Now is not the time to talk about gun control (1 Viewer)

[brandon]

T&P

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[BullSheetBuddha]

AR-15 creates not a hole but a ‘cavity’ in body, St. Luke’s surgeon says of rifle’s devastating power

Americans are becoming familiar with the AR-15 because of its notoriety as the preferred weapon of mass shooters. None are more aware of its damage than the nation’s trauma surgeons, including those in the Lehigh Valley, where 10 people were wounded after a mass shooting in Allentown involving...

www.mcall.com

 

[Semper]

I think muzzle velocity makes all the difference. You yourself pointed that out. That’s the difference between the 22 and the AR-15. That’s the difference between the small bullet wound, and swabbing for DNA to identify the victim because the head/face is gone. But you should know this, Semper. I’m honestly surprised you are acting like there isn’t a difference just because the size of the rounds are similar. Go read a medical forum where ED docs describe the damage done to the victims of these massacres. I mean, an 18 yo with no shooting experience doesn’t kill all those people with a 22. With an AR-15, it’s easy. You know this.

You misunderstand my my man. I am honestly trying to say how do we do it? California tried and it didn’t work. I was simply saying it can’t be done by caliber. I think the best ways are things being discussed on the Saints forum. Insurance, age requirements, licensing, training, registration. Those are things we can do. You have known me long enough to know I am sensible about gun laws. You should remember that after Sandy Hook I sold my AR’s. What we need is to convince politicians to vote for what’s right instead of worrying about the next election.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

You misunderstand my my man..................... I was simply saying it can’t be done by caliber..................

BS, you said an M16 couldn't blow the top of someone's skull off. You called me a liar. You're full of it my man.

 

[Semper]

BS, you said an M16 couldn't blow the top of someone's skull off. You called me a liar. You're full of it my man.

I did not. I said I call bull. I have seen the impact of an AR. I know for a fact that bullet is designed to tumble when it makes impact. If you say it happened I have no way of disproving it just as you have no way of proving you did it. I am done talking guns with you because I don’t believe any further discussion between you and I would provide any good results for this thread. You can ask moderators here about my record and thoughts concerning firearms and laws. You can go dig up the Sandy hook thread on Saints Report and see my response. You can also have a nice day.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

I did not. I said I call bull. I have seen the impact of an AR. I know for a fact that bullet is designed to tumble when it makes impact. If you say it happened I have no way of disproving it just as you have no way of proving you did it. I am done talking guns with you because I don’t believe any further discussion between you and I would provide any good results for this thread. You can ask moderators here about my record and thoughts concerning firearms and laws. You can go dig up the Sandy hook thread on Saints Report and see my response. You can also have a nice day.

Yeah, you're through because you're full of BS.

 

[Semper]

Yeah, you're through because you're full of BS.

Yawn…. You appear to be illiterate as well.

 

[zztop]

I just can't with this topic today.
his wife was one of the teachers killed, and he died from grief.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

Yawn…. You appear to be illiterate as well.

I know exactly what you've said, young fella. Get lost.

 

[Semper]

I just can't with this topic today.
his wife was one of the teachers killed, and he died from grief.

I saw that on the Saints board. I read he left a couple of small children behind as well. God those poor kids.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

I just can't with this topic today.
his wife was one of the teachers killed, and he died from grief.

I heard Semper say that grief tumbles so this couldn't have happened.

 

[SystemShock]

IDK. I think we need to get past this idea that there is some perfect gun law that's going to perfectly target only the weapons that these mass shooters are using. What we need to do now is to pass gun laws to slow the trend down. Even if those gun laws aren't perfect and have some ambiguity by using terms like "assault riffle" in them (like the recent CRT and LGBTQ laws that may Republican states have passed). We also need laws that limit the potential lethality of weapons, especially as it concerns mass causality incidents. Specifics can be worked out in court or in successive legislations.

The point right now is that we need a change of the status quo and our gun culture. The needle needs to be moved to take this issue off the 3rd rail and force legislators to start dealing with and addressing this issue instead of offering empty platitudes.

We also need massive public awareness campaigns talking about the dangers of owning guns and how unsafe they are in your home, (even when a person is a legal gun owner). We need universal background checks, effective red flag laws, and gun registration laws. We need to study gun violence as a public health issue. We need a system to monitor when people are buying a lot of guns and rounds in a condensed period of time, body armor, etc, so that it triggers some review/intervention by local law enforcement. They need to at least ask question and maybe review that persons social media posting to determine if they're an immediate danger to their local community.

There's a lot we need to do, but finding the perfect gun law isn't some panacea.

I agree with you.

My only point really, is that one needs a modicum of knowledge if the subject one's arguing for or against. Especially when it comes to firearms, given the language that is used to enact regulations (or deregulate, for that matter). Think about the post I replied to, where the poster says "I can see why someone would have an M4, but not an AR-15", when they are basically the same thing. "OK, we are banning AR-15's, but we still can use M4's" See what I am saying?

The picture I posted, I posted because that is a Glock 17 pistol with a housing that essentially makes it a short rifle that can semi-auto fire up to 50 rounds of 9mm. It will definitely not qualified as a military style rifle, you don't need any special permit for it, but in short ranges, it can do as much damage and kill just as good as any rifle, and it is much easier to wield in rooms/small areas.

A lot of the laws and regulations of firearms don't deal with names or styles, they deal with specifications. I am simply saying that we need to learn that lingo.

 

[coldseat]

The threats are multiplying like rabbits here in Texas. This state has lost its mind.

A Texas school district will shut down all campuses Thursday, May 26, and Friday, May 27, after a mass shooting threat was reported to the police. Donna Independent School District announced on its Facebook page that it has decided to close all schools in light of recent events and out of an abundance of caution.

The district, which is in the Rio Grande Valley area near McAllen, stated the safety of its staff and students are its main priority. According to The Monitor, an AK-47 and a list of targeted students were found by law enforcement officers in the home of one of the suspects.

According to the publication, two to three people were involved in the foiled plot to open fire on one of its campuses. Donna ISD superintendent Angela Dominguez told the news outlet she cannot comment on the details of the situation, but confirmed they will be shutting down and said they are taking action out of an abundance of caution.

Seguin student arrested after threat to bring weapon to school

Threats have been made at multiple schools across the state. Here's what we know about...

www.mysanantonio.com

 

[MT15]

You misunderstand my my man. I am honestly trying to say how do we do it? California tried and it didn’t work. I was simply saying it can’t be done by caliber. I think the best ways are things being discussed on the Saints forum. Insurance, age requirements, licensing, training, registration. Those are things we can do. You have known me long enough to know I am sensible about gun laws. You should remember that after Sandy Hook I sold my AR’s. What we need is to convince politicians to vote for what’s right instead of worrying about the next election.

BTW: not a man, lol.

So let’s start with rifles that have certain characteristics- high muzzle speed, light weight, capability of firing repeatedly in a few seconds, etc.

I know the caliber isn’t as important as muzzle speed, and I don’t know anything about guns. I also knew what System showed wasn’t a rifle as soon as I saw it, so I just don’t buy the idea that it cannot be done. We can do anything we set our minds to in America. Just because CA tried it and it didn’t work doesn’t mean we give up, we tweak the law and keep at it.

When America decided to tackle highway fatalities, it didn’t just all of a sudden work - it took some research and trial and error. When America decided it wasn’t cool for airplanes to crash, it took some time and effort. But to just say, (and I‘m not talking about you personally, but most gun enthusiasts) it cannot be done is self-defeating and feels like it’s saying - the kids just have to die.

Sure, absolutely do the things you are talking about - they will all help. But I just saw a former law enforcement officer on TV say that a killer in a locked room with an AR-15 could kill 30 people in 40 seconds. Why does anyone in the civilian world need this type of weapon?

 

[MT15]

I heard Semper say that grief tumbles so this couldn't have happened.

Okay - I get that your pride was hurt, and possibly Semper shouldn’t have doubted your experiences. But at the same time, Semper is actually good people, and you should both show some grace here. We are all on the same side here, really.

 

[SystemShock]

This is NRA BS. "If you ban such and such they'll just use X, Y, or Z. "

For crying out loud, ban the AR15 and we can move on from there.

Sure, let's ban AR-15s. Then manufacturers will change a small specification on the rifle that will make it qualify as something other than an AR-15, and back were we were in a flash. Or we'll see a surge on AKs, or ACRs, or FALs...

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

The picture I posted, I posted because that is a Glock 17 pistol with a housing that essentially makes it a short rifle that can semi-auto fire up to 50 rounds of 9mm. It will definitely not qualified as a military style rifle, you don't need any special permit for it, but in short ranges, it can do as much damage and kill just as good as any rifle, and it is much easier to wield in rooms/small areas.

AR15 vs. 9mm

 

[MT15]

The people of TX have voted for these guys for far too long. Cruz’s idea about one door is beyond idiotic.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

Sure, let's ban AR-15s. Then manufacturers will change a small specification on the rifle that will make it qualify as something other than an AR-15, and back were we were in a flash. Or we'll see a surge on AKs, or ACRs, or FALs...

Oh, ok, lets not ban the AR15. I mean why would we?