All things Racist...USA edition (2 Viewers)

[Farb]

I was looking for a place to put this so we could discuss but didn't really find a place that worked so I created this thread so we can all place articles, experiences, videos and examples of racism in the USA.

This is one that happened this week. The lady even called and filed a complaint on the officer. This officer also chose to wear the body cam (apparently, LA doesn't require this yet). This exchange wasn't necessarily racist IMO until she started with the "mexican racist...you will never be white, like you want" garbage. That is when it turned racist IMO

All the murderer and other insults, I think are just a by product of CRT and ACAB rhetoric that is very common on the radical left and sadly is being brought to mainstream in this country.

Another point that I think is worth mentioning is she is a teacher and the sense of entitlement she feels is mind blowing.

https://news.yahoo.com/black-teacher-berates-latino-la-221235341.html

 

[Paul]

Paul: this was your response to a cited study proving that black people are pulled over by police at a rate far, far above what would be proportional to their percentage of the population. Today, happening today. Not in the past:

Can you not see that this doesn’t even begin to address the situation? That it totally ignores the current situation facing black drivers in many areas, and in fact could be construed as pointing a finger back at the black drivers?

It’s extremely difficult to have a conversation when actual facts cannot even be acknowledged by one of the parties. Impossible, actually.

The reason there is anxiety when seeing a cop in the rear view mirror is because blacks get stopped more often. I cannot overstate that anymore. The PTSD is due to the history of racism. Sorry, I did not read the report.

I propose better training for cops. There is a movement in some cities where cops will no longer stop POC drivers for minor infractions, that is a start.

It was another accurate post.

Typically, yes.

With you, no. They tend to die when you simply ignore the points you don't like.

Like here, where you've avoided engaging with, or even acknowledging, the observation that your post is inherently flawed due to selection bias and cherry-picking, choosing instead to misrepresent the post as purely 'vituperative' and to cast aspersions about the poster.

But as the problem is on your end, there's little I can do about that.

You did not say anything in your post. Please try to be specific. You are way too general with your critique . Specifically mention the issues where you have disagreement.

 

[Paul]

Anecdotes are not evidence, or so I've heard...

I agree, but we are looking at a large number of videos made by black Americans. Your position contradicts CRT which states that the story telling is incredibly important.

 

[Paul]

So I only have read your first linked article. It’s an opinion piece actually, but the author does seem to have cataloged around 400 instances of faked hate crimes. This appears to be over a 4-5 year period by his own words. He also quotes the FBI as having 7000 reported hate crimes in 2017. So just using these figures, giving the benefit of the doubt and using 4 years, that’s approximately 1.5% of reported hate crimes are fakes.

I never denied that actual hate crimes are more common.

As for the reasons, your author gives some of them, in his opinion. Sometimes it’s a bid for attention, sometimes it’s a misguided attempt to call attention to a perceived problem that isn’t getting enough attention in the opinion of the faker. Sometimes it would probably indicate some mental health issues in my own opinion. I just don’t think 1.5% is all that significant.

Staging a hate crime is mostly done to keep the ideas of racism in the forefront of the news.

BTW, racism continues to go down, but the perception of racism continues to go up. Why is this happening? You would think we are in the days of Brown versus board of education. I don't get it. In the time I have lived in the USA racism has gone down a lot. All the war stories I had about racism go back to the late 70s. I can palpate the change.

MT, I want to thank you! You engage the issues and stay away from personal attacks.

 

[MT15]

Before the last 4-5 years I would have agreed with you in part, Paul. But about 2015 I became aware of a vast amount of misogyny being expressed openly, on the internet mostly. It has also spilled over into real life though. I was pretty much gobsmacked. Racism and antisemitism followed the same arc, I just felt the misogyny first and most keenly.

I don’t understand it. But studies like the one cited here in the last couple of pages as well as many studies on school discipline that were cited by a previous poster, have proven that while things are better in many ways, racism is far from actually gone.

BTW, we don’t know why most fake hate crimes are staged. Your statement is an assumption; I would personally lean more toward mental issues of attention seeking, almost like Munchausen by proxy.

 

[RobF]

You did not say anything in your post.

"Your post is inherently flawed due to selection bias and cherry-picking" is something. Pointing out that you're ignoring the something is also something.

You do know when you just ignore something that only works for you, right? Everyone else can still see it?

Please try to be specific. You are way too general with your critique . Specifically mention the issues where you have disagreement.

The specific issues would be the selection bias and cherry-picking.

Do you really need it to be explained that selecting the opinions of a group of people who live in Japan about Japan and generalising them to all other people in that group is selection bias?

Does it really need to be explained that selecting quotes you think are supportive from articles, and articles you think are supportive from google searches, while ignoring other less supportive quotes ("But impressions of Japan were not universally positive. Several of the interviewees said there was widespread ignorance about black culture, that Japanese people like to randomly touch their hair and skin, and that racist remarks were common, particularly by children.") and articles (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53428863, https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2020/12/24/japan-black-race-identity-naomi-osaka/) is cherry-picking?

Because it shouldn't.

 

[gjones]

Racism.

A small percentage of people are racist to the point that it effects the things they do day to day. I think most people are cultural more so than racist.

Racism is highlighted in the US for a couple reasons in my opinion. 1 we are a melting pot of cultures. There are cultural differences from 1 neighborhood to the other. I’m most parts of the world, there is very little mixing of populations.

This is what makes America great. Unfortunately we have 2 groups of people defining the message in the states. Racism has become a black or white issue, leaving out all the nuances among those races and disregarding all other races.

We then have the fringes setting the atmospheric tone on what racism is, and unfortunately, the media and politicians perpetuate the problem so as to keep themselves in power.

 

[Paul]

The specific issues would be the selection bias and cherry-picking.

I would agree that confirmation bias is aways an issue in a discussion and I am often guilty of that. However, I would say that almost everybody falls victim to confirmation bias.

Do you really need it to be explained that selecting the opinions of a group of people who live in Japan about Japan and generalising them to all other people in that group is selection bias?

Does it really need to be explained that selecting quotes you think are supportive from articles, and articles you think are supportive from google searches, while ignoring other less supportive quotes ("But impressions of Japan were not universally positive. Several of the interviewees said there was widespread ignorance about black culture, that Japanese people like to randomly touch their hair and skin, and that racist remarks were common, particularly by children.") and articles (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53428863, https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2020/12/24/japan-black-race-identity-naomi-osaka/) is cherry-picking?

Because it shouldn't.

I said that the most Japanese are ethno centric, xenophobes, and racists. I never stated the opposite. The people making the videos never denied the existence of racism and they said it was more tolerable because the racism came from ignorance. Many Japanese have never seen a black person in real life and are often prone to stare and to want to touch the hair.

One person said he was exhausted by the constant talk about race in America. He was happy to be called the American in Japan rather than the black guy in America. I realize these are their stories, but if you are a CRT devotee story telling is important.

America and Japan are both racists, but many blacks feel more comfortable in Japan. You will say this is cherry picking and that is fair. I will try to find videos of people of African ancestry that hate Japan.

 

[Paul]

Racism.

A small percentage of people are racist to the point that it effects the things they do day to day. I think most people are cultural more so than racist.

Racism is highlighted in the US for a couple reasons in my opinion. 1 we are a melting pot of cultures. There are cultural differences from 1 neighborhood to the other. I’m most parts of the world, there is very little mixing of populations.

This is what makes America great. Unfortunately we have 2 groups of people defining the message in the states. Racism has become a black or white issue, leaving out all the nuances among those races and disregarding all other races.

We then have the fringes setting the atmospheric tone on what racism is, and unfortunately, the media and politicians perpetuate the problem so as to keep themselves in power.

I agree with your post. I will only add that there is only one human race. The difference between a black and white person is a few genes, they are members of the same race.

The melting pot only works when the different ethnicities acquire a new unifying culture. Black and White America have failed to do this.

 

[gjones]

I agree with your post. I will only add that there is only one human race. The difference between a black and white person is a few genes, they are members of the same race.

The melting pot only works when the different ethnicities acquire a new unifying culture. Black and White America have failed to do this.

Yeah the one race thing is an esoteric idea.

A melting pot has never worked in society until the US as far as I know (I’m not going looking for links). With all the successes we have acquired over the last couple hundred years, we have had many pitfalls. I wish society focused on the positives instead of the narrative of the fringe.

I find it funny when I hear my European friends talk about racism.

 

[Paul]

Yeah the one race thing is an esoteric idea.

We have different groups within the same race.

A melting pot has never worked in society until the US as far as I know (I’m not going looking for links). With all the successes we have acquired over the last couple hundred years, we have had many pitfalls. I wish society focused on the positives instead of the narrative of the fringe.

The media and political leaders will also focus on the negative. Unfortunately, this causes PTSD

I find it funny when I hear my European friends talk about racism.

White guilt, white savior syndrome, condescending racism of low expectation.

 

[gjones]

We have different groups within the same race.

The media and political leaders will also focus on the negative. Unfortunately, this causes PTSD

White guilt, white savior syndrome, condescending racism of low expectation.

I know what you are saying with the 1 race thing, Im only saying that society at large will not give much credence to your argument.

 

[Paul]

I know what you are saying with the 1 race thing, Im only saying that society at large will not give much credence to your argument.

I once again agree with you. In fact the US Census has more racial categories than the old apartheid South Africa.

US Census:

Definition

White. A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Europe, the Middle East, or North Africa. It includes people who indicate their race as "White" or report entries such as Irish, German, Italian, Lebanese, Arab, Moroccan, or Caucasian.

Black or African American. A person having origins in any of the Black racial groups of Africa. It includes people who indicate their race as "Black or African American," or report entries such as African American, Kenyan, Nigerian, or Haitian.

American Indian and Alaska Native. A person having origins in any of the original peoples of North and South America (including Central America) and who maintains tribal affiliation or community attachment. This category includes people who indicate their race as "American Indian or Alaska Native" or report entries such as Navajo, Blackfeet, Inupiat, Yup'ik, or Central American Indian groups or South American Indian groups.

Asian. A person having origins in any of the original peoples of the Far East, Southeast Asia, or the Indian subcontinent including, for example, Cambodia, China, India, Japan, Korea, Malaysia, Pakistan, the Philippine Islands, Thailand, and Vietnam. This includes people who reported detailed Asian responses such as: "Asian Indian," "Chinese," "Filipino," "Korean," "Japanese," "Vietnamese," and "Other Asian" or provide other detailed Asian responses.

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander. A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Hawaii, Guam, Samoa, or other Pacific Islands. It includes people who reported their race as "Fijian," "Guamanian or Chamorro," "Marshallese," "Native Hawaiian," "Samoan," "Tongan," and "Other Pacific Islander" or provide other detailed Pacific Islander responses.

Two or more races. People may choose to provide two or more races either by checking two or more race response check boxes, by providing multiple responses, or by some combination of check boxes and other responses. For data product purposes, "Two or More Races" refers to combinations of two or more of the following race categories: "White," "Black or African American," American Indian or Alaska Native," "Asian," Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander," or "Some Other Race"

https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/note/US/RHI625219

They also use the term Hispanic white and non-Hispanic white in a not so subtle attempt to say Hispanic whites are not genetically pure.

BTW, South Africa only had four different racial groups.

I prefer the way the French deal with this issue.

 

[samiam5211]

Staging a hate crime is mostly done to keep the ideas of racism in the forefront of the news.

Staging a hate crime or any crime is almost always done so the faker can get attention for themselves.

They aren't part of some movement.

 

[Paul]

Staging a hate crime or any crime is almost always done so the faker can get attention for themselves.

They aren't part of some movement.

Sam: I think you hit the nail. Attention may be the most common reason. A variant of Munchausen syndrome.

 

[SaintForLife]

 

[SaintForLife]

 

[Paul]

The quote was said by a woman that opposed the lecture. It was said as a critique to white people.

 

[SaintForLife]