What happens to the Republican Party now? (4 Viewers)

[MT15]

This election nonsense by Trump may end up splitting up the Republican Party. I just don’t see how the one third (?) who are principled conservatives can stay in the same party with Trump sycophants who are willing to sign onto the TX Supreme Court case.

We also saw the alt right types chanting “destroy the GOP” in Washington today because they didn’t keep Trump in power. I think the Q types will also hold the same ill will toward the traditional Republican Party. In fact its quite possible that all the voters who are really in a Trump personality cult will also blame the GOP for his loss. It’s only a matter of time IMO before Trump himself gets around to blaming the GOP.

There is some discussion of this on Twitter. What do you all think?

 

[MT15]

More evidence that actual Hungarians don’t really like what Orban is doing.

 

[faceman]

The issue is that cults centered around an individual are devoted to that individual. They are not devoted to ideas, values or philosophies, they are devoted solely to the personality. Sure, the leader of the cult spews bullshirt ideas, values and philosophies, but the thing the leader says is only important to the devotees because they are said by the leader. That's why the cult leader can contradict themselves constantly without any of their devotees questioning them.

Tyrant Trump's cult is a cult of personality devoted to him and only him. When Trump goes, so goes his cult. No one will be able to step in as the new leader of the cult, no matter how charismatic they are. People can speak and act the same way Trump did, but Trump's cult will not follow them. They can build their own cult and they can con some of tyrant Trump's lost devotees into following them, but they will have to work at it. It will not be a "the queen is dead, long live the queen" situation.

Usually when a cult of personalty leader falls, several people compete to take over the cult which leads to the cult splintering into fighting groups until they marginalize themselves and fade away.

It's been said many times on this forum. We have to give credit to Trump for charisma. He has done and said things
that would cost most politicians their career. Vance would never survive dancing silently on the floor after an incoherent
speech or saying a multitude of the things Trump has uttered.

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

It's been said many times on this forum. We have to give credit to Trump for charisma.

I understand what you're saying. I don't see it as charisma. I see it an immoral willingness to say whatever he has to say to con and manipulate prey on people who are vulnerable to being conned and manipulated. There are a lot of people that could have done what Trump has done if they were ruthless and self-serving enough to have absolutely no empathy for anyone else. I don't see that as charisma, even thought that's how it's commonly defined. It's just like how I don't see Musk as any more of a visionary or genius than anyone else. He's just ruthlessly self-serving. Most billionaires are.

He has done and said things that would cost most politicians their career.

I think it's because Trump did it without reservation or hesitation. Also keep in mind that the producers of The Apprentice made Trump look good. Trump didn't make himself look good on that show, the producers did and they had to fight Trump several times to keep from making himself look bad.

Vance would never survive dancing silently on the floor after an incoherent speech or saying a multitude of the things Trump has uttered.

 

[longtime lurker]

Sen. Mark Warner says Trump's tax bill will be a "political albatross" for Republicans

Sen. Mark Warner suggested that the bill, which is nearing a final vote in the Senate, could lose support from Republicans, saying "it's not over until it's over."

www.cbsnews.com

 

[Optimus Prime]

Eric Trump has suggested that the Trump family hasn’t ruled out seeking to establish a political dynasty, with him and other family members potentially running for office.

The second son of President Donald Trump told the Financial Times that a political career would be “easy” for family members to pursue after the end of the president’s second term in 2029.

“The real question is: ‘Do you want to drag other members of your family into it?’” Eric Trump told the paper.

“Would I want my kids to live the same experience over the last decade that I’ve lived?” he asked.

“If the answer was yes, I think the political path would be an easy one, meaning, I think I could do it,” he added. “And by the way, I think other members of our family could do it too.”………

President Eric? Trump’s second son hints at a political dynasty

‘I think the political path would be an easy one, meaning, I think I could do it,’ Eric Trump says

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Optimus Prime]

I understand what you're saying. I don't see it as charisma. I see it an immoral willingness to say whatever he has to say to con and manipulate prey on people who are vulnerable to being conned and manipulated. There are a lot of people that could have done what Trump has done if they were ruthless and self-serving enough to have absolutely no empathy for anyone else. I don't see that as charisma, even thought that's how it's commonly defined. It's just like how I don't see Musk as any more of a visionary or genius than anyone else. He's just ruthlessly self-serving. Most billionaires are.


I think it's because Trump did it without reservation or hesitation. Also keep in mind that the producers of The Apprentice made Trump look good. Trump didn't make himself look good on that show, the producers did and they had to fight Trump several times to keep from making himself look bad.

I get what you're saying but I disagree

Like it or not Trump has a special something, call it charisma, charm, magnetism, pull, special sauce

Whatever you call it, it exists

And whatever it is JD Vance and Ron DeSantis don't have it

Post Trump will be in fighting, backstabbing and dissention worthy of a Game of Thrones episode

Whoever 'wins' won't have that special something either. MAGA will limp along and will still a presence/threat but it won't be anywhere near as when Trump was leading the show

I've said before that it's possible whoever Trump 2.0 is, we haven't see him or her on the national stage yet

Maybe involved in city or town government, maybe even still in school, but they're out there

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

I get what you're saying but I disagree

Like it or not Trump has a special something, call it charisma, charm, magnetism, pull, special sauce

Whatever you call it, it exists

And whatever it is JD Vance and Ron DeSantis don't have it

Post Trump will be in fighting, backstabbing and dissention worthy of a Game of Thrones episode

Whoever 'wins' won't have that special something either. MAGA will limp along and will still a presence/threat but it won't be anywhere near as when Trump was leading the show

I've said before that it's possible whoever Trump 2.0 is, we haven't see him or her on the national stage yet

Maybe involved in city or town government, maybe even still in school, but they're out there

I hear you, but pull should never be followed by special sauce.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Wasn’t sure where to put this
==================

National pride in America has hit a record low, with Democrats and independents feeling less prideful in the country than ever, a new Gallup poll says.

Only 36 percent of Democrats say they're "extremely" or "very" proud to be American,while 53 percent of independents said they were, according to the poll conducted just before the Independence Day holiday weekend

The findings are a stark illustration of how many, but not all, Americans have felt less of a sense of pride in their country over the past decade.

Meanwhile, Republicans reported a higher level of pride in the country, with 92 percent saying they are extremely or very proud to be American.

The split between Democrats and Republicans, at 56 percentage points, is at its widest since 2001. That includes all four years of President Donald Trump's first term.

While Republicans’ pride in the country is on the rise, it’s still not enough to offset the diminishing pride of Democrats…….

Pride in America hits historic low, new poll finds just days before July 4 holiday

While Republicans’ pride has swelled, Democrats and independents are less prideful in the United States than ever

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Optimus Prime]

 

[DaveXA]

Denaturalization is a thing now? Might just have to go ahead and pack my bags considering my wife is a naturalized citizen. I don’t even recognize this country anymore.

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

If they succeed, then I have no doubt their will be civil strife if not civil war.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Trump didn’t create this, but he unleashed it, weaponized it and made it not only politically and socially acceptable but damn near required

Everyone in his orbit has said similar vile things

There was a time when a statement like that would be soon followed by a tearful resignation

That time is over

Someone was saying that years or decades from now Donald Trump won’t even be remembered

Even if only giving terrible people permission to voice their worst impulses and being rewarded for it, he’ll be remembered, not in the way he hopes to be but he will remembered

 

[Optimus Prime]

If they succeed, then I have no doubt their will be civil strife if not civil war.

We discussed that possibility

Civil War 2?

Very sobering article ================ If you know people still in denial about the crisis of American democracy, kindly remove their heads from the sand long enough to receive this message: A startling new finding by one of the nation’s top authorities on foreign civil wars says we are on the...

madaboutpolitics.com

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

We discussed that possibility

Civil War 2?

Very sobering article ================ If you know people still in denial about the crisis of American democracy, kindly remove their heads from the sand long enough to receive this message: A startling new finding by one of the nation’s top authorities on foreign civil wars says we are on the...

madaboutpolitics.com

Yeah. Using the analogy of the nuclear clock, I think the civil war clock is at 11:59:30pm for America.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Angela Paxton, the wife of Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton — who is in the midst of a heated Republican U.S. Senate primary — announced Thursday that she is filing for divorce, citing “biblical reasons.”

Angela is also an elected officials, holding a Texas state senate seat. Her husband is challenging the state’s senior U.S. senator, John Cornyn, in next year’s primary for the GOP nomination. If Paxton wins, Cornyn will lose his seat in the chamber — unless he runs as an independent, and wins in November.

But the wording of Angela Paxton’s post on X, formerly known as Twitter, suggested that the challenger could be in for an unpleasant news cycle (or cycles).

“Today, after 38 years of marriage, I filed for divorce on biblical grounds. I believe marriage is a sacred covenant and I have earnestly pursued reconciliation. But in light of recent discoveries, I do not believe that it honors God or is loving to myself, my children, or Ken to remain in the marriage,” wrote Angela Paxton, who has represented a district in northeast Texas in the state legislature since 2019.…….

Texas U.S. Senate candidate Ken Paxton’s wife files for divorce on ‘biblical grounds’

Paxton is running a MAGA challenge against an incumbent Texas senator -- and winning, according to polls

www.independent.co.uk

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Angela Paxton, the wife of Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton — who is in the midst of a heated Republican U.S. Senate primary — announced Thursday that she is filing for divorce, citing “biblical reasons.”

Angela is also an elected officials, holding a Texas state senate seat. Her husband is challenging the state’s senior U.S. senator, John Cornyn, in next year’s primary for the GOP nomination. If Paxton wins, Cornyn will lose his seat in the chamber — unless he runs as an independent, and wins in November.

But the wording of Angela Paxton’s post on X, formerly known as Twitter, suggested that the challenger could be in for an unpleasant news cycle (or cycles).

“Today, after 38 years of marriage, I filed for divorce on biblical grounds. I believe marriage is a sacred covenant and I have earnestly pursued reconciliation. But in light of recent discoveries, I do not believe that it honors God or is loving to myself, my children, or Ken to remain in the marriage,” wrote Angela Paxton, who has represented a district in northeast Texas in the state legislature since 2019.…….

Texas U.S. Senate candidate Ken Paxton’s wife files for divorce on ‘biblical grounds’

Paxton is running a MAGA challenge against an incumbent Texas senator -- and winning, according to polls

www.independent.co.uk

Grindr profile. Calling it now.

 

[MT15]

More GOP chicanery. They don’t believe in democracy anymore. It’s just obvious.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Speaker Johnson: People have been 'misled' about separation of church and state

The top House Republican argued the phrase “separation of church and state” was a personal adage from Thomas Jefferson meant to protect religious practices from government interference.

www.deseret.com

FULL TEXT:

The True Meaning of "The Separation of Church and State"

Amid all the other big news this week, a landmark development in a federal court in Texas drew less attention than expected. On Monday, the IRS agreed to a consent judgment that will restore the First Amendment rights of churches and religious non-profit organizations to speak freely without losing their tax-exempt status.

The court should quickly approve that proposed settlement of a lawsuit filed by the National Religious Broadcasters and Texas churches, which was brought to overturn a 1950s-era provision in the tax code known as “the Johnson Amendment.”

As a former constitutional law litigator, I - along with many of my former colleagues - have long argued that the Johnson Amendment is unconstitutional. President Trump understands this well, and in his speech to the 2017 National Prayer Breakfast, he resolved to "get rid of and totally destroy the Johnson Amendment and allow our representatives of faith to speak freely and without fear of retribution."

Resolving the Texas case will be key to ensuring that people of faith are no longer censored and silenced because of the tax code — and hopefully it will serve as a teachable moment about one of the most misunderstood subjects in our culture.

Most people today who insist upon a rigid “separation between church and state” are unaware the phrase derives not from the Constitution, but from a personal letter that President Thomas Jefferson wrote to the Danbury Baptist Association in 1802.

He explained that because “religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God,” the language of the First Amendment is a vital safeguard for our “rights of conscience.” Jefferson said he revered “that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,’ thus building a wall of separation between Church & State.”

Jefferson clearly did not mean that metaphorical “wall” was to keep religion from influencing issues of civil government. To the contrary, it was meant to keep the federal government from impeding the religious practice of citizens. The Founders wanted to protect the church from an encroaching state, not the other way around.

The majority of the Founders, having personally witnessed the abuses of the Church of England, were determined to prevent the official establishment of any single national denomination or religion. However, they very deliberately listed religious liberty (the free exercise of religion) as the first freedom protected in the Bill of Rights **because they wanted everyone to freely live out their faith - as that would ensure a robust presence of moral virtue in the public square and the free marketplace of ideas.**

Volumes written on this topic can be summarized by reference to the sentiments of our first two presidents. In his historic Farewell Address, “the Father of our Country,” George Washington, declared: “Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports.” John Adams warned directly: “Our Constitution is made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”

What these two Founders and their fellow patriots all understood from history was that there are many important rules and practices that can help build and sustain a healthy republic. But the key - and the essential foundation - of a system of government like ours must be a common commitment among the citizenry to the principles of religion and morality.

The Founders acknowledged in the Declaration the self-evident truths that all men are created equal, and that God gives all men the same inalienable rights. However, they knew that in order to maintain a government “of the people, by the people and for the people,” as Lincoln articulated, in "this nation, under God," those inalienable rights must be exercised in a responsible manner.

They thus believed in liberty that is legitimately constrained by a common sense of morality - and a healthy fear of the Creator, who granted all men our rights.

The Founders understood that all men are fallen and that power corrupts. They also knew that no amount of institutional checks and balances or decentralization of power in civil authorities would be sufficient to maintain a just government if the men in charge had no fear of eternal judgment by a power HIGHER than their temporal institutions.

A free society and a healthy republic depend upon religious and moral virtue- not only because they help prevent political corruption and the abuse of power - but also because those convictions in the minds and hearts of the people make it possible to preserve their essential freedoms by emphasizing and inspiring individual responsibility, self-sacrifice, the dignity of hard work, the rule of law, civility, patriotism, the value of family and community, and the sanctity of every human life. Without those virtues, “indispensably supported” by religion and morality, every nation will ultimately fall.

Inscribed on the third panel of the Jefferson Memorial here in Washington, D.C., is his sobering reminder to every American: “God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, that his justice cannot sleep forever.”

The experience of history teaches that these principles are universal and timeless, and they certainly apply to our nation today. Alexis de Tocqueville is credited with the keen observation that “America is great because she is good, and if she ever ceases to be good, she will cease to be great.” That has been the key to our exceptionalism. Our republic depends upon it now more than ever, and it is our job to instill and preserve it.

As we approach the 250th birthday of our great nation, it has never been more important to defend truth on every front, repair our foundations, and hold fast to who we are and what we stand for. Anyone who has been misled to believe that religious principles and viewpoints must be separated from public affairs should be reminded to review their history.

Let us hope the federal court in Texas accepts the IRS consent judgment as yet another acknowledgment of these essential truths.