How to improve American Education in 2021. (3 Viewers)

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Paul

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The most recent PISA results, from 2015, placed the U.S. an unimpressive 38th out of 71 countries in math and 24th in science. Among the 35 members of the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, which sponsors the PISA initiative, the U.S. ranked 30th in math and 19th in science.


My suggestion is rather simple.

1. Study why immigrants from East Asia, India, and Nigeria do well with American education. Apply that insight to other groups (if possible).
2. Manage public schools as if though they were private schools with uniforms and discipline.
3. Create high end special schools for those that are truly disenfranchised.
4. Create a force of social workers to treat family dysfunction with regards to education.
5. Reduce the curriculum to the simple basics and repeat that on a yearly basis.
6. At about 10th grade divide college bound students away from non-college bound.
7. Provide solid basic education and trade training for non-college bound kids. There is no point in offering free college to these kids.
 
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Paul

Paul

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What you’re missing is intelligence vs desire. Why do you think Asians outperform in computation and other areas. An A- is an Asian F. To deny that Asians put an enormous amount of pressure on their children is simply false. https://www.humanium.org/en/child-suicide-in-japan-the-leading-cause-of-death-in-children/ I would also doubt if Asians are any more intelligent than anyone else. Their drive to succeed though isn’t easily matched. Asian issues come up when it comes to interpersonal skills (due to being focused on task and less interpersonal skill development growing up) and they do fall behind in problem solving. Something the Japanese realized in the 80s as the raising and education of their youth did great in one way, but was lacking in the creativity and problem solving of the American education system. And here again, very few of the Asian population is at the level that you think. They are not all your stereotype.
Actually, you’d be surprised. It’s your more well to do who throw a fit about kids cleaning the school. Where I’m at, we have no issues whatsoever with it, only issue is that with Covid restrictions it’s become more difficult.
Past this I’m done. You have your agenda. Fine. You go.
They are less creative. However, those high sat scores help them earn more than Caucasians
 

JRad

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That is ok, we all suffer from confirmation bias and you are no exception.
What the actual hell are you babbling about? You tried doing some weird gaslight about not saying something I literally quoted, so you deflect with more nonsense? You’re gonna sit there and flat out accuse me of lying? To what end? You aren’t the bastion of knowledge you think you are. Put me on your ignore list, you condescending meanie.
 

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The educational gap is a big contributor to the wealth gap. We are living in the most prosperous time in world history and yet you guys show little compassion to the people that are in perennial despair living in neighborhoods with no good education.

The plan is expensive, but is targeted to descendants of slaves. It is reparations and will not be available to other minorities or women. The problem with other programs is that it benefited people that did not really need that much help such as white women, immigrants, and blacks from Africa rather than America.

As for healthcare I favor Medicare for all.

You're whining about mandates and wanting to remove kids to send them to private schools as you complain about wasted money and simultaneously talking about spending trillions to duplicate the world's most expensive and elite private schools.

You're accusing those who think actual public school and opportunity would are worthy with having no compassion for the poor as you plot to rip their kids away and put them in what I must assume would be right-wing, elitist indoctrination camps.

are you mad?
 

dtc

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This isn't so much the mask slipping - it was already pretty loose - as it is the mask being thrown away, and the dog whistle replaced with a bullhorn.

So Paul's plan is take 'poor kids', by which he means African American boys, from 'dysfunctional homes', by which he means the homes of African American families, during the week so that tutors can take the place of 'parents that have no interest in educating their kids', by which he means African American parents, so they can be turned into 'polite educated gentlemen'.

And he excludes women from this because... reasons.

Frankly, I don't think that deserves any response beyond stating that it's racist, sexist, bigoted, and ignorant.

You forgot stupid.
 
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Paul

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You're whining about mandates and wanting to remove kids to send them to private schools
Yes, I want those that live in extreme poverty to go to elite schools.
as you complain about wasted money and simultaneously talking about spending trillions to duplicate the world's most expensive and elite private schools.
The elite schools would be slavery reparations and not available to all. The number of schools would be relatively small as it seems many would not send their kids.
You're accusing those who think actual public school and opportunity would are worthy with having no compassion for the poor as you plot to rip their kids away and put them in what I must assume would be right-wing, elitist indoctrination camps.
Right wing???????? You think it is right wing to have the government provide state of the art education for the disenfranchised? You think it is right wing to provide the parents with a better alternative for schooling?
are you mad?
Do you have an argument?
I will not report your vituperative insolent remark.
 

dtc

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Yes, I want those that live in extreme poverty to go to elite schools.

The elite schools would be slavery reparations and not available to all. The number of schools would be relatively small as it seems many would not send their kids.

Right wing???????? You think it is right wing to have the government provide state of the art education for the disenfranchised? You think it is right wing to provide the parents with a better alternative for schooling?

Do you have an argument?
I will not report your vituperative insolent remark.

Sorry, but I just don't see most reasonable people support kidnapping the descendants of slaves in order that they might be raised by whomever you seem to think is suitable.

Forced whitewashing as reparation just sounds so 1984.
 
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Paul

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Sorry, but I just don't see most reasonable people support kidnapping the descendants of slaves in order that they might be raised by whomever you seem to think is suitable.

Forced whitewashing as reparation just sounds so 1984.
To stew in one's own juice is not the answer.

The USA is rapidly evolving into "have and have not" people. The elite upper classes intermarry and preserve the cast system. The rate of marriage among those that are highly educated and in the upper brackets of income is much higher than among the low socioeconomic class. They make sure their children have upward mobility. It is no accident that Chris Cuomo went to Yale because he was the son of Mario Cuomo. All four kids kids of Al Gore went to Harvard. Meanwhile those at the other end of the spectrum stagnate in the lower brackets while thinking that a politician is coming to save them.

Many POC have climbed to the middle and middle-upper class, but a large number remain poor. The gap in education plays a large role in the wealth gap.

What do you mean by white wash? Are you insinuating that black kids should not have white teachers?
1984? Do you realize that 1984 was about extreme socialism.?
 
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dtc

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To stew in one's own juice is not the answer.

The USA is rapidly evolving into "have and have not" people. The elite upper classes intermarry and preserve the cast system. The rate of marriage among those that are highly educated and in the upper brackets of income is much higher than among the low socioeconomic class. They make sure their children have upward mobility. It is no accident that Chris Cuomo went to Yale because he was the son of Mario Cuomo. All four kids kids of Al Gore went to Harvard. Meanwhile those at the other end of the spectrum stagnate in the lower brackets while thinking that a politician is coming to save them.

Many POC have climbed to the middle and middle-upper class, but a large number remain poor. The gap in education plays a large role in the wealth gap.

What do you mean by white wash? Are you insinuating that black kids should not have white teachers?
1984? Do you realize that 1984 was about extreme socialism.?

What I'm realizing is that you are beyond my ability to deal with.

You are suggesting removing kids from their families in order to force them into whatever sorts of publicly funded private school you've dreamed up in order to indoctrinate them into some artificial upper middle class whiteness and yet you seem to not give a damn about the legal, moral or rational reason why other approaches would be better.

Perhaps, instead of going all the way to abduction and forced reeducation camps, we ought to start with something legal and potentially successful.

Or, you can simply convince this society to vote for mass internment camps for low income minority students.

One question, are you going to kidnap both male and female or are you only worried about turning black male youth into gentlemen as you said?
 
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Paul

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What I'm realizing is that you are beyond my ability to deal with.

You are suggesting removing kids from their families in order to force them into whatever sorts of publicly funded private school you've dreamed up in order to indoctrinate them into some artificial upper middle class whiteness and yet you seem to not give a damn about the legal, moral or rational reason why other approaches would be better.

Perhaps, instead of going all the way to abduction and forced reeducation camps, we ought to start with something legal and potentially successful.

Or, you can simply convince this society to vote for mass internment camps for low income minority students.

One question, are you going to kidnap both male and female or are you only worried about turning black male youth into gentlemen as you said?
As a young man I wanted my son to be a gentleman and I wanted my four daughters to behave like ladies. So shoot me!
The school is voluntary, no one forces to do anything in America. However, I suspect if such schools existed the responsible parents would make a line to get their children accepted.

By the way being a gentleman is colorless.

The abduction and kidnapping you talk about is a weak straw man. By the way your sophistry needs a lot of work.
 

RobF

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What I'm realizing is that you are beyond my ability to deal with.
The only way you deal with this racist, sexist, tripe is by simply making it clear that's what it is, and then showing it the door.

As a young man I wanted my son to be a gentleman and I wanted my four daughters to behave like ladies. So shoot me!
This is in response to being ask whether this proposed system for producing 'polite educated gentlemen' should be made available to both men and women, or just men, as previously stated. The clear implication is that only 'gentlemen' need to be educated. Sexist, and wrong.

However, I suspect if such schools existed the responsible parents would make a line to get their children accepted.
And this is patently disingenuous, since he's already stated that his notion is that tutors in school would be "taking the place of parents" (by which he means descendants of slaves who are parents, i.e. African American parents) who are part of "dysfunctional homes" and "have no interest in educating their kids". His entire premise is that all these parents - specifically descendants of slaves - aren't responsible. Which is racist, and wrong.

It is a ludicrous proposal based on notions that are racist, sexist, and wrong. It deserves no indulgence whatsoever beyond making that clear.
 

Goatman saint

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The only way you deal with this racist, sexist, tripe is by simply making it clear that's what it is, and then showing it the door.


This is in response to being ask whether this proposed system for producing 'polite educated gentlemen' should be made available to both men and women, or just men, as previously stated. The clear implication is that only 'gentlemen' need to be educated. Sexist, and wrong.


And this is patently disingenuous, since he's already stated that his notion is that tutors in school would be "taking the place of parents" (by which he means descendants of slaves who are parents, i.e. African American parents) who are part of "dysfunctional homes" and "have no interest in educating their kids". His entire premise is that all these parents - specifically descendants of slaves - aren't responsible. Which is racist, and wrong.

It is a ludicrous proposal based on notions that are racist, sexist, and wrong. It deserves no indulgence whatsoever beyond making that clear.
Like I said before. He essentially wants to do what they did with native Americans for years. Take them away from their dysfunctional (his view) parents, put them in a boarding school, destroy their culture, and have the teachers become their parents and show them that the white way is better. Oh wait sorry. Show them an entirely different life and make them into good polite white… dang it there it goes again…. gentleman who will be able to fit into white… dang it starting to feel like Dr Strangelove… upper class culture so that as they grow up they can be better than their poor dysfunctional black parents who are uneducated savages who can’t possibly raise a good child.
 
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Paul

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Like I said before. He essentially wants to do what they did with native Americans for years. Take them away from their dysfunctional (his view) parents, put them in a boarding school, destroy their culture, and have the teachers become their parents and show them that the white way is better. Oh wait sorry. Show them an entirely different life and make them into good polite white… dang it there it goes again…. gentleman who will be able to fit into white… dang it starting to feel like Dr Strangelove… upper class culture so that as they grow up they can be better than their poor dysfunctional black parents who are uneducated savages who can’t possibly raise a good child.
The above post is a straw man. Being polite and a gentleman has ZERO relationship to racial group.
Dysfunctional parents come in all colors.

In any event I will not mention great schools for the underprivileged.


What would you propose to elevated the quality of education?
 

samiam5211

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The above post is a straw man. Being polite and a gentleman has ZERO relationship to racial group.
Dysfunctional parents come in all colors.

In any event I will not mention great schools for the underprivileged.


What would you propose to elevated the quality of education?

Do you believe that everyone defines "polite" and "gentleman" the same way?
 

Goatman saint

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The above post is a straw man. Being polite and a gentleman has ZERO relationship to racial group.
Dysfunctional parents come in all colors.

In any event I will not mention great schools for the underprivileged.


What would you propose to elevated the quality of education?
You have consistently shown absolutely no respect for how others live, the quality of their lives, their sense of community, how they respect others. You simply want them to be what you see is an ideal. That ideal IS upper income white. You want to erase their family, their identity and their culture with the boarding schools. That’s what they been traditionally used for in this setting.
And yes dysfunctional parents come in all races and incomes. Yet you consistently focus on poor black males. Only males. That’s it. You bypass females and every other ethnic and racial group. There are problems all over this country. However, lower educated people can still be happy. Can still raise wonderful children. Still achieve success, and live a full life. You dismiss all of this. Their lives mean nothing to you unless they are properly educated gentlemen.
I simply go tired of your innuendo and your garbage and called you out. And I’ll stand by it. I get so tired of the idea that a person is a failure if they don’t have a big wad of cash, a big house, expensive cars and a nice 401k.
So, you tell me. What is 1 concrete thing you will do today to make someone’s life, their education, their future better? At the end of today come back and answer this. 1 concrete thing YOU did to help one of the poor unwashed masses become better
 
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Paul

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Do you believe that everyone defines "polite" and "gentleman" the same way?
I can recognized politeness and acting in a proper manner when I see it. I also understand that there are cultural variations. However, humans are fundamentally the same when it comes to treating others with respect and dignity.

What do you propose to improve the education system in poor areas?
 

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