator to one who, as leader of the free world, watches Putin invade yet another smaller country, and then sends massive amounts of U.S. equipment and money with no particular plan for how that will get Russia out of Ukraine.

 

[SteveSBrickNJ]

Thank you for those kind words!

I'll repost this to avoid some typing:

Trump Indictment ( includes NY AG and Fed documents case )

Former President D. Trump has been indicted by a New York Grand Jury. There will be much to talk about on this topic because this is just the first step in a lengthy process. Possibly it is worthy of its own thread here rather than posting about Trump's indictment in already existing threads...

madaboutpolitics.com

First of all, this is why I, Snarky Sack, support Trump. To understand why other support Trump, others should be consulted.

Secondly, I support Trump because he puts America first. I thought his candidacy was a joke, pretty much until he was elected and then I wondered how the heck this guy is going to govern?

Sure enough, he governed by acting on his promises. “Acting on,” not fulfilling completely, and I fault him for that.

He negotiated the remain in Mexico agreement, which was great for American citizens. He used tariffs of our own to negotiate more favorable agreements with other countries. This is the key difference between Trump and most presidents before him other than Reagan: Trump negotiated to either get a favorable deal for the U.S. or no deal at all.

Thirdly, at some point, the full extent of the DOJ/FBI pursuit of Trump during and after the election started to become known to the public. That galvanized me and many other Trump supporters. Nothing worse than a government within the government trying to overturn the results of an election.

Since that time, the phrase Illegitimi non carborundum has been reason enough to support Trump.

DeSantis would probably be a better president, depending on how tolerant the Entrenched Bureaucracy would be of him and how much he stood up to them. But I’ll support Trump in the primary.


If I wrote this today, I would probably include more reasons like his slowing the growth of regulations, how great his economy was before COVID, especially for African-American men, and how he managed not to get us into another war, while at the same time staying Putin's hand from invading Ukraine. Also, I would speak in stronger terms about the corruption of those in the DOJ/FBI who tried to overturn the 2016 election and influenced the 2020.

I'm also not so sure about DeSantis as I was then.

If I wanted to vote for a candidate with strong moral values, including a good record all his life, and with no questionable financial ties that could lead him to act to the detriment of the nation, who would I pick?

I must admit that when Trump was halfway through his term I recognized and was appreciative about what you describe regarding his negotiating style. That being: "Either it benefits the USA or no deal!" This WAS indeed his approach.
That's not adequate reason for me to support him now though.

 

[bird]

I must admit that when Trump was halfway through his term I recognized and was appreciative about what you describe regarding his negotiating style. That being: "Either it benefits the USA or no deal!" This WAS indeed his approach.
That's not adequate reason for me to support him now though.

Trump did not negotiate in such a manner. Oh, his PR method was that. Unfortunately his results sucked. The alleged renegotiation of NAFTA was an utter failure. It did result in any meaningful changes benefiting U.S. exports.

 

[Optimus Prime]

 

[SteveSBrickNJ]

Didn't Dr. Martin Luther King say that he dreamed of a day when people were judged by the content of their character rather than the color of their skin?
I ask that rhetorically ....because we know that he said that.
So then I float this idea....I'm NOT telling anyone how to feel. Not deciding for others.
Not speaking with conviction of being correct. I'm just floating my thoughts....ok?
I'm floating my thoughts just in case they have any value.
So....here I go...
Universities should accept students based on their merits.
Based on their grades.
Based on the (free of charge) school clubs or school organizations they opted to participate in.
Universities (I'm floating this opinion) should select well rounded students based on their application-qualification.
If that student is qualified but needs financial help then give that student scholarships or beyond scholarships.
Yet in the end, students are admitted based on what I just stated above.
Almost all (if not all) public high schools have extra curricular activities. One can't say that only the middle class and upper class students have those.
Admission into a University?
Race probably should not factor into it?
Again....financial needs should be looked at with compassion.........but admitting students based on their grades and extra curricular participation seems the most fair approach to all citizens......AND it seems to be in line with the spirit of Dr. MLK's speech. Does it not?
These are my thoughts......hopefully they will be received respectfully.

 

[Taurus]

Didn't Dr. Martin Luther King say that he dreamed of a day when people were judged by the content of their character rather than the color of their skin?
I ask that rhetorically ....because we know that he said that.
So then I float this idea....NOT telling anyone how to feel. Not deciding for others.
Not.....ok?
I'm just floating my thoughts just in case they have any value.
Universities should accept students based on their merits.
Based on their grades.
Based on the (free of charge) school clubs or school organizations they opted to participate in.
Universities (I'm floating this opinion) should select well rounded students based on their application-qualification.
If that student is qualified but needs financial help then give that student scholarships or beyond scholarships.
Yet in the end, students are admitted based on what I just stated above.
Almost all (if not all) public high schools have extra curricular activities. One can't say that only the middle class and upper class students have those.
Admission into a University?
Race probably should not factor into it?
Again....financial needs should be looked at with compassion.........but admitting students based on their grades and extra curricular participation seems the most fair approach to all citizens......AND it seems to be in line with the spirit of Dr. MLK's speech. Does it not?
These are my thoughts......hopefully they will be received respectfully.

In a better world.

Unfortunately, study after study shows that LaRonda Washington doesn't get accepted while Charles St Smythe III does. Despite having identical qualifications.
This happens with loans and other governmental/official interactions as well. That's why it's called "institutional" racism.

Until these studies repeatedly come back with little to no statistical difference, we do need some form of "affirmative action" as a counterbalance.

 

[MT15]

And, while there’s little doubt that institutional racism has improved since Jim Crow days, we still know that majority black schools are very often severely underfunded compared to majority white schools. Their buildings are neglected, programs are lacking supplies and resources, no Wi-Fi, etc.

I did read where colleges and universities are talking about moving to an “adversity score” that will take into account things like underfunded schools, personal poverty, etc. I think that could be a very good plan at first hearing about it. It would give a boost to white students from Appalachia as well as black kids from the inner city.

 

[Optimus Prime]

In a better world.

Unfortunately, study after study shows that LaRonda Washington doesn't get accepted while Charles St Smythe III does. Despite having identical qualifications.
This happens with loans and other governmental/official interactions as well. That's why it's called "institutional" racism.

Until these studies repeatedly come back with little to no statistical difference, we do need some form of "affirmative action" as a counterbalance.

My understanding is those studies also show that LaRonda can have better qualifications than Charles and still not get accepted

 

[Optimus Prime]

Didn't Dr. Martin Luther King say that he dreamed of a day when people were judged by the content of their character rather than the color of their skin?
I ask that rhetorically ....because we know that he said that.
So then I float this idea....I'm NOT telling anyone how to feel. Not deciding for others.
Not speaking with conviction of being correct. I'm just floating my thoughts....ok?
I'm floating my thoughts just in case they have any value.
So....here I go...
Universities should accept students based on their merits.
Based on their grades.
Based on the (free of charge) school clubs or school organizations they opted to participate in.
Universities (I'm floating this opinion) should select well rounded students based on their application-qualification.
If that student is qualified but needs financial help then give that student scholarships or beyond scholarships.
Yet in the end, students are admitted based on what I just stated above.
Almost all (if not all) public high schools have extra curricular activities. One can't say that only the middle class and upper class students have those.
Admission into a University?
Race probably should not factor into it?
Again....financial needs should be looked at with compassion.........but admitting students based on their grades and extra curricular participation seems the most fair approach to all citizens......AND it seems to be in line with the spirit of Dr. MLK's speech. Does it not?
These are my thoughts......hopefully they will be received respectfully.

In a perfect world you'd be absolutely correct

Yes, in a perfect world race shouldn't matter in college admissions

Just like it shouldn't matter in job applications

Just like it shouldn't matter in bank loans or business loans

Just like it shouldn't matter in sentencing

Just like it shouldn't matter in school discipline

Just like it shouldn't matter in home appraisals

Just like it shouldn't matter in any number of things

But this isn't a perfect world and it does matter. There are so many examples in threads here and on EE showing how it matters

It seems like the only time I hear the MLK quote lately it's to argue against anything meant to specifically help minorities

"What happened to content of their character?????"

 

[SteveSBrickNJ]

In a perfect world you'd be absolutely correct

Yes, in a perfect world race shouldn't matter in college admissions

Just like it shouldn't matter in job applications

Just like it shouldn't matter in bank loans or business loans

Just like it shouldn't matter in sentencing

Just like it shouldn;t matter in school discipline

Just like it shouldn't matter in home appraisals

Just like it shouldn't matter in any number of things

But this isn't a perfect world and it does matter. There are so many examples in threads here and on EE showing how it matters

It seems like the only time I hear the MLK quote lately it's to argue against anything meant to specifically help minorities

"What happened to content of their character?????"

Well why are some people NOT interested in helping the American Born Citizens who happen to have grandparents who came to America from Asia? They are people of color also. Yet I have viewed articles and seen tv reports on how Asian HS graduates finished #1 in their graduating class but EVERY Ivy League University in the nation did not accept them. It SEEMS like they are discriminated against because they are the "wrong color"? That is why I personally wish that color was irrelevant. All citizens should be treated equally. And if you come back with the PERFECT WORLD talking point....then give favorable treat to Asians as well as people of a darker complexion. " Red and Yellow Black and White..they are precious in HIS sight. Jesus loves the little children of the world "

 

[MT15]

Well why are some people NOT interested in helping the American Born Citizens who happen to have grandparents who came to America from Asia? They are people of color also. Yet I have viewed articles and seen tv reports on how Asian HS graduates finished #1 in their graduating class but EVERY Ivy League University in the nation did not accept them. It SEEMS like they are discriminated against because they are the "wrong color"? That is why I personally wish that color was irrelevant. All citizens should be treated equally. And if you come back with the PERFECT WORLD talking point....then give favorable treat to Asians as well as people of a darker complexion. " Red and Yellow Black and White..they are precious in HIS sight. Jesus loves the little children of the world "

Every person who finishes at the top of their high school class cannot attend an Ivy League school, they are small schools, enrollment wise. There just isn’t room for every valedictorian.

We cannot treat everyone equally because people are not treated equally anywhere in society. That’s wrong, but accurate.

College admissions are a tricky thing. Ivy League schools give a boost to students from the Midwest, I am told. Why? Who knows…..

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

..................................

College admissions are a tricky thing. Ivy League schools give a boost to students from the Midwest, I am told. Why? Who knows…..

I know schools like Bowdoin College and other hard to get into small northeastern colleges, Williams, Amherst, etc., did give a leg up to "students from the Midwest". Why? Diversity. So many students came from the coasts. Particularly the east coast.

 

[CoolBrees]

Equality isn't possible in society.

Equity, on the other hand, is.

But the problem equity has is that my fellow cis-white guys are too fragile to act on a level playing field. Most of us weren't lucky enough to have military parents to drive the benefits and importance of society like I was. That teamwork and each member is critical to success of something bigger than you.

Most were taught the bootstrap nonsense by ungrateful and lazy Boomers who did nothing but destroy what their parents built.

 

[Snarky Sack]

Equality isn't possible in society.

Equity, on the other hand, is.

But the problem equity has is that my fellow cis-white guys are too fragile to act on a level playing field. Most of us weren't lucky enough to have military parents to drive the benefits and importance of society like I was. That teamwork and each member is critical to success of something bigger than you.

Most were taught the bootstrap nonsense by ungrateful and lazy Boomers who did nothing but destroy what their parents built.

What is equity, and how can we achieve it?

 

[Optimus Prime]

Equality isn't possible in society.

Equity, on the other hand, is.

What is equity, and how can we achieve it?

 

[CoolBrees]

Thank you - that was exactly the graphic I was going to answer with when I had a moment.