What happens to the Republican Party now? (1 Viewer)

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    MT15

    MT15

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    This election nonsense by Trump may end up splitting up the Republican Party. I just don’t see how the one third (?) who are principled conservatives can stay in the same party with Trump sycophants who are willing to sign onto the TX Supreme Court case.

    We also saw the alt right types chanting “destroy the GOP” in Washington today because they didn’t keep Trump in power. I think the Q types will also hold the same ill will toward the traditional Republican Party. In fact its quite possible that all the voters who are really in a Trump personality cult will also blame the GOP for his loss. It’s only a matter of time IMO before Trump himself gets around to blaming the GOP.

    There is some discussion of this on Twitter. What do you all think?



     
    nolaspe said:
    Now, if only this would happen in DC...
    www.opb.org

    Oregon House expels state Rep. Mike Nearman, plotter of state Capitol incursion

    Nearman refused to resign in the face of overwhelming evidence he would be ejected from the Legislature. The four-term Republican lawmaker becomes the first person ever expelled from the Oregon House.
    www.opb.org
    Click to expand...

    Has any sitting Congress person been accused or charged of conspiring with any in the group in the attack on the US Capitol? I haven't read anything to that effect.
     
    Yes, Dave, there have been. Several R Representatives, IIRC, were actively involved in setting up the rally and at least one spoke in the run up to the insurrection.

    There’s a video of one R lawmaker signaling from a window to someone in the crowd below during the breach.

    A pretty common assumption is that every R voted against the independent investigation to protect their members who were so deeply involved.
     
    I couldn’t remember who did what, so I found this: Mo Brooks said the following to the crowd on Jan. 6:

    “Today is the day American patriots start taking down names and kicking arse,” said Mr. Brooks, Republican of Alabama. “Are you willing to do what it takes to fight for America? Louder! Will you fight for America?”

    This is a tweet from Jan. 6 by Gosar:


    F2F18339-984D-4ED1-A752-8D6444B7CC4E.jpeg


    And this from the same NYT article:

    “Their comments have raised questions about the degree to which Republicans may have coordinated with protest organizers. In a since-deleted tweet, Representative Pete Sessions, Republican of Texas, wrote that he “had a great meeting today with the folks from Stop The Steal,” one of the leading groups that organized last week’s rally.

    And in a separate video, Ali Alexander, a far-right activist and conspiracy theorist who emerged as a leader of Stop the Steal, claimed that he, along with Mr. Brooks, Mr. Gosar and Representative Andy Biggs of Arizona, had set the Jan. 6 event in motion.”

    www.nytimes.com

    Before Capitol Riot, Republican Lawmakers Fanned the Flames (Published 2021)

    A “1776 moment”: Several of the president’s closest allies in Congress used bellicose language to urge their supporters to attend the Jan. 6 rally that turned into a deadly riot.
    www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
     
    Last edited by a moderator:
    MT15 said:
    I couldn’t remember who did what, so I found this: Mo Brooks said the following to the crowd on Jan. 6:

    “Today is the day American patriots start taking down names and kicking arse,” said Mr. Brooks, Republican of Alabama. “Are you willing to do what it takes to fight for America? Louder! Will you fight for America?”

    This is a tweet from Jan. 6 by Gosar:


    F2F18339-984D-4ED1-A752-8D6444B7CC4E.jpeg


    And this from the same NYT article:

    “Their comments have raised questions about the degree to which Republicans may have coordinated with protest organizers. In a since-deleted tweet, Representative Pete Sessions, Republican of Texas, wrote that he “had a great meeting today with the folks from Stop The Steal,” one of the leading groups that organized last week’s rally.

    And in a separate video, Ali Alexander, a far-right activist and conspiracy theorist who emerged as a leader of Stop the Steal, claimed that he, along with Mr. Brooks, Mr. Gosar and Representative Andy Biggs of Arizona, had set the Jan. 6 event in motion.”

    www.nytimes.com

    Before Capitol Riot, Republican Lawmakers Fanned the Flames (Published 2021)

    A “1776 moment”: Several of the president’s closest allies in Congress used bellicose language to urge their supporters to attend the Jan. 6 rally that turned into a deadly riot.
    www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
    Click to expand...

    Hell, Gosar tagged Ali Alexander in the tweet you posted the screenshot of. They were all up to their necks in this.
     
    You wonder where the regular folks come up with the junk they think is real? They get it from the garbage news they watch. This couldn’t be a more wrong take - and what’s the problem with a patriotic American saying the pledge to Allah instead of God? It’s so gd stupid.

     
    That’s some crazy stuff. A lt. gov. using the governor’s absence of a few days to seize control and issue sweeping mandates? And it’s not the first time she‘s done it either. Nothing authoritarian about that, lol.

    My hope is that as the Trumpy Rs move further into crazytown, they are just going to alienate more and more people. I don’t know why the radical Rs think that by splitting the R party they will get more votes in the general. It baffles me, tbh.

    So, even if it’s only 30% of Rs who leave the party due to the crazy, that’s a crippling blow to a political party. The numbers just don’t add up.
     
    MT15 said:
    So, even if it’s only 30% of Rs who leave the party due to the crazy, that’s a crippling blow to a political party. The numbers just don’t add up.
    Click to expand...
    The thing is - that 30% is still voting R regardless, so why the kowtowing to the far right?
     
    B4YOU said:
    People keep saying it’s 30% or 35%. Trump won 47%.
    Click to expand...

    The 30% to 35% are the Trump/populist base that have drank the kool-aid. The other 12% to 17% are Republican voters that just aren’t going to vote for Democrats, often simply because of tax policy (or similar core issues that don’t mean they’re on board with the populist-Trumpist viewpoint).
     
    JRad said:
    The thing is - that 30% is still voting R regardless, so why the kowtowing to the far right?
    Click to expand...

    I don’t think that the 30% (which is a made up number, just a guess) who leave the party will be voting for Trump or any Trumpy Rs. There has been a steady trickle of people leaving the party all during Trump’s disastrous term, but I do think Jan. 6 hastened and increased the flow.

    I don’t think we know yet just how many are thoroughly disgusted, and done with voting for what I think of as the “crazy”. But it’s not zero.

    This is one way I think Trump’s ban from social media actually helps him. Once he starts back in talking about “crime of the century” and just exposing people to his idiocy, which is getting worse with time, it will be like when his popularity dipped because he was giving the daily COVID updates.

    This is the hope I am counting on right now anyway. 🤞🏻
     
    If those 12-17% just stay home, they don’t have to vote for Democrats.
     
    I've been seeing this argument more lately
    ==============================

    One of the edifying side effects of the Trump era has been that, by making democracy the explicit subject of political debate, it has revealed the stark fact many influential conservatives do not believe in it. Mike Lee blurted out last fall that he opposes “rank democracy.” His fellow Republican senator, Rand Paul, tells the New York Times today, “The idea of democracy and majority rule really is what goes against our history and what the country stands for. The Jim Crow laws came out of democracy. That’s what you get when a majority ignores the rights of others.”

    Paul is a bit of a crank, but here he is gesturing at a recognizable set of ideas that have long been articulated by conservative intellectuals. Importantly, these ideas are not identified solely with the most extreme or Trumpy conservatives. Indeed, they have frequently been articulated by conservatives who express deep personal animosity toward Donald Trump and his cultists.

    The belief system Paul is endorsing contains a few related claims. First, the Founders explicitly and properly rejected majoritarianism. (Their favorite shorthand is “We’re a republic, not a democracy.”) Second, to the extent the current system has shortcomings, they reveal the ignorance of the majority and hence underscore the necessity of limiting democracy. Third, slavery and Jim Crow are the best historical examples of democracy run amok.

    National Review has consistently advocated this worldview since its founding years, when it used these ideas to oppose civil-rights laws, and has persisted in using these ideas to argue for restrictions on the franchise. “Was ‘democracy’ good when it empowered slave owners and Jim Crow racists?,” asked NR’s David Harsanyi. Majority rule “sounds like a wonderful thing … if you haven’t met the average American voter,” argued NR’s Kevin Williamson, rebutting the horrifying ideal of majority rule with the knock-down argument: “If we’d had a fair and open national plebiscite about slavery on December 6, 1865, slavery would have won in a landslide.”.............

     
    I think that those views are about as repugnant as it gets. And they paint liberals as “elitists”?

    I would ask Williamson if the slaves got to vote in his hypothetical? Also, I think he’s dead wrong anyway. I would have to look it up, but I’m thinking that the population in the North outweighed the population in the South at that time. Slavery would have been abolished in his meaningless hypothetical. Someone with more historical knowledge than I have can fact check me here.

    What a load of crap those guys are pushing.
     

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