Trump loyalists in Congress to challenge Electoral College results in Jan. 6 joint session (Update: Insurrectionists storm Congress)(And now what?) (4 Viewers)

[superchuck500]

I guess it's time to start a thread for this. We know that at least 140 members of Congress have pledged to join the objection. Under federal law, if at least one member of each house (HOR and Senate) objects, each house will adjourn the joint session for their own session (limited at two hours) to take up the objection. If both houses pass a resolution objecting to the EC result, further action can take place. If both houses do not (i.e. if one or neither passes a resolution), the objection is powerless and the college result is certified.

Clearly this is political theater as we know such a resolution will not pass the House, and there's good reason to think it wouldn't pass the Senate either (with or without the two senators from Georgia). The January 6 joint session is traditionally a ceremonial one. This one will not be.

Many traditional pillars of Republican support have condemned the plan as futile and damaging. Certainly the Trump loyalists don't care - and many are likely doing it for fundraising purposes or to carry weight with the fraction of their constituencies that think this is a good idea.

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL32717.pdf

 

[BayouSAINTJoe]

The Law of Unintended Consequences strikes again.

This is what we get when gerrymandering is allowed to run completely out of control. When politicians can pick the voters, you get this synergy where nothing they do will ever have any consequences.

Yep...causes the extremes to bubble up to the top. I long for the days where we thought Bachmann was crazy...scratch that she still is:

 

[bdb13]

I forking feel you Joe

 

[Mr. Blue Sky]

I dunno, Baldwin is a jerk too.

Now you’re equating Alec Baldwin, an actor who has a temper.. with Trump, a President who incites insurrections and encourages racists??


Come on, man.

 

[Incumbent]

Works for me. That said, the seditionists are already on record. At least 12 of them (Senators) had stated they would go on record objecting to the electoral votes of several states. That changed last night when some withdrew their objections. I'd say at minimum Cruz and Hawley need to be censured in the Senate for their actions and the 100+ in the House. The WV Rep who participated in that mob yesterday needs to be removed from office immediately. That was shameful.

It's hard to calculate the damage that has already been done, other than to know it is severe and very likely longstanding.

*A bit of a tangent: I'm already somebody who thinks it is well past time to end the Electoral College (understanding the difficulty of that ever happening) but these events just further my opposition to the antiquated process. If we really want every vote to count and put an end to some of the procedural nonsense that paves the way for this kind of garbage, ridding ourselves of the EC would go a long way towards that.

 

[efil4]

Thanks for the tip about the BB code. Your suspicion is correct - that particular feature is not supported.

In regards orthodoxy; one thing that intrigues me is the portrayal of Trump. Certainly people with left-wing leangings tend to automatically associate him with Fascism, Racism and White Supremacy. However, the reasons they do so are usually in error. (I'm not saying that he isn't any of those things. I doubt it, but I don't really know. However, the stated reasons for the accusations are often false, even though frequently repeated in the media. ).

This has made me deeply suspicious about ANY media pronouncements about him, ESPECIALLY when people say things like 'it's well know' or 'its obvious' or 'everyone knows that.. ' Or, as the New York Times might put it.. "people close to people in the administration who overhead people saying that Trump said.. ", when they have been demonstrated to have made it up.

When we come to look back at the Trump presidency, many people will moan that he damaged America. Well, I don't think he has. But what HAS been badly damaged - in my opinion - is public trust in what is called the "Mainstream" Media. Organisations like CNN, the New York Times and the Washington post (to a lesser extent) abandoned their role as Newspapers, and virtually became propaganda outlets for the Democratic Party.

Perhaps it has always been this way, and I've only recently noticed ?

You are obviously quite green when it comes to Donald Trump and motives and operational moves.

I would suggest you start familiarizing yourself with his motivation and modus operandi so that you get a full picture of just who this man is and how he has operated for over 40 years.

He is a man of opportunity. He will use it to leverage himself, regardless of consequences, so long as the end result is to further Donald Trump. If he sees the undercurrent of bigotry and hate, and that he has to align himself just a tad to appear to be "like minded" to achieve a goal, he will do. His words, while to you, may be ambiguous, they are not. Never has been. He speaks in a manner that leaves the subject open to interpretation, knowing full well that the ones he wants to reach, will understand. Yet providing him cover due to the ambiguity ( think deniability )
He is a master at shunning responsibility. Shoot, look no further than the Vaccine implementation here. He decided very quickly to put the "States" in charge of vaccinations. All the while touting how they will use the military to innocculate millions a month. Now? No military, states are in charge, and when pressed about the massive delays, he can say " welp, talk to the States".

I suggest "You've been Trumped" as a watch since the setting is in your neck of the woods.

 

[DaveXA]

Now you’re equating Alec Baldwin, an actor who has a temper.. with Trump, a President who incites insurrections and encourages racists??


Come on, man.

I didn't think what he said was equating the two. They both can be jerks. Different kinds of jerks, sure. But still jerks.

 

[DaveXA]

It's hard to calculate the damage that has already been done, other than to know it is severe and very likely longstanding.

*A bit of a tangent: I'm already somebody who thinks it is well past time to end the Electoral College (understanding the difficulty of that ever happening) but these events just further my opposition to the antiquated process. If we really want every vote to count and put an end to some of the procedural nonsense that paves the way for this kind of garbage, ending the EC would go a long way towards that.

I agree. I'm not really a fan of the EC either, but it's our government, so we work with what's there until it's changed.

 

[wardorican]

Works for me. That said, the seditionists are already on record. At least 12 of them (Senators) had stated they would go on record objecting to the electoral votes of several states. That changed last night when some withdrew their objections. I'd say at minimum Cruz and Hawley need to be censured in the Senate for their actions and the 100+ in the House. The WV Rep who participated in that mob yesterday needs to be removed from office immediately. That was shameful.

I'd be a little careful about that. If they did what others have done in the past, about raising objections, then there is no reason to censure them. McConnell, if correct, stated that Pelosi and others have done something similar before... If they went beyond that, or are encouraging the public to fight (I don't think they did), then just give them a political consequence from the people (I know it won't do any good).

I'm more encouraged by the Senators who decided to not challenge Michigan and other states after the Capital breach. At least a few realized they needed to be the adults in the room.

And some of the arguments about state elections are valid. The way voter laws were updated due to a pandemic, are valid to argue. But you can't wait until after the election, or after ballots are sent out to wage that battle. It's too late. The toothpaste is out of the tube, and the 'cure' is too drastic. You'd have to throw out all mail in ballots in those states, because you can't go back to find out which were requested under old law vs current law. If that law didn't hold up to judicial scrutiny.

I don't mind them looking into some of that. Just like we rightfully investigated the Russia interference in 2016. There was a lot of legitimate interference, and then an amount of story time built around it. Now, story time was due to some real smoke.

 

[wardorican]

Now you’re equating Alec Baldwin, an actor who has a temper.. with Trump, a President who incites insurrections and encourages racists??


Come on, man.

No, I'm just saying if we're going to do a swap out, pick better.

The good news is that on Jan 20th, we will have better.

 

[efil4]

Yep...causes the extremes to bubble up to the top. I long for the days where we thought Bachmann was crazy...scratch that she still is:

LOL she praying to Zeus?

 

[SFIDC3]

As did my dad and father in law, I am almost glad they aren’t here to see this.

My dad was in WWII on the ground in France then Germany. He would be appalled and angry about seeing "Nazis" storm the capitol, I'm almost glad as well....

 

[Incumbent]

I agree. I'm not really a fan of the EC either, but it's our government, so we work with what's there until it's changed.

Well, certainly, but it's through collective and increasing dialogue that opinion-shifting and resulting change can ever happen. So it's my hope a national spotlight intensifies on the EC, since I believe it is a serious flaw in our system.

 

[DaveXA]

Just saw a quote from General Mattis, former SecDef. He states:

"Our Constitution and out Republic will overcome this stain...Mr. Trump will deservedly be left a man without a country."

Rekt.

 

[wardorican]

My dad was in WWII on the ground in France then Germany. He would be appalled and angry about seeing "Nazis" storm the capitol, I'm almost glad as well....

I'm reframing this today.

They may have stormed the capitol (along with many others), but they lost in the end. Democracy eventually won early this morning.

 

[MT15]

I think we're at a point where it's at least important to once again get members of congress on the record. They bear a substantial responsibility for anything Trump does or incites over the next two weeks.

I just read that both sides of Congress are out until after the Inauguration. They won’t protect us.

We will have to rely on Pence and the cabinet for the next 13 days. Sigh.

 

[DaveXA]

I just read that both sides of Congress are out until after the Inauguration. They won’t protect us.

That's not true though. At least the Senate has scheduled "pro forma" sessions several days prior to the 20th. McConnell covered this at the close of the PA objection vote. Not sure about the House though.

The entire Congress can be called for emergency sessions, but I don't see that happening.

 

[MT15]

Oh, good to know. I did not stay up that late.

 

[The moose]

I just read that both sides of Congress are out until after the Inauguration. They won’t protect us.

We will have to rely on Pence and the cabinet for the next 13 days. Sigh.

If any humans have work to do in this world right it is them.

I can't see how any one of them can go home.