Trump’s decision on Syria (1 Viewer)

[MT15]

I heard a lot of talk this morning on this seemingly abrupt decision. I heard worry that Turkey will roll into Syria and massacre the Kurds who have been one of our most loyal allies in the region. Lindsey Graham isn’t a big fan, and I think when Trump flirted with this decision before is when Jim Mattis resigned, but I may be misremembering that.

What I have not heard is why Trump is doing this now, when he was dissuaded before. What has changed to cause us to abandon the Kurds to an oppressive regime that is certainly capable of rolling in there to slaughter them? Graham seems more concerned that this gives ISIS a new boost.

Graham rips into Trump for removing troops from Syria

Sen. Lindsey Graham, one of President Donald Trump's strongest Republican defenders in Congress, blasted Trump Monday over his decision to remove US troops from northern Syria as Turkey plans a military offensive in the region, saying it was "shortsighted and irresponsible."

www.cnn.com

"This impulsive decision by the President has undone all the gains we've made, thrown the region into further chaos. Iran is licking their chops. And if I'm an ISIS fighter I've got a second lease on life. So to those who think ISIS has been defeated you will soon see," Graham said during an interview on Fox News' "Fox and Friends."

"I hope I'm making myself clear how shortsighted and irresponsible this decision is in my view," the South Carolina Republican added.

Graham, a supporter of the President who has at times previously split with him publicly, said, "I like President Trump. I've tried to help him. This to me is just unnerving to its core to say to the American people, 'ISIS has been destroyed in Syria' -- (that) is not true."

 

[Lazybones]

I’m not smart enough to understand that part of the country. As a young man, I want to say around 1986, the world news was on. They were showing people fighting in the Middle East. I asked my father why were they fighting.

He said, “lazybones those people have been fighting for as long as I remember I’m my lifetime. They will be fighting during your entire lifetime.”

Smart man

 

[MT15]

So, you think this is a good idea? Or not? Do you have faith that Trump is properly evaluating all the scenarios or is it more likely Erdogan just persuaded him to do something in a call?

I worry about this president making foreign policy decisions. He doesn’t think beyond the last person he spoke to. I would not be surprised to see the Rs yank a knot in his tail and he reverses this decision (again).

 

[Intensesaint]

I honestly think the United States needs to stop being the world's policeman.

Either side will always use this to either attack their opponent or defend their politician of choice. It's one of those political scenarios where 'It's ok when we do it"

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

Abandoning Kurds is what we do! We coerce them into fighting our wars and when we get tired or bored, we cut them loose. The real question is when will the Kurds turn their back on us?

 

[V Chip]

Footnotes
See also: https://madaboutpolitics.com/threads/how-many-future-terrorists-did-we-create-yesterday.20274/

 

[MT15]

I honestly think the United States needs to stop being the world's policeman.

Either side will always use this to either attack their opponent or defend their politician of choice. It's one of those political scenarios where 'It's ok when we do it"

Yeah, in a perfect world. But in the here and now what’s the correct decision?

 

[Lazybones]

Well in fairness, I trusted Bush, I didn’t trust Obama and I don’t trust trump. The problem for me is that it is such a quagmire, I don’t know what to think.

I am also sure that the info they see on the backside tells a much different picture. I wish we lived in a world where this wasn’t necessary.

But I don’t think trump is doing this to hurt our country.

 

[Intensesaint]

Yeah, in a perfect world. But in the here and now what’s the correct decision?

Like I said, I think we need to stop being the world's police. That is what NATO and the United Nations are for.

 

[MT15]

Well in fairness, I trusted Bush, I didn’t trust Obama and I don’t trust trump. The problem for me is that it is such a quagmire, I don’t know what to think.

I am also sure that the info they see on the backside tells a much different picture. I wish we lived in a world where this wasn’t necessary.

But I don’t think trump is doing this to hurt our country.

Why is he doing it then? I mean some really smart people from both sides of the aisle are fairly up in arms.

I don’t know either what’s correct, but when there’s a pretty broad consensus one way and just Trump on the other I’m wary.

 

[MT15]

Like I said, I think we need to stop being the world's police. That is what NATO and the United Nations are for.

What about promises made to the Kurds? Just break our word? Is it that simple or are we repeating the errors of previous administrations? I don’t know either.

 

[MT15]

Saw this:

“As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I’ve done before!). They must, with Europe and others, watch over...”

I have questions. First the funny - great and unmatched wisdom? That’s rich.

Second isn’t Turkey part of NATO? We are pledged to preserve their security. This seems really wrong.

 

[Intensesaint]

What about promises made to the Kurds? Just break our word? Is it that simple or are we repeating the errors of previous administrations? I don’t know either.

We have to stop this madness somewhere. If we don't with the Kurds now it will be a broken promise somewhere else later. I also think we need to stop with all the Israel aid as well.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

Much like reactionaries on either side when it comes to trade, the solution to less than ideal trade deals is not to abandon the leverage of trade deals and embrace mercantilism, it's to make better trade deals.

The solution to America's failings on the world stage is not to retreat into a cocoon and let China and Russia fill the void(which will happen, as foreign policy doesn't take place in a vacuum and there is no such thing as stasis), the solution is to use our hegemonic power in a more wise and humane way.

Handing the Kurds off to the slaughter, a people that laid down thousands of lives and in the process saved countless American ones is neither morally justifiable or, IMO, strategically wise. This honestly has a real likelihood of being Trump's Rwanda.

 

[Richard]

When I logged on here, I fully expected this thread to be the number one topic on this board. This decision by Trump, if he follows through and doesn't reverse course, has possible consequences for everyone in the region, if not far beyond. Should Turkey enact their plan to invade northern Syria, it is the Kurds that will be hurt, not the Syrian regime. On a much larger scale, this would be akin to removing our troops from South Korea after Kim has told the administration that he intends to invade. We are leaving an ally without the support they need.

Trump considers this to be the fulfillment of a campaign promise. The truth is that a person ill-equipped to handle foreign policy decisions has once again made the wrong call and has made the world less safe through his shoot-from-the-hip actions. Does Iraq feel safer today? Israel? Jordan? Saudi Arabia? If he had any diplomatic deftness, Trump could have applied pressure on Turkey to honor a demilitarized zone along the southern border of Turkey. Instead, he weakly chose to step aside, betray an ally and endanger the lives of friends and innocents. Inexcusable.

 

[SystemShock]

I’m not smart enough to understand that part of the country. As a young man, I want to say around 1986, the world news was on. They were showing people fighting in the Middle East. I asked my father why were they fighting.

He said, “lazybones those people have been fighting for as long as I remember I’m my lifetime. They will be fighting during your entire lifetime.”

Smart man

Do you remember who was fighting and why?

 

[Lazybones]

Do you remember who was fighting and why?

I remember Iran being involved and it was around the time that the Good Hope refinery exploded. I went back and looked and that was 1981. The Iran/Iraq war seems to have just started. But no I don’t remember the details as I was 8ish

 

[SystemShock]

I honestly think the United States needs to stop being the world's policeman.

Common sentiment. What is it you think they are policing, and why?

Either side will always use this to either attack their opponent or defend their politician of choice. It's one of those political scenarios where 'It's ok when we do it"

Not really, as long as a coherent plan is presented and carried out.