All Things LGBTQ+ (2 Viewers)

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    Farb

    Farb

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    Didn't really see a place for this so I thought I would start a thread about all things LGBTQ since this is a pretty hot topic in our culture right now

    https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/sup...y-that-refuses-to-work-with-lgbt-couples.html

    • The Supreme Court on Thursday delivered a unanimous defeat to LGBT couples in a high-profile case over whether Philadelphia could refuse to contract with a Roman Catholic adoption agency that says its religious beliefs prevent it from working with same-sex foster parents.
    • Chief Justice John Roberts wrote in an opinion for a majority of the court that Philadelphia violated the First Amendment by refusing to contract with Catholic Social Services once it learned that the organization would not certify same-sex couples for adoption.

    I will admit, I was hopeful for this decision by the SCOTUS but I was surprised by the unanimous decision.

    While I don't think there is anything wrong, per se, with same sex couples adopting and raising children (I actually think it is a good thing as it not an abortion) but I also did not want to see the state force a religious institution to bend to a societal norm.
     
    SystemShock said:
    Progress.


    Further progress
    Click to expand...

    No progress since I never stated otherwise.

    SystemShock said:
    Ironic comment.
    Still, show me any evidence of something other than male or female of the species. I am always willing to learn.

    It doesn't matter how you get there. You still can only get to male or female of the species, birth defects/hermaphrodism notwithstanding.


    Male or female of the species IS about reproductive organs. You are just bent on injecting gender into it, which to me, has lost any practical meaning other than "what I feel/think I am" (maybe you prefer the softer "what I identify as"). But again, feel free to bring up any and all of the brain/organ differences that give way to all of the30+ recognized genders. I am always willing to learn
    Click to expand...

    You're the one that keeps injecting gender as a strawman arguing post. I've been discussing our biological sex and the factors that determine it.
    You keep going back to the same thing and repeating yourself.

    It's funny we're arguing about biological sex but you keep ignoring most of our biology. Our biology is more than just our sexual organs. But keep on doing you.
     
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    RobF said:
    I'd say it's reductive. 'Female' can be used to refer to gender in humans, not exclusively in a biological "what are your reproductive organs" sense.

    People can argue it shouldn't be, but then it's either a probably futile argument about terminology or it's a denial of the reality of gender (and as multiple people have pointed out, we all perceive gender: we're not typically checking people's reproductive organs before recognising them as male or female on a day-to-day basis).


    Can't argue with that.
    Click to expand...
    Whenever I see someone refer to a woman as a female, and they’re not in a science or law enforcement setting, I tend to take a second look at what they are doing. It can be a subtle slam.

    I’m not saying that’s always the case, just that I have seen it enough to notice it.
     
    And it's the student's free speech right to refer to the professor as Professor Transphobic butt crevasse
    ==============================================================

    A Shawnee State University professor who was disciplined for using the wrong pronouns when addressing a transgender student is being awarded $400,000 after a lawsuit against the university.

    Nick Meriwether, a philosophy professor at the Ohio school, declined to use she/her pronouns to refer to a transgender woman, according to a press release from Alliance Defending Freedom, a legal organization that focuses on religious freedom and free speech cases and represented Meriwether.

    Meriwether responded to the student during classes by saying, "Yes, sir." The student asked him after class to use she/her pronouns when addressing her, but Meriwether said no. The student filed a complaint and the university launched an investigation, according to a press release from the alliance.

    Meriwether offered to use the student's name, but not pronouns or titles. The university ruled he should use the correct pronouns, which the professor argued "speak contrary to his religious convictions and philosophical beliefs."

    The university determined "he effectively created a hostile environment" for the student and placed written warning in his personnel file, threatening "further corrective actions," according to the alliance.

    The professor filed a lawsuit against university officials, which they tried to have dismissed. In 2021, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 6th Circuit ruled in favor of Meriwether, reversing a district court's dismissal of his suit, according to the alliance.

    The court ruled Shawnee State officials had violated Meriwether's free speech rights when they took action............

     
    I've seen a lot of post form this anti-LGBTQ, bigot's Tik Tok posted on this forum and in other places. The rightwing media has really been amplifying it along with their adherents. No surprise to see Joe Rogan had a hand in pushing it as well.

    Just four months after getting started, Libs of TikTok got its big break: Joe Rogan started promoting the account to the millions of listeners of his hit podcast. He mentioned it several times on the show in August, then again in late September. “Libs of TikTok is one of the greatest f---ing accounts of all time,” he said. With his seal of approval, Raichik’s following skyrocketed.

    Libs of TikTok gained more prominence throughout the end of last year, cementing its spot in the right-wing media outrage cycle. Its attacks on the LGBTQ+ community also escalated. By January, Raichik’s page was leaning hard into “groomer” discourse, calling for any teacher who comes out as gay to their students to be “fired on the spot.”

    Her anti-trans tweets went especially viral. She called on her followers to contact schools that were allowing “boys in the girls bathrooms” and pushed the false conspiracy theory that schools were installing litter boxes in bathrooms for children who identify as cats. She also purported that adults who teach children about LGBTQ+ identities are “abusive,” that being gender-nonconforming or an ally to the LGBTQ+ community is a “mental illness,” and referred to schools as “government run indoctrination camps” for the LGBTQ+ community.

    “Libs of TikTok is shaping our entire political conversation about the rights of LGBTQ people to participate in society,” Drennen said. “It feels like they’re single-handedly taking us back a decade in terms of the public discourse around LGBTQ rights. It’s been like nothing we’ve ever really seen.”

    By March, Libs of TikTok was directly impacting legislation. DeSantis’s press secretary Christina Pushaw credited the account with “opening her eyes” and informing her views on the state’s restrictive legislation that bans discussion of sexuality or gender identity in kindergarten through third grade, referred to by critics as the “don’t say gay” bill. She and Libs of TikTok have interacted with each other at least 138 times publicly, according to a report by Media Matters. When asked by The Post about her relationship with the account, Pushaw wrote, “I follow, like and retweet libsoftiktok. My interactions with that account are public," and added that she’s a strong supporter of its mission.
    Click to expand...
     
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    cuddlemonkey said:
    Ah! Another defelction. If a person's reproductive organs determine whether they are male or female, how do you classify someone born without reproductive organs?
    Click to expand...
    An outlier?
     
    MT15 said:
    Whenever I see someone refer to a woman as a female, and they’re not in a science or law enforcement setting, I tend to take a second look at what they are doing. It can be a subtle slam.

    I’m not saying that’s always the case, just that I have seen it enough to notice it.
    Click to expand...
    Everyone keeps using the term 'woman' to describe an adult human female, but yet cannot give a definition of a woman. Strange.
     
    coldseat said:
    No progress since I never stated otherwise.



    You're the one that keeps injecting gender as a strawman arguing post.
    Click to expand...
    bullshirt. You brought it up with the article you posted.
    coldseat said:
    I've been discussing our biological sex and the factors that determine it.
    Click to expand...
    That's not what you have been doing, but ok.
    coldseat said:
    You keep going back to the same thing and repeating yourself.

    It's funny we're arguing about biological sex but you keep ignoring most of our biology. Our biology is more than just our sexual organs. But keep on doing you.
    Click to expand...
    I am not ignoring anything.

    Of course our biology is more than just sexual organs, duh! However, when it comes to the male and the female of the species, it is the sex organs that determine them. Not our brains, not our hearts, not our kidneys. It doesn't matter if you are straight, gay, lesbian, queer, trans, or plus... or if you are a butch or a femme... if you self-identify as a drag queen or a pansexual or a furry... and, biologically speaking, in the end, it doesn't matter how the individual got the junk or the box...

    Case and point: @Farb posted a story about a transgender woman impregnating female prisoners in a women's prison. How could that possibly happen? And how complicated is that?
     
    RobF said:
    I'd say it's reductive. 'Female' can be used to refer to gender in humans, not exclusively in a biological "what are your reproductive organs" sense.

    People can argue it shouldn't be, but then it's either a probably futile argument about terminology or it's a denial of the reality of gender (and as multiple people have pointed out, we all perceive gender: we're not typically checking people's reproductive organs before recognising them as male or female on a day-to-day basis).


    Can't argue with that.
    Click to expand...

    We can use many words in many different ways, sure... but when it comes to the human species, it is not reductive to define the male and the female of the species by their reproductive organs, it is the only way to define them, unless of course you know of a 3rd reproductive organ of which I am not aware.

    And, even from before we became homo sapiens, social, religious, and culture norms have been based on that very distinction, not on what one thinks they are or how they self-identify.

    And again, gender rears its head... frankly, the concept of gender is so distorted, that I find it meaningless.
    One just has to look at the list of genders to come to this realization. I already mentioned @Farb 's post about the inmate in the women's prison who impregnated 2 other prisoners. I am going to venture to assume you will maintain that inmate is a woman, because she identifies as a woman, and probably her sdnPOA is small like that of the female of the species; yet, she is penetrating women with her penis and depositing sperm inside them and her sperm is fertilizing the eggs of the other inmates. I'd argue she is the male of the species. What say you?

    I find it ironic that people who complain about the binary model, strongly advocate to insert transgender people into that same binary model. Personally, I think the Zapotecs got it right with the muxes, which thankfully survived Catholic oppression; can't imagine Tehuantepec without them.
     
    cuddlemonkey said:
    Never heard of that sex. Male or female, Farb? What are you thinking?
    Click to expand...

    Definition of outlier​


    1: a person whose residence and place of business are at a distanceHis house was a place of refuge for outliers.
    2: something (such as a geologic feature) that is situated away from or classed differently from a main or related bodyThe island is an outlier on the southeast side of the archipelago.
    3a: a statistical observation that is markedly different in value from the others of the sampleValues that are outliers give disproportionate weight to larger over smaller values.
    b: a person or thing that is atypical within a particular group, class, or category


    Here you go.
     
    Farb said:

    Definition of outlier​


    1: a person whose residence and place of business are at a distanceHis house was a place of refuge for outliers.
    2: something (such as a geologic feature) that is situated away from or classed differently from a main or related bodyThe island is an outlier on the southeast side of the archipelago.
    3a: a statistical observation that is markedly different in value from the others of the sampleValues that are outliers give disproportionate weight to larger over smaller values.
    b: a person or thing that is atypical within a particular group, class, or category


    Here you go.
    Click to expand...

    Are you saying that the hypothetical person in question is female?
     
    cuddlemonkey said:
    Are you saying that the hypothetical person in question is female?
    Click to expand...
    How many fingers do humans have on 1 hand?

    I am saying that person is atypical but that person does not constitute an entirely new category.
     
    SystemShock said:
    We can use many words in many different ways, sure... but when it comes to the human species, it is not reductive to define the male and the female of the species by their reproductive organs, it is the only way to define them, unless of course you know of a 3rd reproductive organ of which I am not aware.

    And, even from before we became homo sapiens, social, religious, and culture norms have been based on that very distinction, not on what one thinks they are or how they self-identify.

    And again, gender rears its head... frankly, the concept of gender is so distorted, that I find it meaningless.
    One just has to look at the list of genders to come to this realization. I already mentioned @Farb 's post about the inmate in the women's prison who impregnated 2 other prisoners. I am going to venture to assume you will maintain that inmate is a woman, because she identifies as a woman, and probably her sdnPOA is small like that of the female of the species; yet, she is penetrating women with her penis and depositing sperm inside them and her sperm is fertilizing the eggs of the other inmates. I'd argue she is the male of the species. What say you?

    I find it ironic that people who complain about the binary model, strongly advocate to insert transgender people into that same binary model. Personally, I think the Zapotecs got it right with the muxes, which thankfully survived Catholic oppression; can't imagine Tehuantepec without them.
    Click to expand...
    I'd say that an argument that relies on there being no such thing as context isn't much of an argument.
     

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