Will “mass deportation” actually happen (2 Viewers)

[superchuck500]

It’s so repulsive to see people cheering for what is basically 80% the same thing as the Holocaust - different end result but otherwise very similar.

Economists have said it would tank the economy and cause inflation - notwithstanding the cost.

Is it going to actually happen or is this Build The Wall 2.0?

 

[Sendai]

They don't understand stuff like this. They for sure don't want to go back to the root question of why are illegals so bad?

Illegals pay in 100 billion a year. The biggest expenditure towards them that Republicans harp on is medicaid at 5ish billion.

You need a tax base of workers for your Social Security since all those Republican presidents stole your money, and used it to pay for wars. The only guy who didn't was Clinton.

I have no idea what guys in mask arresting dudes at home depot is doing othe then fulfilling the conservatives thinly veiled racist fever dreams.

What is the net cost? I doubt the 100 billion covers it.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

What is the net cost? I doubt the 100 billion covers it.

The net cost of what? Are you saying that the government spends more on immigrants than immigrants pay in taxes?

 

[Optimus Prime]

The Trump administration deportation campaign is reportedly shifting its focus away from raids on the agricultural and hospitality sectors after Donald Trump conceded this week that his immigration policies are hurting the farming and hotel industries.

The New York Times reported that an internal email was sent on Thursday by Tatum King, a senior official with Immigration and Customs Enforcement (Ice), to regional department leaders at Homeland Security Investigations, directing them to stop workplace immigration enforcement actions unless related to criminal investigations.

“Effective today, please hold on all work site enforcement investigations/operations on agriculture (including aquaculture and meat packing plants), restaurants and operating hotels,” King wrote in the guidance, according to the outlet.


The email explained that investigations involving “human trafficking, money laundering, drug smuggling into these industries are OK”, but added that agents were not to make arrests of “noncriminal collaterals”.

“We will follow the president’s direction and continue to work to get the worst of the worst criminal illegal aliens off of America’s streets,” Tricia McLaughlin, a homeland security department spokesperson, said in a statement to the outlet.

The guidance is a marked shift in emphasis and comes after a week-long protests in Los Angeles over an Ice raid on a garment factory in the city triggered protests when the national guard, and later the marines, were ordered into the city over the objections of California’s governor, Gavin Newsom. Further protests over Ice raids are expected on Saturday.

The modification in guidance comes after Trump said on Thursday that changes to protect certain industries were in the works.

“Our great Farmers and people in the Hotel and Leisure business have been stating that our very aggressive policy on immigration is taking very good, long time workers away from them, with those jobs being almost impossible to replace,” Trump wrote on Truth Social.

“We must protect our Farmers, but get the CRIMINALS OUT OF THE USA. Changes are coming!” he added in the post.……

Ice reportedly shifting away from immigration raids on farms and hotels

Workplace raids will be stopped after Trump conceded that deportations are hurting agricultural and hospitality industries

www.theguardian.com

 

[Dragon]

What is the net cost? I doubt the 100 billion covers it.

The net cost is way less than 100 billion, since they pay into services that they can't even use.

Add to that the "value" of their labor. Caregivers, Construction workers and farm labor- all at a "price" no American citizent would want to work for. So when you go shopping at the supermarket think about how much more you would pay every day if they did not do the work they did for the pay they are receiving.

On another note - and from a European perspective - the last part needs regulation. Safe labor laws, protected minimum wages. propper housing and an official way for seasonal workers to enter the country to work, I know that will never happen because everyone wants cheap labor with no rights which is easy to abuse and cheat!

 

[Optimus Prime]

Hollywood. Silicon Valley. An agricultural sector that grows more than three-quarters of fruits and nuts in America.

All contributed to April’s news that California had officially overtaken Japan to become the fourth biggest economy in the world, its GDP of $4.1tn trailing only the entirety of the US, China and Germany.

But two months later this superpower is locked in a bitter power struggle with Washington DC. Days of protests over immigration raids in Los Angeles prompted Donald Trump to deploy military forcesagainst what he called “insurrectionists” despite strenuous objections from state and local leaders.

The US president even endorsed the arrest of California’s governor, Gavin Newsom, who accused Trump of manufacturing a crisis, filed a lawsuit against the administration and warned in a televised address that America was on the brink of authoritarianism unless citizens take a stand.

It is a fight that Trump has been spoiling for. California has long occupied a special place in the imagination of his “Make America great again” (Maga) movement.

Its name has become a cultural signifier for coastal elitism, illegal immigration and “wokeness” in Republican eyes. It is a $4tn enemy within.

“California, in a way, stands for the opposite of Trumpism,” said Bob Shrum, a Democratic strategist based in Los Angeles. “It stands for tolerance. It stands for diversity, the word that’s now verboten in the administration. It stands for helping poor people and people who’ve been left out. And it stands for giving a fair hearing, unpopular as it may be, to people who applied for asylum.”

Immigration is in California’s cultural DNA. Even former governor Ronald Reagan, a diehard conservative, championed America’s status as a nation of immigrants when he was US president.

In 2018 California became the first “sanctuary state” in the nation when its legislature enacted a law limiting local and state officials from cooperating with federal immigration authorities.

Trump has lost California in three consecutive elections, most recently against Vice-President Kamala Harris, a daughter of immigrants to the Golden state.

It was a leader of the “resistance”against Trump’s first-term agenda, filing more than a hundred lawsuits to challenge the administration’s policies on immigration, environmental regulations, healthcare and other issues………..

In California, Trump finds his perfect antagonist

The president seized on LA protests against immigration raids to deploy troops against civilians in the liberal bastion – a fight he had long been spoiling for

www.theguardian.com

 

[MT15]

The net cost of what? Are you saying that the government spends more on immigrants than immigrants pay in taxes?

Whenever he gets backed into a corner I find that he will just ignore the question. That’s exactly what he said, though, I am curious how he would go about backing that up.

 

[Sendai]

The net cost of what? Are you saying that the government spends more on immigrants than immigrants pay in taxes?

It’s certainly possible. I’d say likely. Housing in New York hotels isn’t cheap. Gather up all the costs of social services federal, state, and local.

 

[MT15]

It’s certainly possible. I’d say likely. Housing in New York hotels isn’t cheap. Gather up all the costs of social services federal, state, and local.

So you’re counting people who are here legally seeking asylum as being part of the undocumented?

 

[Sendai]

So you’re counting people who are here legally seeking asylum as being part of the undocumented?

Those who illegally crossed the border.

 

[MT15]

Those who illegally crossed the border.

Which would be none of the people seeking asylum. They are required to cross the border in order to apply for asylum in most cases.

The people seeking asylum are a special case and should not be included in a discussion about undocumented workers.

 

[MT15]

Also, the benefits to the US are also felt in spending power by undocumented families.

I found this on Google (AI, so fact checking would be appropriate)

Undocumented immigrants are crucial to certain industries, making up 5% of the total workforce in 2022 and playing even larger roles in construction, agriculture, and hospitality.

Their presence helps alleviate labor shortages and keeps industries functioning.

In 2023, undocumented immigrant households held $299 billion in spending power.

 

[MT15]

Just by chance I came across this article just now which seems to prove a point about the spending power of undocumented folks.

ICE Raids Have Sent Latino Shoppers Into Hiding and Big Brands Are Hurting — The Wall Street Journal

Coca-Cola and other companies have seen a drop in sales due in part to a pullback by Hispanic consumers

apple.news

 

[Dragon]

It’s certainly possible. I’d say likely. Housing in New York hotels isn’t cheap. Gather up all the costs of social services federal, state, and local.

Possible? Likely? So you base your arguments on something you believe rather than facts?

Actual numbers with links to sources
In 2022, all undocumented immigrants (which overlaps but is not identical to “asylum seekers”) contributed approximately $96.7 billion in federal, state, and local taxes
https://itep.org/undocumented-immigrants-taxes-2024

Add to that the value of undocumented immigrants as low paid workers and you easity hit 100 billion

 

[TampaJoe]

Possible? Likely? So you base your arguments on something you believe rather than facts?

Actual numbers with links to sources
In 2022, all undocumented immigrants (which overlaps but is not identical to “asylum seekers”) contributed approximately $96.7 billion in federal, state, and local taxes
https://itep.org/undocumented-immigrants-taxes-2024

Add to that the value of undocumented immigrants as low paid workers and you easity hit 100 billion

These are based on estimates. Somebody’s assumptions.

If you are arguing that we are better off with open borders or that we should ignore violations of immigration law, then you lose me.

If we need to change the law, there is a process for that.

 

[fooferdoggie]

The Trump administration deportation campaign is reportedly shifting its focus away from raids on the agricultural and hospitality sectors after Donald Trump conceded this week that his immigration policies are hurting the farming and hotel industries.

what happens when they nab them while they are not working??? taco strikes again.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

It’s certainly possible. I’d say likely. Housing in New York hotels isn’t cheap. Gather up all the costs of social services federal, state, and local.

These are based on estimates. Somebody’s assumptions.

If you are arguing that we are better off with open borders or that we should ignore violations of immigration law, then you lose me.

If we need to change the law, there is a process for that.

Nobody is arguing that, nobody has been arguing that, and it's not a thing that is actually happening, ffs.

Dragon and MT have made the exact points I was going for. Undocumented immigrants pay taxes at the federal and state level despite receiving none of that in direct benefits (EBT, Medicare, etc). They pay more taxes when they spend money at the store. In total, undocumented immigrants contribute more to the economy than they receive. They are a net positive for the economy, and that is a fact.

Instead of demonizing and vilifying, perhaps we should find ways to integrate them into society, since they clearly want to be here and contribute. They chose to come to this country and work in this country and contribute to this country. That's the American Dream. Maybe welcome your neighbors and love them instead of being butt crevasses to them.

 

[Incumbent]

Instead of demonizing and vilifying, perhaps we should find ways to integrate them into society, since they clearly want to be here and contribute.

All the debating and arguing in our county and I find myself settling on that same point. The prevalent argument against undocumented immigrants is the fallback that “well, it’s illegal”. Okay, but just maybe it’s an issue that requires a hell of a lot more nuanced consideration and understanding than that?

Nobody wants gang members and violent criminals crossing the border but they represent a small percentage of people coming here. A thoughtful consideration would mean we don’t come down heavy-handedly on everybody just because the process faces some challenges and there are problems with a small subset of immigrants. That’s a simple and necessary standard we strive for in other social matters, involving other people, so it shouldn’t be an outrage to take that approach with immigration.

Nobody should want to eagerly lose the net benefits of immigration, at least without some transitional steps in place, but the national dialogue has been so thoroughly poisoned by ignorance and malevolence that it’s just another political wedge issue.

 

[MT15]

A thinly disguised veneer - that’s how I think about people who want everyone here without documents to be deported. The “law and order” that MAGA spouts clearly doesn’t apply to them, or Trump, and it certainly doesn’t apply to ICE and the feds who are trampling all over people’s constitutional rights every damn day.

It’s a thin excuse to get rid of people they don’t like, IMO.

A lady on NextDoor made a post commenting on how lovely the NoKings march was - full of patriotic people and good vibes - and someone unironically posted this - “that’s the left for you, every time they lose an election they throw a fit”. Talk about cognitive dissonance. Jan 6 would like a word.

So divorced from reality, I don’t know how we can ever reconcile with someone like that.