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    Speaking of coups...

    Neocons and the Ukraine Coup
    February 23, 2014

    Exclusive: American neocons helped destabilize Ukraine and engineer the overthrow of its elected government, a “regime change” on Russia’s western border. But the coup and the neo-Nazi militias at the forefront also reveal divisions within the Obama administration, reports Robert Parry.

    By Robert Parry

    More than five years into his presidency, Barack Obama has failed to take full control over his foreign policy, allowing a bureaucracy shaped by long years of Republican control and spurred on by a neocon-dominated U.S. news media to frustrate many of his efforts to redirect America’s approach to the world in a more peaceful direction.

    But Obama deserves a big dose of the blame for this predicament because he did little to neutralize the government holdovers and indeed played into their hands with his initial appointments to head the State and Defense departments, Hillary Clinton, a neocon-leaning Democrat, and Robert Gates, a Republican cold warrior, respectively.

    Even now, key U.S. diplomats are more attuned to hard-line positions than to promoting peace. The latest example is Ukraine where U.S. diplomats, including Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs Victoria Nuland and U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt, are celebrating the overthrow of an elected pro-Russian government.

    Occurring during the Winter Olympics in Sochi, Russia, the coup in Ukraine dealt an embarrassing black eye to Russian President Vladimir Putin, who had offended neocon sensibilities by quietly cooperating with Obama to reduce tensions over Iran and Syria, where the neocons favored military options.

    Over the past several weeks, Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych was undercut by a destabilization campaign encouraged by Nuland and Pyatt and then deposed in a coup spearheaded by neo-Nazi militias. Even after Yanukovych and the political opposition agreed to an orderly transition toward early elections, right-wing armed patrols shattered the agreement and took strategic positions around Kiev.

    Despite these ominous signs, Ambassador Pyatt hailed the coup as “a day for the history books.” Most of the mainstream U.S. news media also sided with the coup, with commentators praising the overthrow of an elected government as “reform.” But a few dissonant reports have pierced the happy talk by noting that the armed militias are part of the Pravy Sektor, a right-wing nationalist group which is often compared to the Nazis.

    An exercise in putting in a hated word to lure the uncritical thinker. Hey little puppy, see the stick…it’s neocon stick…now go fetch….

    An estimated 8 million Ukrainians took to the streets for maidan. That’s roughly 20% of Ukraine. Amazing us coup powers. And precisely because they were promised that an agreement with the eu would be signed. However, after meeting with Putin secretly yanukovych reneged. Who destabilized whom? And not long after, Putin and his little green men invaded crimea and incited…no, he sent Russian troops into eastern Ukraine and started a war.

    Get real with this bs. It’s like ground hog day.
     
    What kind of aid? Military? Humanitarian?

    Is it as egregious as when trump unilaterally invited the taliban to camp David without the ruling afghanistani government? Really, what kind of signal do you tell folks fighting against the taliban that the us promises TO the taliban only to leave by a specific date AND we will reduce our troop number and aid. Oh right when shirt hits the fan due to it, we blame the guy who just got into office, while denying him the courtesy of any access to intelligence during the transition phase. Nah. Instead, let’s try to overthrow the incoming government instead.

    Maybe these faux outrages are a bit mismplaced.
    NOT a faux outrage.
    I don't want any US tax dollars going to the Taliban.
    Give it to the Red Cross...fine.
    NOT the Taliban.
     
    And what’s the type of aid that you upset you?
    Spin all you want.
    AID does not upset me.
    I want the PEOPLE of that country to have their needs met.
    IF OUR money is going to be used to help them, WE should control WHO it is that receives the money to help those people.
    .........and that "WHO"..should NOT be the Taliban.
     
    Spin all you want.
    AID does not upset me.
    I want the PEOPLE of that country to have their needs met.
    IF OUR money is going to be used to help them, WE should control WHO it is that receives the money to help those people.
    .........and that "WHO"..should NOT be the Taliban.
    I get the sentiment, and I don't know all of the ins and outs, but unfortunately for Afghanistan, the Taliban is who is in power currently, and we committed to assisting Afghanistan with their transition. I have no doubt there will be some corruption and funds not used properly, there always is with any aid package. I wasn't a fan of Trump admin working with them and I'm not a fan of working with them now, but if we still want to have at least some influence there, then the aid package will help some.

    I trust the state department had an agenda and a plan that has our country's interests at heart. It's not a perfect world and you have to work with who and do what you can.
     
    Spin all you want.
    AID does not upset me.
    I want the PEOPLE of that country to have their needs met.
    IF OUR money is going to be used to help them, WE should control WHO it is that receives the money to help those people.
    .........and that "WHO"..should NOT be the Taliban.
    Spin? Spin what?

    Be honest with yourself. Why are you upset with Biden. What sin did he commit here.

    Really, you ought to step back because Dave has pointed that out for you. You said you don't mind humanitarian aid. I am sensing that you want to send the entirety of the US army to protect that aid. And if we don't send the aid, people will lament all the suffering and call it Biden abandoning the afghan people.

    Again, your anger is misplaced...or faux outrage as it is.
     
    SFL quit posting propaganda and especially Russian propaganda. It’s embarrassing. The House Rs have zero credibility left and may as well be Russian propaganda at this point.
    20230811_150054.jpg
     
    I’m not the one coping and seething, lol you just spend all of your posts yesterday doing that. This post is only projection from you. What you do and post is extremely irresponsible. It’s within your rights, of course. But you have to be prepared for being called out when you post crap. That’s my right of free speech. 🤷‍♀️
     
    I’m not the one coping and seething, lol you just spend all of your posts yesterday doing that. This post is only projection from you. What you do and post is extremely irresponsible. It’s within your rights, of course. But you have to be prepared for being called out when you post crap. That’s my right of free speech. 🤷‍♀️
    we have to consider that there are three types pushing putin’s propaganda here.
    1. Russian spy.
    2. Russian asset.
    3. Useful idiot.
     
    WHY under the Biden Administration are we giving 5 billion US Tax dollars to the Taliban led Afghanistan government?

    maybe cite your source, then maybe people would comment on it?

    this is maybe the closet reference I found in the 3 minutes of searching I did
    but I mean, what do you expect when the country is overtaken by a terrorist group?
     
    So humanitarian aid is a bad thing now?

    We give aid to African nations that are run by warlords, so I don't see the issue. Unless you want boots on the ground, they are in charge in Afghanistan for better or (mostly) worse.

    Besides, Biden didn't just give them a check for $5 billion and tell them to only spend it on humanitarian aid - on their honor. We gave them stuff (food, drinking water, etc) that totaled $5 billion. This includes logistics support.

    I doubt the Taliban is hijacking water trucks and grain deliveries.

    Taking hostages or murdering people would be a good way to have the US come back. And not with aid they are going to want.
     
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/14/hunter-biden-lawyers-plea-deal-valid-special-counsel


    Lawyers for Hunter Biden, the son of President Joe Biden who has been under a years-long federal investigation over failing to pay taxes and, separately, illegally possessing a gun, said that part of the plea deal which unexpectedly fell apart in July remains “valid and binding”, in a Sunday court filing.

    The wonderful and exciting world of the United States Government 2 tier criminal justice system. So much for taking anyone on the left seriously when they discuss more gun control laws.
     
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/14/hunter-biden-lawyers-plea-deal-valid-special-counsel


    Lawyers for Hunter Biden, the son of President Joe Biden who has been under a years-long federal investigation over failing to pay taxes and, separately, illegally possessing a gun, said that part of the plea deal which unexpectedly fell apart in July remains “valid and binding”, in a Sunday court filing.

    The wonderful and exciting world of the United States Government 2 tier criminal justice system. So much for taking anyone on the left seriously when they discuss more gun control laws.
    Why is that? I haven’t seen anyone say that Hunter didn’t lie on his form. There is a 2-tier system, though, in that almost nobody ever gets charged with lying on this form, unless there is a gun crime committed that this charge then gets tacked on to.

    See if you can find anyone ever charged with lying on this form, without also having committed a crime with said gun. I will bet you cannot find it.
     
    Why is that? I haven’t seen anyone say that Hunter didn’t lie on his form. There is a 2-tier system, though, in that almost nobody ever gets charged with lying on this form, unless there is a gun crime committed that this charge then gets tacked on to.

    See if you can find anyone ever charged with lying on this form, without also having committed a crime with said gun. I will bet you cannot find it.
    But I thought we need to enforce the laws on the books, create more strict laws and take away guns from citizens. Is that not your parties stance on gun control now that it is the presidents son?
     
    But I thought we need to enforce the laws on the books, create more strict laws and take away guns from citizens. Is that not your parties stance on gun control now that it is the presidents son?
    Go ahead and find where I said that lying on a form should result in prosecution. And also find where I said he shouldn’t be prosecuted.

    Just pointing out that this is a law that is never prosecuted apart from alongside a separate gun charge does not equal saying he shouldn’t be prosecuted. They should go ahead and prosecute him if they want to.

    See what I mean - you have to twist my words to make any sort of argument at all. Why do you suppose that is?
     
    Go ahead and find where I said that lying on a form should result in prosecution. And also find where I said he shouldn’t be prosecuted.

    Just pointing out that this is a law that is never prosecuted apart from alongside a separate gun charge does not equal saying he shouldn’t be prosecuted. They should go ahead and prosecute him if they want to.

    See what I mean - you have to twist my words to make any sort of argument at all. Why do you suppose that is?
    I am simply pointing out that when the left politicians rant about gun control and taxing the rich, it is all just a dog whistle for their base. That base is you. And here you are defending the Biden family. You are loyal, that is a quality Trump really enjoys in his people too, so you are by no means alone in that.
     
    I am simply pointing out that when the left politicians rant about gun control and taxing the rich, it is all just a dog whistle for their base. That base is you. And here you are defending the Biden family. You are loyal, that is a quality Trump really enjoys in his people too, so you are by no means alone in that.
    I’m defending Hunter? Look, just because I want to correct your mis-statements doesn’t mean I care whether Hunter gets prosecuted or not. I will admit it pisses me off when Rs lie about Joe being corrupt with zero proof. I always object to gaslighting liars. But Hunter is totally irrelevant to the administration.
     

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