All Things LGBTQ+ (1 Viewer)

[Farb]

Didn't really see a place for this so I thought I would start a thread about all things LGBTQ since this is a pretty hot topic in our culture right now

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/sup...y-that-refuses-to-work-with-lgbt-couples.html

• The Supreme Court on Thursday delivered a unanimous defeat to LGBT couples in a high-profile case over whether Philadelphia could refuse to contract with a Roman Catholic adoption agency that says its religious beliefs prevent it from working with same-sex foster parents.
• Chief Justice John Roberts wrote in an opinion for a majority of the court that Philadelphia violated the First Amendment by refusing to contract with Catholic Social Services once it learned that the organization would not certify same-sex couples for adoption.

I will admit, I was hopeful for this decision by the SCOTUS but I was surprised by the unanimous decision.

While I don't think there is anything wrong, per se, with same sex couples adopting and raising children (I actually think it is a good thing as it not an abortion) but I also did not want to see the state force a religious institution to bend to a societal norm.

 

[B4YOU]

https://www.insider.com/oli-london-white-influencer-criticized-for-identifying-as-korean-2021-6

There was talk in this thread recently about a race being a social contrust as well as gender. I saw this this morning and got to thinking, isn't this basically the same thing as transgender?

It’s clearly not the same thing. Just ask her.

 

[Paul]

Personal insults are against TOS

Really, I only bring biology either when talking about things which are meant to protect/advance women (such as sports and their biological division) or when the woke patrol tries to beat me into submission. To me, who you are is what matters, not what you are or think you are, if you know what I mean.

Oops, sorry about that.

 

[SystemShock]

Transgender women should be treated as women at all times.

Should gynecologists be forced to treat transgender women?
On a sinking ship, will you give the lifeboat spot to a transgender female instead of a biological female?
Would you go down on a transgender woman?

 

[CoolBrees]

Sorry, Shock but all of that is irrelevant and kinda below your intellect.

One person’s opinion on cunnilingus with a trans isn’t exactly evidence.

the sinking ship reference is not up to your standards so I am going to let it slide. How does one even go about determining that in that situation? Who even asks? Just odd.

why would you have to force a gynecologist to see a trans woman? They already do and don’t seem to mind. In fact, they see both trans men and women and both pre and post op.

 

[SystemShock]

Sorry, Shock but all of that is irrelevant and kinda below your intellect.

Sometimes you feel like a nut...

One person’s opinion on cunnilingus with a trans isn’t exactly evidence.

Do you really think it'd be just one person's opinion? And we are not talking cunnilingus, unless you want to call sucking on a penis cunnilingus.

the sinking ship reference is not up to your standards so I am going to let it slide. How does one even go about determining that in that situation? Who even asks? Just odd.

Say this person looks like any of these:

Trans athletes make great gains, yet resentment still flares

Did you really just drop a fruit analogy on the LGBTQ community?I couldn't resist.. Probably should've used bananas and peaches though.

saintsreport.com

Trans athletes make great gains, yet resentment still flares

In a 2013 interview with David Letterman, Williams spoke candidly about competing against male players. She had no qualms talking about how different the sport is on the men’s tour versus the women’s tour: "If I were to play Andy Murray, I would lose, 6-0, 6-0, in five to six minutes, maybe 10...

saintsreport.com

why would you have to force a gynecologist to see a trans woman?

There have been lawsuits. Gynecologists, specifically, are trained in the female reproductive systems; transgenders op or not op, don't have them.

They already do and don’t seem to mind. In fact, they see both trans men and women and both pre and post op.

That'd pose legal and ethical questions/problems, I'd think. Are gynecologists supposed to perform pap smears on transgenders, and charge insurances for it?

 

[Paul]

Should gynecologists be forced to treat transgender women?

Hmm, as far as I know medical state boards do not require physicians treat patients that have an illness they cannot handle. For example an orthopedic surgeon can refuse to care for a patient with breast cancer because he has no training in oncology. In fact, I am also certain a physician can fire a patient form his practice if such patient is not compliant with instructions. All they have to do is write a letter and allow the patient to find another doctor elsewhere.

On a sinking ship, will you give the lifeboat spot to a transgender female instead of a biological female?

As a man I am wired to help damsels in distress. I think most men are that way. I suppose my biology would take over. That is a great question.

Would you go down on a transgender woman?

Nope! However, in some circles to refuse may be seen as transphobic.

 

[Paul]

On a side note:

People on the far left or the far right have a tendency to agree with all the tenets at the end of their political spectrum.
Those on the far left do not ever want to see themselves as bigots so they cannot see the problem of transgender women competing with biological women in sporting events where size and strength is an advantage.

By the same token those on the extreme right cannot accept global warming.

Both sides have blind spots.

 

[MT15]

System and Paul, disdain is probably the wrong word so I apologize. I meant that you both don’t seem to be willing to grant full rights to trans individuals. And I do note you don’t both feel the same exact way. It’s a continuum.

Trans women who have gone through puberty as a man would probably cause an issue in competitive women’s sports. However, it’s probably not as big of a problem as it’s being made out to be. That’s just my general feeling about it. It seems to me that those who want to demonize trans people have taken this issue and magnified it.

The lifeboat question is not a great question, IMO. Who asks anybody dressed as a woman in that situation what her genitals look like? It’s meant to polarize and inflame the situation.

And I sure hope Paul’s comment about having oral sex was in jest because it’s pretty ridiculous as well. Nobody is being stigmatized for simply not choosing to have sex with someone.

 

[Paul]

System and Paul, disdain is probably the wrong word so I apologize. I meant that you both don’t seem to be willing to grant full rights to trans individuals. And I do note you don’t both feel the same exact way. It’s a continuum.

Trans have the same rights as anyone else. The problem is that some pious conservative people are uncomfortable with transgenders. I have zero issues with transgenders and I have major empathy for the fact that it must be incredibly mentally traumatizing to feel like a woman while having the body of a man. The rate of suicide attempts is as high as 40%. Not even slaves or Jewish prisoners in Nazi Germany had that high rate of suicide attempts. They deserve massive support and compassion by all.

Trans women who have gone through puberty as a man would probably cause an issue in competitive women’s sports. However, it’s probably not as big of a problem as it’s being made out to be. That’s just my general feeling about it. It seems to me that those who want to demonize trans people have taken this issue and magnified it.

I hear you, but that is like saying racism is much less today than in 1950 so it is not that big of a problem. If only a few biological women are hurt by trans women in sports there is a problem.

The people running athletic programs do not want to be labeled transphobic and hence they allow trans women. The biological women that lose to the trans women in sports do not want to be seen as bigots and do not protest. Most people do not want to see themselves as bigots and I can see why.

The lifeboat question is not a great question, IMO. Who asks anybody dressed as a woman in that situation what her genitals look like? It’s meant to polarize and inflame the situation.

And I sure hope Paul’s comment about having oral sex was in jest because it’s pretty ridiculous as well. Nobody is being stigmatized for simply not choosing to have sex with someone.

The lifeboat question assumes one knows the chromosomal composition and speaks to the ingrained chivalry in men (the idea that women and kids go first in the boats). The implication is that there is an emotional non-rational component to the bigotry.

 

[Farb]

Trans have the same rights as anyone else. The problem is that some pious conservative people are uncomfortable with transgenders. I have zero issues with transgenders and I have major empathy for the fact that it must be incredibly mentally traumatizing to feel like a woman while having the body of a man. The rate of suicide attempts is as high as 40%. Not even slaves or Jewish prisoners in Nazi Germany had that high rate of suicide attempts. They deserve massive support and compassion by all.

The suicide rate is something that I just started to looking at yesterday and have not had time to really look into it (that and violent crimes against trans folks) but if I am not mistaken, and it is very possible I am, I think the suicide rate post op for trans is the same as if they received no medical or mental help in the transition.

Also, not sure about comparing jew prisoners in Nazi germany. Wouldn't the nazis prevent the jews from having the things needed in order to kill oneself, much like in a modern prison (Epstein didn't kill himself)? That just seems a to be a hollow but attention grabbing statistic.

 

[Paul]

The suicide rate is something that I just started to looking at yesterday and have not had time to really look into it (that and violent crimes against trans folks) but if I am not mistaken, and it is very possible I am, I think the suicide rate post op for trans is the same as if they received no medical or mental help in the transition.

The suicide attempts are high. It has been attributed to lack of acceptance by society, but there is also inner turmoil. We will have to see what happens in the next decades now that trans are much more accepted. Unfortunately some try suicide even after sex change surgery. Many end up working in the sex industry and as you point out there is a high rate murder and abuse.

Also, not sure about comparing jew prisoners in Nazi germany. Wouldn't the nazis prevent the jews from having the things needed in order to kill oneself, much like in a modern prison (Epstein didn't kill himself)? That just seems a to be a hollow but attention grabbing statistic.

I was just thinking about other terrible situations, but you may be correct.

 

[SystemShock]

System and Paul, disdain is probably the wrong word so I apologize. I meant that you both don’t seem to be willing to grant full rights to trans individuals.

Oh, yeah, that makes it better. What makes you think I don't seem willing to grant full rights to trans individuals?

The lifeboat question is not a great question, IMO. Who asks anybody dressed as a woman in that situation what her genitals look like? It’s meant to polarize and inflame the situation.

Who said anything about anyone wearing a dress? Is wearing a dress all is needed to declare a person a "woman"? The question is only inflammatory for those whose wokeness doesn't let them think, very much the reaction to Dawkins' tweet about self-identification. Let me change it slightly: On a sinking ship, will you give the lifeboat spot to Caitlyn Jenner instead of a biological female?

Or how about someone like, say, Asia Kate Dillon?

And I sure hope Paul’s comment about having oral sex was in jest because it’s pretty ridiculous as well.

I normally avoid speaking for anyone but me, but I have no qualms in telling you, if a man lifted a skirt and found a penis, the overwhelming majority will not like it... and many would turn to violence.

Nobody is being stigmatized for simply not choosing to have sex with someone.

You'd be surprised.

 

[Optimus Prime]

I normally avoid speaking for anyone but me, but I have no qualms in telling you, if a man lifted a skirt and found a penis, the overwhelming majority will not like it... and many would turn to violence.

some states actually have laws protecting the man if this happens (I forget what it’s called - it’s probably not the surprise ding dong law)

a few states are getting rid of it though

 

[V Chip]

if a man lifted a skirt and found a penis, the overwhelming majority will not like it... and many would turn to violence.

I know. We should always think about what the most ignorant among us would do when deciding human rights issues.

 

[SystemShock]

I know. We should always think about what the most ignorant among us would do when deciding human rights issues.

So if one lifts a skirt and finds a penis instead of the expected vagina, one should just start blowing, lest one be considered ignorant, because a BJ is a human right?

 

[coldseat]

So if one lifts a skirt and finds a penis instead of the expected vagina, one should just start blowing, lest one be considered ignorant, because a BJ is a human right?

Your fascination with the particular scenario is amusing. As is your anti-wokness campaign. Also very telling.

 

[SystemShock]

Your fascination with the particular scenario is amusing. As is your anti-wokness campaign. Also very telling.

You got me. Can't get one past you.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

So if one lifts a skirt and finds a penis instead of the expected vagina, one should just start blowing, lest one be considered ignorant, because a BJ is a human right?

This ridiculous argument is beneath you.