Trump floats claims for Canada, Greenland, and the Panama Canal (Update: Trump wants Gaza too) (10 Viewers)

[superchuck500]

Oh, but he's only joking - well, maybe, so they say. Or sort of joking with Canada, and maybe not joking with Greenland - saying that "ownership and control of Greenland is an absolute necessity" doesn't sound like a joke . . . and um, not sure about what the about Panama Canal thing is?

Trump Jokes Canada Becoming 51st US State 'A Great Idea'

US President-elect Donald Trump said Wednesday it would be "a great idea" for Canada to become the 51st US state, teasing on social media that "many Canadians" welcome the idea, as Ottawa is wracked by a political crisis.

www.barrons.com

Trump threatens to try to take back the Panama Canal. Panama's president balks at the suggestion

Trump didn't explain how such a takeover would be possible, given that the U.S. relinquished control of the canal to Panama in 1999 under a treaty signed by President Jimmy Carter in 1977.

apnews.com

 

[efil4]

Did you just realize six months ago that a world outside of the US existed? I ask because your view of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is woefully simplistic.

of course it is. it HAS to be. Dont need to spend much time on understanding "others"- their history, their plight, their views.

THATS how we got here. There are 76,999,999 others just like him. And they all voted same way.

 

[superchuck500]

I don’t know what Trump’s ultimate objective is here. He says a lot of things and many never come to pass. That is how he operates. He said Mexico would pay for the wall.

That doesn’t change the fact that Gaza is decimated and millions of Palestinians have no where to live nor the resources to rebuild or survive.

So again. Sometime in the not too distant future, decisions will have to be made. It will come down to what the players in the region want and will tolerate. The Palestinians themselves are in the weakest position at the table.

Well that's the point isn't it? Trump said he was going to build a wall - he said Mexico was going to pay for it. Of course that was never going to happen, so he tried to get Congress to pay for it and they wouldn't. So he tried to reprogram other funds and was largely thwarted from doing that.

Last I looked, there isn't any wall. There wasn't some other objective, there wasn't any "3D chess". What he aimed to do failed. It's certainly not the mark of a strong leader - but threatening to own Gaza is far more problematic for US interests than promising to build a wall on the southern border.

I don't disagree with your general viewpoint about the state of Gaza - but when take a reasonable look at the cards here, where does "let's put the USA in control of Gaza!" make any sense? The Palestinians may appear weak - so did the Viet Cong. These things have a way of favoring the long game over asymmetric power . . . and once you start shuffling the deck, you can't insist on a new paradigm and also expect old structures to remain. The Arab response to Trump has been more unified on anything from the Arab world in a long time. It's not just the Palestinians on that side of the table . . .

The Trump administration is gambling on being able to strong-arm Cairo and Amman by threatening to cut U.S. aid, as both countries are directly dependent on it. Without aid they would be forced to introduce austerity measures, risking political and economic turmoil. Just last week, Trump hinted at the leverage he feels he has: “They will do it. They will do it… We do a lot for them, and they’re gonna do it,” he said.

But so far, the hints of financial blackmail have not been working. The Egyptian leader repeated his rejection of resettling any Palestinians in his country last week, saying: “The displacement and removal of the Palestinian people from their lands is an injustice that we will never participate in.” And Abdullah told European officials in Brussels that Jordan remains unwavering “on the necessity of establishing Palestinians on their land and gaining their legitimate rights, in accordance with the two-state solution.”

Moreover, as these messages didn’t seem to be getting through, top diplomats from Egypt, Jordan, the United Arab Emirates, Saudi Arabia and Qatar all flatly rejected any forcible displacement of Palestinians during a meeting in Cairo on Saturday: “We affirm our rejection of [any attempts] to compromise Palestinians’ unalienable rights, whether through settlement activities, or evictions or annex of land or through vacating the land from its owners … in any form or under any circumstances or justifications,” they said in a joint communiqué.

Trump’s Gaza fantasy is a recipe for a forever war

U.S. president is pressing countries to take in Palestinians by threatening to cut aid, but it’s too dangerous for Arab leaders to accept that blackmail.

www.politico.eu

 

[TampaJoe]

Well that's the point isn't it? Trump said he was going to build a wall - he said Mexico was going to pay for it. Of course that was never going to happen, so he tried to get Congress to pay for it and they wouldn't. So he tried to reprogram other funds and was largely thwarted from doing that.

Last I looked, there isn't any wall. There wasn't some other objective, there wasn't any "3D chess". What he aimed to do failed. It's certainly not the mark of a strong leader - but threatening to own Gaza is far more problematic for US interests than promising to build a wall on the southern border.

I don't disagree with your general viewpoint about the state of Gaza - but when take a reasonable look at the cards here, where does "let's put the USA in control of Gaza!" make any sense? The Palestinians may appear weak - so did the Viet Cong. These things have a way of favoring the long game over asymmetric power . . . and once you start shuffling the deck, you can't insist on a new paradigm and also expect old structures to remain. The Arab response to Trump has been more unified on anything from the Arab world in a long time. It's not just the Palestinians on that side of the table . . .

Trump’s Gaza fantasy is a recipe for a forever war

U.S. president is pressing countries to take in Palestinians by threatening to cut aid, but it’s too dangerous for Arab leaders to accept that blackmail.

www.politico.eu

Do you think Trumps proposal was serious? I don’t. But it did start a conversation. So I guess we will see what the Arab states propose if anything.

Rebuilding Gaza is going to take a lot of time and money. Those folks are going to need shelter, food, water, medical care, etc. They need it now. They don’t have the resources so this will have to come from somewhere outside Gaza. As I said earlier, the Palestinians have the weakest position at the table.

 

[coldseat]

Do you think Trumps proposal was serious? I don’t. But it did start a conversation. So I guess we will see what the Arab states propose if anything.

Rebuilding Gaza is going to take a lot of time and money. Those folks are going to need shelter, food, water, medical care, etc. They need it now. They don’t have the resources so this will have to come from somewhere outside Gaza. As I said earlier, the Palestinians have the weakest position at the table.

You never take anything he says seriously. But yet somehow find a way to always justify what he says by claiming he's just "asking questions" or "starting a conversation".

What he proposed is absurd, dangerous and should be rejected by everybody out of hand. That's all that needs to be said.

 

[TampaJoe]

You never take anything he says seriously. But yet somehow find a way to always justify what he says by claiming he's just "asking questions" or "starting a conversation".

What he proposed is absurd, dangerous and should be rejected by everybody out of hand. That's all that needs to be said.

I’ll let you be obsessed with everything Trump says. You can characterize it however you choose. I’m not defending or justifying what he says. But that won’t stop him from saying it. It would be easier for everyone if he didn’t talk so much.

The problem of what to do in Gaza remains.

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

Do you think Trumps proposal was serious? I don’t. But it did start a conversation. So I guess we will see what the Arab states propose if anything.

Do you realize this is now a meme, you guys keep excusing what he says...

 

[TampaJoe]

Do you realize this is now a meme, you guys keep excusing what he says...

You guys seem more worried about folks condemning Trump that solving the underlying problem.

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

You guys seem more worried about folks condemning Trump that solving the underlying problem.

The inability to recognize Trump for who he is, is a good part of the underlying problem. Basically, just a recognition of reality.

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

Oh, and as far as the underlying problem of Gaza/Palestine/Israel - there is no solving it now. There is no just solution. It really is best for the US to stop providing money and arms to both entities until they've worked something out themselves.

 

[TampaJoe]

The inability to recognize Trump for who he is, is a good part of the underlying problem. Basically, just a recognition of reality.

You think people don’t recognize who Trump is? That’s laughable. They know who he is. They have accepted who he is. They choose him over Biden/Harris despite who he is and all his baggage. I don’t know what you expect to happen. He isn’t going to change and those folks who supported him aren’t suddenly going to switch ideologies. So complain all you want Jim.

Another part of the underlying problem is that all the opposition has offered is whining about Trump. That was not a winning election strategy and I doubt it will be any more successful post election. Maybe it’s all they have.

 

[Eeyore]

Totally not inciting another 9/11

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

You think people don’t recognize who Trump is? That’s laughable. They know who he is. They have accepted who he is. They choose him over Biden/Harris despite who he is and all his baggage. I don’t know what you expect to happen. He isn’t going to change and those folks who supported him aren’t suddenly going to switch ideologies. So complain all you want Jim.

Another part of the underlying problem is that all the opposition has offered is whining about Trump. That was not a winning election strategy and I doubt it will be any more successful post election. Maybe it’s all they have.

I don't know man. I know people who think he does have evidence of voter fraud and has for some reason just never produced it. They don't believe he called American troops suckers and losers. That he's quite trustworthy and so on...

And the opposition has certainly offered up solutions and policies. They can't debate Trump on them b/c he never offers up solutions of his own -- just a trust me, it's going to be great (see "concepts of a plan", solve Ukraine day 1), etc.

People who voted for Trump believe he's got some sort of magic fairy dust that will make it all better.

 

[TampaJoe]

Oh, and as far as the underlying problem of Gaza/Palestine/Israel - there is no solving it now. There is no just solution. It really is best for the US to stop providing money and arms to both entities until they've worked something out themselves.

Well that is an alternative solution. Do you think a majority in either party will favor cutting funding to Israel? Do you think left to their own devices that either Hamas or Israel is willing to sit down and work something out?

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

Well that is an alternative solution. Do you think a majority in either party will favor cutting funding to Israel? Do you think left to their own devices that either Hamas or Israel is willing to sit down and work something out?

Honestly, I don't know. This was my area of study in college. I've hitch hiked all across the region, hung out with Syrians in Aleppo to watch the world cup. Shopped the markets of Hebron. Crashed on the sofas of Israelis. I lived in Egypt, participated in Operation Iraqi Freedom.

There was a time I think peace was possible, but I'm afraid that ship has mostly sailed now. The landscape has tilted too much in Israel's favor, and they don't seem interested in creating a solution that would be acceptable for any self respecting people (ie, a viable independent state that isn't carved up into tiny bits and no actual ability to act independently).

So, the best thing for the US is to just say "we're out. we aren't going to participate as you guys slaughter each other. get back to us when you're serious about peace". I mean maybe... there's danger in that as well. We've been way too involved for way too long to escape a sense of responsibility.

 

[TampaJoe]

I don't know man. I know people who think he does have evidence of voter fraud and has for some reason just never produced it. They don't believe he called American troops suckers and losers. That he's quite trustworthy and so on...

And the opposition has certainly offered up solutions and policies. They can't debate Trump on them b/c he never offers up solutions of his own -- just a trust me, it's going to be great (see "concepts of a plan", solve Ukraine day 1), etc.

People who voted for Trump believe he's got some sort of magic fairy dust that will make it all better.

I have no do doubt that Trump has supporters who drank the koolaide. But I know lots of folks who voted for him eyes wide open. They choose him over Biden and they choose him over Harris. They didn’t trust Biden Harris anymore than you trust Trump. They didn’t like what they saw in the last 4 years and didn’t have any confidence that Harris was up to the job.

But the election is over. So somehow we have to figure out how to make things work. And it will take both parties to do it. There is only so much that can be done by EO. I wish Trump would shut up. I kinda enjoyed the weeks after the election where we didn’t hear from him everyday. But he is back and he is out front. Just being anti Trump won’t get you there. Somebody has to figure out how to work with him. That doesn’t mean surrender your principles. It just means looking for things he supports that you can support. So maybe you don’t support a US takeover of Gaza. Maybe suggesting an international solution would be better. It is a reasonable alternative.