Biden Tracker (2 Viewers)

[Farb]

For all the things related to the Biden/Harris Administration and their latest hits and misses

https://www.dailywire.com/news/whit...gedly-sexually-harassing-threatening-reporter

Interesting story, looks like 'only the best people' didn't stop with the new administration.

 

[H B Lowrey]

I understand how it is right now with State ID's, but a voting ID doesn't have to be a State ID, and actually, it shouldn't be. It should be a national ID, much like a passport, managed by an autonomous, non-partisan entity.

That's how it is in MX; the INE (National Electorate Institute) is the non-partisan institution that sets standards for elections nationwide, including voter IDs. They have their own offices/modules, some of them mobile, and that's all they do, verify who you are, where you live, and give you a nationally recognized ID. It actually has become the de facto ID in MX.

You're never going to get to an autonomous, non-partisan entity to oversee anything like that in america.

 

[H B Lowrey]

Well, we have people claiming the Earth is flat, so...

In any case, I am not advocating for a voting ID, just pointing out that it wouldn't be the white supremacist's disenfranchising wet dream some make it out to be... (and yes, a lil' hyperbole to drive the point)

If MX can do it, I am sure the U.S. can do it too.

Don't we always here how corrupt things are in MX?

 

[H B Lowrey]

Because everything is slower in New Orleans. Literally everything.

Well, this is all-american slower. We're behaving as if we're still an 18th century agrarian society.

 

[SystemShock]

Don't we always here how corrupt things are in MX?

I'm sure you hear a lot of things about MX.

 

[SystemShock]

You're never going to get to an autonomous, non-partisan entity to oversee anything like that in america.

In the U.S.? Why not?

 

[samiam5211]

In the U.S.? Why not?

Because of democracy (democratic Republic, Orr whatever we want to call it) and captitalism.

Everything is political and for sale.

 

[V Chip]

In MX the ID's are free. As for #2, that would defeat the purpose of the ID. For example, IDs can be printed of dead people and used to vote for them on the spot. And you want to mitigate/eliminate any reason for even accusations of fraud... and when you hail from MX, you know everything there is to know about actual voting fraud

How could an ID be printed for a dead person?

At the voter precinct, you would have the same requirements for printing an ID as you do at any of the existing ID locations. When someone doesn’t have any photo ID the first time they go to get one, they’re still allowed to get a photo ID with certain documents. It would be the same at the actual voter precinct. Since one would have to be registered to vote in order to actually vote, they can also check against signature/fingerprint at the voter precinct.

 

[SystemShock]

Because of democracy (democratic Republic, Orr whatever we want to call it) and captitalism.

Everything is political and for sale.

If the US were other than a democracy/democratic republic, we wouldn't need elections to begin with.

 

[samiam5211]

If the US were other than a democracy/democratic republic, we wouldn't need elections to begin with.

Yea, I know.

Politics has infected everything. Our system is nearing the end of its life.

We can’t even watch the same TV shows as our political enemies anymore.

 

[SamAndreas]

If they forced passports to be the ID used for voting, you'd have a real outcry on your hands with the cost and hoops you have to jump through to get a passport. And there are lots of people ineligible for passports who are eligible to vote.

I'm not personally invested in Voter ID. I have a license and can vote. If they forced passports to vote, then I'd have a dog in this fight because I never renewed my passport when it expired.

I liked your post because you're dealing with it as pragmatically, as I deal with it.

The voter ID issue is one which i can see Farb's arguments better than most of his positions. I mean his position is not ideal but it isn't lost in frozen Siberia like most of his positions are.

It's been 20 years now that I've observed the heated debates about voter ID on message boards and there are some inconsistent things about it which cause me to not take it very seriously.

What is inconsistent about it is California has voter ID and no one from the Liberal side seems to care about that because it's such a Blue state. It's ignored. It doesn't actually foul anything up.

But take a Red state and apply voter ID and all of a sudden voter ID is taken as foretelling the end of Democracy as we know it. Lordy be awful. Run in circles, scream and shout.



I'll pass on that which I regard as mostly shrill. Somehow I think we'll survive voter ID.

However I do take serious some of the other aspects about the Voter issues very seriously. I like a period of early voting, vote by mail, drop boxes. ect. ect. I like the way our DMV includes a voter application when one gets their Driver Licence / ID.

 

[samiam5211]

However I do take serious some of the other aspects about the Voter issues very seriously. I like a period of early voting, vote by mail, drop boxes. ect. ect. I like the way our DMV includes a voter application when one gets their Driver Licence / ID.

This actually causes problems for quite a few immigrants.

Green card holders will go to get a drivers license and because their English isn’t always proficient, they will inadvertently register to vote and claim that they are a US citizen because they check yes to a block that they do not understand.

Immigration law is very unforgiving towards false claim to citizenship. It is essentially an immigration death penalty.

 

[SamAndreas]

This actually causes problems for quite a few immigrants.

Green card holders will go to get a drivers license and because their English isn’t always proficient, they will inadvertently register to vote and claim that they are a US citizen because they check yes to a block that they do not understand.

Immigration law is very unforgiving towards false claim to citizenship. It is essentially an immigration death penalty.

Sometimes in the debates about voter issues, and immigration issues, stories that are not based in real fact circulate. I don't know why. They appear to attempt to create issues that do not exist. This is not the first time I've heard about this motor voter immigration issue. This issue does not appear to be bound in any reality. I think perhaps somebody made it up for some ulterior motive.

Perhaps there is a states somewhere where the drivers licence form has this one stop easy peasy check box. Perhaps checking it also attempts to register an applicant to vote from the same form. That could cause what you are talking about. So maybe this issue applies somewhere and it isn't completely a made up thing. But I doubt it. I would have to see it, not just hear about it to believe it.

California is not a state like that at all. I don't know how that would work anyway, a voter registration form ask if a person is a citizen and stressed that one has to be a citizen to proceed. Then it asks two pages of voter kinds of questions that a California drivers licence application doesn't ask.

I have heard that California's system does this, but that's a false story, it doesn't do that.

There is a check box on the drivers licence form that requests from the driver licence examiner a separate voter application form. That if it were checked wouldn't fill out that voter application form and submit it. They would just get a separate two page form that the first question asks if a person is a citizen, and they sure ought not say that they are a citizen if they are not a citizen (yet).

I think it would be unlikely that anyone would fill out that second two page voter form without understanding that they ought to not do that. The form is too detailed for a person who doesn't have the language skills to fill it out.

 

[samiam5211]

Sometimes in the debates about voter issues, and immigration issues, stories that are not based in real fact circulate. I don't know why. They appear to attempt to create issues that do not exist. This is not the first time I've heard about this motor voter immigration issue. This issue does not appear to be bound in any reality. I think perhaps somebody made it up for some ulterior motive.

Perhaps there is a states somewhere where the drivers licence form has this one stop easy peasy check box. Perhaps checking it also attempts to register an applicant to vote from the same form. That could cause what you are talking about. So maybe this issue applies somewhere and it isn't completely a made up thing. But I doubt it. I would have to see it, not just hear about it to believe it.

California is not a state like that at all. I don't know how that would work anyway, a voter registration form ask if a person is a citizen and stressed that one has to be a citizen to proceed. Then it asks two pages of voter kinds of questions that a California drivers licence application doesn't ask.

I have heard that California's system does this, but that's a false story, it doesn't do that.

There is a check box on the drivers licence form that requests from the driver licence examiner a separate voter application form. That if it were checked wouldn't fill out that voter application form and submit it. They would just get a separate two page form that the first question asks if a person is a citizen, and they sure ought not say that they are a citizen if they are not a citizen (yet).

I think it would be unlikely that anyone would fill out that second two page voter form without understanding that they ought to not do that. The form is too detailed for a person who doesn't have the language skills to fill it out.

I work in immigration. I assure you it causes serious problems for many people.

 

[SamAndreas]

I work in immigration. I assure you it causes serious problems for many people.

I gave state specific information that rules out the possibility that in California that our motor voter system does not, could not, cause that problem you have described here. If an immigrant tries to register to vote in California they have done a lot more than having checked a simple check box by accident.

They have not made a tiny understandable little error, they have filled out an entire separate two page voter registration form and have violated our laws in doing so. The problem is on them.

Like I said before, that which brought this up. I like the convenience of motor voter system we have and support continuing to keep it. Having the DMV handing out those forms gets those forms to more people.

Since it is, has to be, a state specific issue it should be discussed from a state by state standpoint.

 

[Farb]

You are acting like ID's never expire. And yes, once expired, this hypothetical person who works 80 hours a week could still cash checks (corner stores do it all the time) without an ID if they've lived in the same area for a long time.

Her payroll department cuts check without a valid ID on file or are you saying her ID expired and she can survive on an expired ID?

 

[Farb]

This actually causes problems for quite a few immigrants.

Green card holders will go to get a drivers license and because their English isn’t always proficient, they will inadvertently register to vote and claim that they are a US citizen because they check yes to a block that they do not understand.

Immigration law is very unforgiving towards false claim to citizenship. It is essentially an immigration death penalty.

as it should be, IMO.

 

[insidejob]

Her payroll department cuts check without a valid ID on file or are you saying her ID expired and she can survive on an expired ID?

Yes. She survives with an expired ID. Most places don't care if your ID is current as long as it's state issued. I'm not talking about banks. I'm talking about the places that'll cash her checks. The stores she uses and has been for year, etc.

You know all this and feign ignorance. It's like having an honest discussion with you isn't possible. Carry on. Have fun.

 

[H B Lowrey]

In the U.S.? Why not?

See samiam5211