Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights per draft opinion (Update: Dobbs opinion official) (1 Viewer)

[LovesMusic7360]

Not long ago Kari Lake proclaimed Arizona's abortion law was a great law and wanted it the law of the state.

Now that she has gotten her way, she is lobbying for it to be repealed.

As I have been saying since 2022, the overwhelming vast majority of women aren't going to vote for the man who proudly boasts that he got rid of Roe V. Wade. Nor are those women going to vote for a forced birther politician.

Turns out, republican belief in "pro life" was all just lies to get votes. Who is surprised? I sure am not.

How many forced birthers will do the same about face?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/ka ... r-BB1ltx3I.

Arizona Republican Senate candidate Kari Lake is actively lobbying state lawmakers to overturn a 160-year-old law she once supported that bans abortion in almost all cases, a source with knowledge of her efforts told CNN.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

so, thinking there should be protests toward some specific people over a decision they made that takes away rights is somehow the same as saying that a class of people are satanic and demonic?

this should embarrass you. The professor made some tweets in the heat of the moment and then thought better of it. This account has maintained a months-long smear campaign toward a class of people filled with hateful tweets. And wouldn’t stop.

It's like comparing apples and hammers. Two completely different situations that are obviously different, yet disingenuously comparing the two is all he has.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Translation: I agree with most of what they post and I disagree with everything you post so that's why my crying about your posts are disingenuous.

I disagree with plenty of things that are posted. Sometimes it's minor and I keep on scrolling. Sometimes it's not and I comment. The difference is, though, I am commenting (or not commenting) based on their own thoughts, not this copy/paste drive-by crap.

I saw something made a post recently with alternating caps, but you didn't call them an ableist like you did when I made a similar post.

That's yet another example that you are a disingenuous hypocrite.

Now you assume I saw the post in question. I don't remember seeing a post like that, but I would be glad to message that person about it.

 

[SaintForLife]

so, thinking there should be protests toward some specific people over a decision they made that takes away rights is somehow the same as saying that a class of people are satanic and demonic?

this should embarrass you. The professor made some tweets in the heat of the moment and then thought better of it. This account has maintained a months-long smear campaign toward a class of people filled with hateful tweets. And wouldn’t stop.

This professor?





At the time of survey, the mean (SD) age of postsurgical participants was 19 (2.5) years (range, 14-25 years). The length of time between survey and chest surgery varied from less than 1 year to 5 years (Table 2). The mean (SD) age at chest surgery in this cohort was 17.5 (2.4) years (range, 13-24 years), with 33 (49%) being younger than 18 years. Of the 33 postsurgical participants younger than 18 years at surgery, 16 (48%) were 15 years or younger (Figure). At the time of survey, the mean (SD) age of participants without surgery was 17 (2.5) years (range, 13-23 years), with 39 (57%) being younger than 18 years.

Chest Reconstruction and Chest Dysphoria in Transmasculine Minors and Young Adults: Comparisons of Nonsurgical and Postsurgical Cohorts

Is chest dysphoria (distress about breasts) more common among transmasculine youth who have not had chest reconstruction compared with those who have undergone this surgery?In this cohort study, chest dysphoria was significantly higher in the nonsurgical ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[MT15]

What’s your point? She’s engaging in a discussion. And 11 is so small that it becomes statistically insignificant. You seem to think that being able to nitpick a statement from someone you disagree with invalidates everything they have ever said, which is so ironic since you never question the lies and horrible tactics used by the people you champion. Who are, BTW, some of the absolute worst people on social media.

Anyway, it’s just a huge distraction, isn’t it? It still doesn’t excuse your posting from a hateful account that demonizes LBGTQ individuals. You must still be okay with doing that, especially since you are now defending the Daily Caller, which sometimes does the same noxious thing.

 

[zztop]

so... too immature to decide on her own... but mature enough to have a child.. I guess?

Florida teen denied abortion for being too immature highlights hurdles to care, advocates say

A ruling blocking a parentless 16-year-old from obtaining an abortion highlights the hurdles to abortion access in Florida law, advocates say.

www.usatoday.com

according to the article, she would need her parent's permission, but her parents are not in her life. Her appointed guardian isn't enough, it seems

 

[SaintForLife]

What’s your point? She’s engaging in a discussion. And 11 is so small that it becomes statistically insignificant. You seem to think that being able to nitpick a statement from someone you disagree with invalidates everything they have ever said, which is so ironic since you never question the lies and horrible tactics used by the people you champion. Who are, BTW, some of the absolute worst people on social media.

Anyway, it’s just a huge distraction, isn’t it? It still doesn’t excuse your posting from a hateful account that demonizes LBGTQ individuals. You must still be okay with doing that, especially since you are now defending the Daily Caller, which sometimes does the same noxious thing.

My point is that the person you cited either doesn't know what she's talking about or she's lying. She said it doesn't happen and I showed that it does and she's supposed to be an expert about this subject.

12 different providers is statistically insignificant? How can you say that especially when we don't know how many procedures those providers have done? Sounds like an excuse to me.

You tried to use someone who has called for harassment of Supreme Court Justices to criticize someone who supposedly demonized LGTBQ individuals by posting their Tik Tok videos talking about themselves. Really?
I'm surprised you didn't bring up the narcissist Taylor Lorenz who doxxed the owner of the Libs of Tik Tok Twitter account.

 

[MT15]

My point is that the person you cited either doesn't know what she's talking about or she's lying. She said it doesn't happen and I showed that it does and she's supposed to be an expert about this subject.

12 different providers is statistically insignificant? How can you say that especially when we don't know how many procedures those providers have done? Sounds like an excuse to me.

You tried to use someone who has called for harassment of Supreme Court Justices to criticize someone who supposedly demonized LGTBQ individuals by posting their Tik Tok videos talking about themselves. Really?
I'm surprised you didn't bring up the narcissist Taylor Lorenz who doxxed the owner of the Libs of Tik Tok Twitter account.

I’m really way less invested than you are into these Twitter wars. Your sources spend all their time researching the dark corners of the internet and then they skew the stories they find. That’s really all I need to know about them.

For example, how do we know that the surgeries that were done on minors were done for the purposes of sex changes and weren’t done to correct congenital defects? We don’t. Your sources aren’t going to tell you that, for sure. They‘re in the business of riling you up.

In general, I trust that physicians and parents will do the right thing with their kids. I know there are some exceptions of abusive parents, but generally physicians won’t go along with them. It’s not the government‘s business to try to regulate healthcare in this way. I would think a “libertarian” such as yourself would not be in favor of this type of government overreach.

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

You nailed it. For the limited amount of free time that SFL tells us he has, he seems to squander an inordinate amount of it scouring social media for fringe far-left talking points to construct and confirm the narrative he chooses to live under. Not healthy in the slightest.

 

[MT15]

Back to the actual topic of this thread. I don’t have any proof this happened, just saw a random tweet about it. But this brings up another reason these abortion laws do not respect the lives of women. The tweet said a woman had died because she had been diagnosed with cancer early in her pregnancy and been denied the option of abortion in order to immediately start chemo. Instead she and her doctors were forced to delay treatment, which never happened because her cancer killed her and her unborn fetus.

This is a horrible choice that does present itself to some women every year. I have heard of it before - it’s not super rare. Pregnancy itself temporarily suppresses the woman’s immune system, making her especially vulnerable to cancer should it occur. Normally, a woman has a choice to make, continue the pregnancy and wait until birth for treatment to commence or abort and begin treatment immediately. Since death isn’t usually imminent she won’t qualify to have a choice under all of these laws. These exceptions to save the life of the woman are just an illusion, made to allow people to “feel better” about their stance but not actually helping women in life-threatening situations.

It’s just one more way that abortion is health care and it’s being denied to these women. A certain percentage of women will die every year because of these laws.

 

[MT15]

And these stats come from before we have started denying women in crisis pregnancies the health care they need to survive. By next year, these will look worse.

 

[Optimus Prime]

A door to door investigation? What exactly does that mean?
========================================

Anti-choice activists threatened to carry out a door-to-door investigation after a recount proved again that Kansas voters overwhelmingly backed an amendment to preserve abortion rights.

Nine of the state's 105 counties recounted their ballots and found 87 fewer votes in favor of preserving those rights and six more in favor of stripping those from women in the Aug. 2 election where 922,000 votes were cast on the issue, and the election denier and anti-abortion activist were ordered to pay nearly $120,000 for the hand recount they requested, reported The Kansas City Star.

“It looks insidious," said state Rep. Stephanie Clayton (D-Overland Park). "It’s a two-pronged attack. It’s attacking our election system and it’s attacking, specifically, the counties that didn’t vote the way that they wanted them to. They’re creating unnecessary work for our already overburdened election workers in what I see as an effort to put democracy itself at risk.”

The recount was requested by Melissa Leavitt, a Colby woman who has testified before the state Legislature about 2020 election conspiracy theories, and bankrolled by longtime anti-abortion activist Mark Gietzen, whose Kansas for Life group targeted George Tiller's late-term abortion clinic before he was murdered.............

MSN

www.msn.com

 

[MT15]

A door to door investigation? What exactly does that mean?
========================================

Anti-choice activists threatened to carry out a door-to-door investigation after a recount proved again that Kansas voters overwhelmingly backed an amendment to preserve abortion rights.

Nine of the state's 105 counties recounted their ballots and found 87 fewer votes in favor of preserving those rights and six more in favor of stripping those from women in the Aug. 2 election where 922,000 votes were cast on the issue, and the election denier and anti-abortion activist were ordered to pay nearly $120,000 for the hand recount they requested, reported The Kansas City Star.

“It looks insidious," said state Rep. Stephanie Clayton (D-Overland Park). "It’s a two-pronged attack. It’s attacking our election system and it’s attacking, specifically, the counties that didn’t vote the way that they wanted them to. They’re creating unnecessary work for our already overburdened election workers in what I see as an effort to put democracy itself at risk.”

The recount was requested by Melissa Leavitt, a Colby woman who has testified before the state Legislature about 2020 election conspiracy theories, and bankrolled by longtime anti-abortion activist Mark Gietzen, whose Kansas for Life group targeted George Tiller's late-term abortion clinic before he was murdered.............

MSN

www.msn.com

They will harass voters in precincts that didn’t vote the way they wanted. Hopefully everyone slams the door in their faces or just doesn’t answer the doorbell.

 

[Optimus Prime]

FRANKLIN, Tenn. — Sweating in the sun, two dozen teenagers spread themselves across picnic blankets in a grassy park and prepared to discuss the facts of life they never learned in school.


Behind them on a folding table, bouquets of pamphlets offered information teachers at school would never share — on the difference between medical and surgical abortions, and how to get them. Beside the pamphlets sat items adults at school would never give: pregnancy tests and six-packs of My Way Emergency Contraceptive.


Emma Rose Smith, 17, rose from the blankets, tucked her pale-blonde hair behind her ears and turned off the music on a small, black speaker.

She faced the assembled high-schoolers, all members of her newfound group, Teens for Reproductive Rights, and began talking about the nonprofit Abortion Care Tennessee.

Her words hitched at first, then tumbled in a rush.
“A little bit about them,” Emma Rose said, “is they’re an organization that funds people’s abortions if they can’t afford it. Also, by the way, there’s another organization that we can also talk about later, when we give you guys, like, resources, that actually does free mail-in abortion pills.”


Twelve days after the teens’ picnic, abortion would become illegal in Tennessee, a measure made possible by the Supreme Court’s June decision, in Dobbs v. Jackson Women’s Health Organization, overturning Roe v. Wade.

The students wouldn’t hear anything about it in school: State law does not require sex education, and it holds that schools in areas with high pregnancy rates must offer “family life education” focused on abstinence.

Post-Roe, the teens in the park had decided, this lack of education was no longer acceptable. They are part of a burgeoning movement of high-schoolers nationwide who, after Roe’s fall, are stepping up to demand more comprehensive lessons on reproduction, contraception and abortion — and who, if the adults refuse, are teaching each other instead……

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2022/08/23/teen-sex-education-roe/

 

[Optimus Prime]

WICHITA, Kan. (AP) — A Kansas anti-abortion activist is suing for a complete hand recount of an election in which voters soundly rejected a proposal to remove abortion rights from the state’s constitution.

Mark Gietzen is representing himself in a lawsuit filed Tuesday in Sedgwick County District Court after a nine-county hand recount that his supporters largely funded wrapped up over the weekend. Fewer than 100 votes changed out of more than 500,000 cast in those counties. The measure failed by about 165,000 votes statewide............

Kansas activist sues for a statewide abortion recount

 

[Optimus Prime]

 

[Optimus Prime]

Call it what you will, but there is no enduring benefit to having a media and political ecosystem that is primarily made of impenetrable “bubbles” of reality, distinct worlds in which “epistemic closure” means never having to encounter a single idea that challenges your preexisting beliefs. And yet, we are about to see it tested in an ominous natural experiment.

Abortion is a subject in which certain aspirations about what reality might be are pitted directly against what is actually happening on the ground. Forced-birth proponents—who won huge at the Supreme Court when Dobbs v. Jackson came down in June—are perennially being described in terms of the “dog who caught the car.” The November midterms will tell us whether their reality is ascendant in America, or just their judicial and state legislative power.

Call it what you will, but there is no enduring benefit to having a media and political ecosystem that is primarily made of impenetrable “bubbles” of reality, distinct worlds in which “epistemic closure” means never having to encounter a single idea that challenges your preexisting beliefs. And yet, we are about to see it tested in an ominous natural experiment.

Abortion is a subject in which certain aspirations about what reality might be are pitted directly against what is actually happening on the ground. Forced-birth proponents—who won huge at the Supreme Court when Dobbs v. Jackson came down in June—are perennially being described in terms of the “dog who caught the car.” The November midterms will tell us whether their reality is ascendant in America, or just their judicial and state legislative power.

It’s being called “Roevember,” a reckoning around women’s rights and fundamental liberties that hasn’t been witnessed since the shaggy-haired days of the ERA. As Jeremy Stahl noted just last week, recent polling seems to show that women are pretty affirmatively pissed off about Roe v. Wade being overturned, and it’s affecting a set of key Senate races, in addition to down-ballot contests around the country.

Mark Joseph Stern and I wrote recently that there is virtually no other way to assess the beatdown Kansas voters recently unleashed upon an amendment that would have removed abortion rights from their state constitution than as a repudiation of the Supreme Court’s recent Dobbs intervention, and a promise that even in ruby red states, and even among ruby red voters, only a tiny minority of female voters would endorse forcing teen girls to carry pregnancies to term.

After Dobbs came down at the end of June, Kansas reported a 1,038 percent increase in voter registrations that week alone, compared just with the week before.

Since the Dobbs leak and certainly since the final opinion came down, polling has strongly suggested that the position taken by Justice Samuel Alito and the other justices in the majority was not only broadly unpopular but also broadly unpopular among Republican voters.

In addition to the polling examined by Stahl, a Fox News poll last week had fathers moving from +20 support for the Republican Party in May to +8 support for the Democratic Party in August—a 28-point shift.

The same poll found an 8-point shift to support Democrats among white women; a +9 point shift among suburban women; and a +10 shift among women of color.

Oddly, the response to this polling on the part of anti-abortion groups has not been to reflect and moderate around the fact that voters don’t like Dobbs. With the exception of a handful of flabby rhetorical feints toward the GOP briskly reconstituting itself as a party dedicated to expanding the social safety net to protect and honor both fetal and maternal outcomes, most states have moved instead in the opposite direction, toward punishing women and their babies rather than protecting them.

That focus on criminalization rather than maternal support was long expected, according to Mary Ziegler, at Florida State University College of Law. Immediately after Dobbs came down, she told Elaine Godfrey at the Atlantic that in Republican-dominated states, “the focus has been and will continue to be penalizing the person supplying the abortion—not helping the person seeking the abortion.”............

The Reason Anti-Abortion Activists Just Won’t Stop

They keep pushing for fetal personhood, even as the unpopularity of their opinions become clearer and clearer.

slate.com

 

[MT15]

 

[MT15]

I agree with this. Women aren’t going to forget.