Explain how Trump has so much support (1 Viewer)

[Bayouboy]

I would like some layman answers to the question "How does Trump have so much support, right now"? The final two word are important context.

I somewhat understand how he became a "force" prior to the 2016 election. There were many factors that allowed him to gain steam. Anti-establishment and not being a true politician was a big turn on to some voters on the right at the time. He talked a good game and somehow found a way to the Presidency despite acting "unpresidential". Trump's time in office had some victories for the Republicans and the economy was humming prior to COVID.....but the shirt show that happened on a daily basis with him firing executive staff (that didn't agree with him) and the overall chaos that was the White House certainly should've had an effect on his supporters. This was all BEFORE losing the 2020 election and what ensued. What happened after the 2020 election is well documented and, in my opinion, should have buried him as a candidate for office for eternity.

With ALL of what happened since the 2020 election, how can he still have half of the country (give or take) as supporters? Had all the election denying, countless gaffs, and the attempt to circumvent the Constitution had not occurred and had he regrouped and formed a strategy to compete in 2024, I could see a lot of his supporters continuing to follow him and his message. But I can't get how so many Americans can overlook what happened in front of their own eyes. I am truly bewildered.

I realize this is a mostly left leaning community, so maybe you folks do not have a clue either but would like to hear opinions. Especially, if you still support Trump through all of the mess.

 

[Heathen]

Biden had no choice but to support Israel. Further, he tried to talk Netanyahu out of the kind of bombing Israel decided to turn to, and further still, Biden has had a lot to do with the pause and hostage exchanges. So, much of the young's growing dissatisfaction with Biden is based on ignorance. It's not like he said, go ahead Israel, kick their arse.

Sure - i'm sure any US president would be pressured to support whatever the military industrial complex needs, no matter how principled their personal views are. I don't think many assume otherwise.

So I'm not sure how it's 'ignorant' to exercise 1st amendment right to tell anyone, including Biden, to kick rocks if their actions don't align with what they as US citizens want. Regardless if Biden had any choice or not.

 

[MT15]

Sure - i'm sure any US president would be pressured to support whatever the military industrial complex needs, no matter how principled their personal views are. I don't think many assume otherwise.

So I'm not sure how it's 'ignorant' to exercise 1st amendment right to tell anyone, including Biden, to kick rocks if their actions don't align with what they as US citizens want.

So it’s not ignorant. I do question the wisdom of doing anything that will help get Trump elected. No national leader is ever going to do what everyone wants 100% of the time. You have to make the choice that is best for the country when the election comes around.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

Sure - i'm sure any US president would be pressured to support whatever the military industrial complex needs, no matter how principled their personal views are. I don't think many assume otherwise.

So I'm not sure how it's 'ignorant' to exercise 1st amendment right to tell anyone, including Biden, to kick rocks if their actions don't align with what they as US citizens want. Regardless if Biden had any choice or not.

Yeah sure, Biden supported Israel because of pressure from the military industrial complex. How ridiculous.

 

[Heathen]

Yeah sure, Biden supported Israel because of pressure from the military industrial complex. How ridiculous.

I'll phrase it a different way as you seem to be hung up on verbiage:

Biden / his admin's refusal to intervene and punish an ally was likely primarily influenced by the need to abide by traditional protocol re: strategic geopolitical partnerships. Of which Israel is the largest in the ME. Billions of dollars each year.

You said it yourself - there was nothing Biden could do.

 

[Heathen]

So it’s not ignorant. I do question the wisdom of doing anything that will help get Trump elected. No national leader is ever going to do what everyone wants 100% of the time. You have to make the choice that is best for the country when the election comes around.

I definitely think it's a valid argument and concern, no doubt.

I'm in likely the reddest (most red?) state in the country. My vote won't count, but I'll be writing in a candidate.

However, I don't think I'm in a place to tell anyone that they need to vote for the lesser evil. I'm not saying you are, just personally for myself.

Consider if the same argument of 'doing anything but voting Biden will help Trump get elected' to an Arab-American voter after what has been occurring in Gaza? I think there are many circumstances in which refusing to vote is more than permissible, it's justified. Even when the opposing candidate is a goon like Trump.

 

[Heathen]

I agree. A lot of pro-Palestinian protests on campuses across the U.S. Unfortunately those younger voters are too focused on things that are happening in far away lands, forgetting what's happening in their own. I guess they don't teach how to think in colleges anymore.

You know, I couldn't agree more. I propose 'Dissolving AIPAC' as their first assignment back home once they're done crying about the dead Palestinians.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

Biden / his admin's refusal to intervene and punish an ally .................................

Intervene and punish Israel when? Before the Hamas attack? Right after the Hamas attack? After Israel started bombing Gaza?

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

.............................................................

Consider if the same argument of 'doing anything but voting Biden will help Trump get elected' to an Arab-American voter after what has been occurring in Gaza? I think there are many circumstances in which refusing to vote is more than permissible, it's justified. Even when the opposing candidate is a goon like Trump.

If Trump was merely a goon there wouldn't be a problem. The problem is he's a lot worse than just a goon.

 

[Incumbent]

I definitely think it's a valid argument and concern, no doubt.

I'm in likely the reddest (most red?) state in the country. My vote won't count, but I'll be writing in a candidate.

However, I don't think I'm in a place to tell anyone that they need to vote for the lesser evil. I'm not saying you are, just personally for myself.

Consider if the same argument of 'doing anything but voting Biden will help Trump get elected' to an Arab-American voter after what has been occurring in Gaza? I think there are many circumstances in which refusing to vote is more than permissible, it's justified. Even when the opposing candidate is a goon like Trump.

I'm going to unapologetically encourage people to vote for the "lesser evil", if that's the way they want to frame it, because the choice we are making is that important. And likely will be in every election for the foreseeable future.

Everything you're saying is reminiscent of the debates in 2016. Ideologically we might agree on a lot of issues and we might imagine similar visions for the future of our country (I'm guessing, I honestly don't know anymore), but Trump winning, and the insidious roots of Trumpism becoming further entangled throughout our society and in our halls of government, is not the path to a brighter future. MAGA isn't going to burn itself out if it emerges victorious. America isn't going to suddenly be pushed further Left in retaliation. Many of us correctly saw the harm that would be done if Clinton lost and we're staring at dire consequences yet again. Anybody who is listening to what Trump is saying, paying attention to the people around him, giving consideration to all of the steps that have been taken, over years, leading up to this point in our history - among them, the remaking of the judiciary, gerrymandering, the successful attacks on voting rights, the rolling back of civil rights - knows that Trump and Trumpism must be defeated.

Trump's re-election won't be the pivotal domino that starts us in the direction of some progressive utopia that arises from the ashes. That's fantasy for those who believe a.) it will all eventually get burned down and b.) something beautiful and fair will arise in its place. A Trump victory will solidify the clutches of an authoritarianism that we might never work ourselves out from under. Trump's supporters are merely pawns for those who can't wait to see the wings of democracy sufficiently clipped, because that's the only real remaining threat to their power and status.

Our votes might not ultimately matter, but our voices do. We can choose to join the chorus of apathy and protest that is meant to have a chilling effect on the enthusiasm of people whose votes do matter, or we can look at the bigger picture, see what is really at stake, and join together to defeat an imminent threat to our nation.

I vote for the remaining candidate, who is most closely aligned with my ideals, with the greatest chance to actually win. Just in the last couple of cycles alone, that has meant voting for one of the most progressive members of congress, and voting for Joe Biden. I don't have to like the candidate. I don't have to agree on everything with that candidate. Sometimes, I know it's just out of a hope to live to fight another day. Not voting for Biden is a FAFO moment in our history, and this time, absolutely nobody will be able to hide behind - I didn't think it mattered, I didn't think the consequences would really happen, Biden is just as bad.

 

[SystemShock]

I'm going to unapologetically encourage people to vote for the "lesser evil", if that's the way they want to frame it, because the choice we are making is that important. And likely will be in every election for the foreseeable future.

Everything you're saying is reminiscent of the debates in 2016. Ideologically we might agree on a lot of issues and we might imagine similar visions for the future of our country (I'm guessing, I honestly don't know anymore), but Trump winning, and the insidious roots of Trumpism becoming further entangled throughout our society and in our halls of government, is not the path to a brighter future. MAGA isn't going to burn itself out if it emerges victorious. America isn't going to suddenly be pushed further Left in retaliation. Many of us correctly saw the harm that would be done if Clinton lost and we're staring at dire consequences yet again. Anybody who is listening to what Trump is saying, paying attention to the people around him, giving consideration to all of the steps that have been taken, over years, leading up to this point in our history - among them, the remaking of the judiciary, gerrymandering, the successful attacks on voting rights, the rolling back of civil rights - knows that Trump and Trumpism must be defeated.

Trump's re-election won't be the pivotal domino that starts us in the direction of some progressive utopia that arises from the ashes. That's fantasy for those who believe a.) it will all eventually get burned down and b.) something beautiful and fair will arise in its place. A Trump victory will solidify the clutches of an authoritarianism that we might never work ourselves out from under. Trump's supporters are merely pawns for those who can't wait to see the wings of democracy sufficiently clipped, because that's the only real remaining threat to their power and status.

Our votes might not ultimately matter, but our voices do. We can choose to join the chorus of apathy and protest that is meant to have a chilling effect on the enthusiasm of people whose votes do matter, or we can look at the bigger picture, see what is really at stake, and join together to defeat an imminent threat to our nation.

I vote for the remaining candidate, who is most closely aligned with my ideals, with the greatest chance to actually win. Just in the last couple of cycles alone, that has meant voting for one of the most progressive members of congress, and voting for Joe Biden. I don't have to like the candidate. I don't have to agree on everything with that candidate. Sometimes, I know it's just out of a hope to live to fight another day. Not voting for Biden is a FAFO moment in our history, and this time, absolutely nobody will be able to hide behind - I didn't think it mattered, I didn't think the consequences would really happen, Biden is just as bad.

Been saying it since the 2016 election: you have to vote against the threat, and it is a threat. That means voting for the Democrat, not the Green Party, not the Libertarians, not abstaining because the Democrat isn't the 100% vision of woke you have in your head... you have to vote against the threat.

 

[MT15]

Thanks for writing this, Incumbent. I couldn’t have said it better. You too, System.

I hadn’t cried since my mother died when Trump was elected, but I cried that night. I knew how bad it was going to be, and yet, somehow, it was worse than I imagined once the pandemic hit and we saw how badly he and his Administration handled it.

I will be forever haunted by pictures of nurses wearing garbage bags because they didn’t have PPE, because Jared didn’t think it was politically expedient to help “blue” cities. I watched my neighbor die because she didn’t believe it was a serious illness. We had to tell her we weren’t going to have neighborhood association meetings in person inside and she thought we were overreacting, but she humored us. She was such a nice woman who deserved to enjoy her retirement for a few more years. Trump did that.

So people may think they are making some sort of moral stand, but doing anything that will lead to Trump getting back into power will only cause death and destruction here. So I would talk to an Arab American and say sure, express your outrage. But to do anything that will help elect Trump will set back the cause of Muslims for decades. It is extremely shortsighted IMO.

 

[SystemShock]

I definitely think it's a valid argument and concern, no doubt.

I'm in likely the reddest (most red?) state in the country. My vote won't count, but I'll be writing in a candidate.

However, I don't think I'm in a place to tell anyone that they need to vote for the lesser evil. I'm not saying you are, just personally for myself.

Consider if the same argument of 'doing anything but voting Biden will help Trump get elected' to an Arab-American voter after what has been occurring in Gaza? I think there are many circumstances in which refusing to vote is more than permissible, it's justified. Even when the opposing candidate is a goon like Trump.

This election, there is no circumstance in which refusing to vote for the Democratic candidate should be permissible to anyone who doesn't want to see authoritarianism or even fascism advance in the U.S.

That Arab-American, I'd have to remind him or her that it was Trump that moved the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem. I'd have to remind him the Christian zealots who come with Trump may hate Jews, but they hate Muslims more, and in their minds, they need Israel to exist for the second coming of Christ; the Palestinians, not so much. I'd have to remind him of Trump spreading lies about Arab-Americans after 9/11. I'd have to remind him how people with Arab names and dark skin are treated by right wingers.

I don't care how red your State is, you have to go out and vote against Trump, period.

 

[Heathen]

If Trump was merely a goon there wouldn't be a problem. The problem is he's a lot worse than just a goon.

Agree. The bigger problem IMO are the constituents who voted him in.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

Agree. The bigger problem IMO are the constituents who voted him in.

True. You can't have one without the other.

 

[Taurus]

Agree. The bigger problem IMO are the constituents who voted him in.

The thing is, if the candidates get defeated, the insects will crawl back into the woodwork.
If there's no one in power empowering them, they'll go back to not voting.

 

[Heathen]

The thing is, if the candidates get defeated, the insects will crawl back into the woodwork.
If there's no one in power empowering them, they'll go back to not voting.

True. I just worry at times that Trump has set a precedent of far right being the 'standard' and now there are others who are younger who will be right behind him waiting in the wings in '28 if he loses (ie DeSantis, Ramaswamy). So I think that we'll have to deal with candidates who are extreme right wing for a long time to come.

If that's remotely true, I think they have seen what riles up the GOP base (blatant lying, persecution complex, fearmongering and 'attack on our values') and will play that up. We could end up having a 'competition' of who is most extreme and voters will look for someone who is like Trump was.

 

[fooferdoggie]

True. I just worry at times that Trump has set a precedent of far right being the 'standard' and now there are others who are younger who will be right behind him waiting in the wings in '28 if he loses (ie DeSantis, Ramaswamy). So I think that we'll have to deal with candidates who are extreme right wing for a long time to come.

If that's remotely true, I think they have seen what riles up the GOP base (blatant lying, persecution complex, fearmongering and 'attack on our values') and will play that up. We could end up having a 'competition' of who is most extreme and voters will look for someone who is like Trump was.

yes trump brings out the worst in people.

 

[CoolBrees]

Trump's cult of personality dies with him. Another defeat at the federal level and the establishment right is going to realize it doesn't win elections and 2016 was a fluke.

Or a victory at the federal level means the cult of personality will be encouraged and will run amok. To protect himself he will use the full enforcement arm the executive to set up an authoritarian rule.

There is no in between.

We are at the nexus. The event horizon. This is where it will die unceremoniously or will infect the world. Because that is what would happen as the Ukrainian support is stopped and Russia overtakes Ukraine and Belarus and then the rest of the satellites they claim is rightfully theirs.

Taiwan will be overrun. South Korea will be left on its own.

We will be an isolationist nation financially bound to the Saudi's, Russians and Chinese.

In other words, the end of a just civilization.

But by all means, tell me again how Biden is too old, or didn't make decisions that he should have.