GOP chaos barrels toward federal shutdown (1 Viewer)

[superchuck500]

Yesterday Mike Johnson announced a CR for the House to pass - to continue funding through March (so the new Congress can take it up) and provide additional disaster relief. It also includes a raise for Congress.

Today Trump blasted the resolution and Elon threatened anyone who votes for it with being voted out of office. He also said the GOP shouldn’t vote on anything until Trump is in office - which means a shutdown of about a month.

Trump is already responsible for the longest shut down in history (35 days) - welcome back to Trump chaos.

Current funding expires at midnight on Friday (Saturday morning).

Mike Johnson Faces Growing GOP Backlash As Elon Musk Calls For Government Shutdown

Johnson's push for a short-term government funding bill met louder resistance than usual from Republicans in the House.

www.huffpost.com

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

That is correct. Maybe they need a Nancy Pelosi behind the scenes pressing and forcing folks to vote how she wishes.
Or maybe the Republican Party has more members willing to vote as they see fit, not how some old lady wants them to.


No, Democrats are always willing to spend more money and almost always fall in line with what the money folks want.

That is just clownish!

Perhaps she is just doing what she was elected to do and what she was elected to do is GOVRN!

The purpose of our elected government is to govern and in our representative democracy it take those elected officials to work together to serve we, the people. The US Government is not a corporation whose existence is reliant on profit!

The US Government was formed to make a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity.

Profit is not the goal of governments, service to the people is!

 

[Texan1211]

That is just clownish!

Perhaps she is just doing what she was elected to do and what she was elected to do is GOVRN!

I think I will file this away for when you start griping about anything Republicans do from now on.

The US Government is not a corporation whose existence is reliant on profit!

Duh.

Profit is not the goal of governments, service to the people is!

No, profit is not a goal for government, nor has anyone suggested it should be. But please recognize that insurmountable debt with its interest payments cut deeply into what government is able to provide for its citizens. If we continue on the path we are on, interest payments will be the single largest budget item in America. Interest payments already have surpassed what we spend on defense, Medicare, and Medicaid. And you advocate for more?

 

[Dragon]

I think I will file this away for when you start griping about anything Republicans do from now on.

Duh.

No, profit is not a goal for government, nor has anyone suggested it should be. But please recognize that insurmountable debt with its interest payments cut deeply into what government is able to provide for its citizens. If we continue on the path we are on, interest payments will be the single largest budget item in America. Interest payments already have surpassed what we send on defense. And you advocate for more?

And yet now the government will be shut down because Trump want to raise the debt ceiling to pay for more tax cuts. Tax cut for BORROWED money

 

[Texan1211]

And yet now the government will be shut down because Trump want to raise the debt ceiling to pay for more tax cuts. Tax cut for BORROWED money

yes, thus proving my point that there are no fiscal conservatives in DC with any power to change things. I don't think it will change until we pay more in interest and it hampers their ability to load bills with pork spending.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

I think I will file this away for when you start griping about anything Republicans do from now on.

Congressional Republicans haven't governed even when they held both houses! All they managed to do was cut taxes on the rich and blow up the deficit that you are so concerned about. Not once did they do anything during trump's 1st term to service We the People. Unless you call trump posing in a truck, for one of his many infrastructure weeks, service.

No, profit is not a goal for government, nor has anyone suggested it should be. But please recognize that insurmountable debt with its interest payments cut deeply into what government is able to provide for its citizens. If we continue on the path we are on, interest payments will be the single largest budget item in America. Interest payments already have surpassed what we send on defense. And you advocate for more?

...and yet, the US government plows on due to its word leading GDP! There is no insurmountable debt for government unless you believe that government should be pocketing some of that $30 Trillion in GDP.

 

[Texan1211]

Congressional Republicans haven't governed even when they held both houses! All they managed to do was cut taxes on the rich and blow up the deficit that you are so concerned about. Not once did they do anything during trump's 1st term to service We the People. Unless you call trump posing in a truck, for one of his many infrastructure weeks, service.

Uh, uh, You said Democrats were elected to govern, what do you think Republicans are elected for? The fact you don't like how they do it is immaterial.

..and yet, the US government plows on due to its word leading GDP!

Surely you are astute enough to recognize that the interest payments are taking a larger and larger share of our budget. Hopefully you can see where it may come to a point where interest is our single largest expense. Does that sound financially sound or wise to you?
GDP is different than debt and interest.
Economists often cite rates between 40-80% of GDP to debt ratios as acceptable, and we aren't even close to that

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

Uh, uh, You said Democrats were elected to govern, what do you think Republicans are elected for? The fact you don't like how they do it is immaterial.

Surely you are astute enough to recognize that the interest payments are taking a larger and larger share of our budget. Hopefully you can see where it may come to a point where interest is our single largest expense. Does that sound financially sound or wise to you?
GDP is different than debt and interest.
Economists often cite rates between 40-80% of GDP to debt ratios as acceptable, and we aren't even close to that

There are several ways to cut the deficit (and eventually debt) -- but it boils down to taking in more money than you spend. The Republicans have never really cared about the deficit.. it's just a talking point to them. It wasn't even much of a talking point for the Democrats, but the deficit has tended to be smaller when the Democrats have both chambers and the presidency than when the Republicans have the trifecta.

But I think one of the central problems is that in Congress you need to compromise to get things done. You don't get to rule, you have to govern. And that means no one gets everything they want.... so if you prioritize smaller debt, then maybe compromise by being willing to raise taxes on rich people in return for certain cuts in spending.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

Uh, uh, You said Democrats were elected to govern, what do you think Republicans are elected for?

I did not specify D or R! They all are elected to SERVE! You just resorted to your baseline partisanship.

The fact you don't like how they do it is immaterial.

Of course you chose to ignore the point that congressional R's are not interested in governing for the People.

Republicans had the Oval and both chambers of congress with the promise of tax cuts for the wealthy, build that wall, fix a crumbling infrastructure and affordable healthcare.

All he accomplished was the tax cuts for the rich and shutting down the Government while his party was in control of both chambers. Is that what Republican governance looks like? How did any of that serve the People?

 

[superchuck500]

No, profit is not a goal for government, nor has anyone suggested it should be. But please recognize that insurmountable debt with its interest payments cut deeply into what government is able to provide for its citizens. If we continue on the path we are on, interest payments will be the single largest budget item in America. Interest payments already have surpassed what we spend on defense, Medicare, and Medicaid. And you advocate for more?

Here's the problem with this - the continuing resolution to keep the government open until the new administration and new Congress can address it is not the place to dig in on changing "the path we're on". Federal shutdowns disrupt valuable services, drag the economy, and lower confidence . . . and to drop it on agencies a few days before Christmas is just so pointless. It actually creates quite a bit of work for agencies to go into their shutdown protocols - and the disruptions in certain areas are real. If we're going to shut it down for budget impasse, make it genuine - do it when the parties have had a chance to really develop the proposals, not this last minute crap.

Perhaps the Johnson bill wasn't the best option - perhaps a pure clean CR to keep the status quo, and perhaps add some needed disaster funds, is a better choice to tee up the issue for the new administration and Congress. But to just shut it down, and to shut it down until the inauguration is patently stupid - and the people advocating that are nothing more than professional trolls (in my opinion) who don't really understand the depth of what's going on.

I hope adults will prevail and a CR gets passed that allows the government to continue to function and they can address it the proper way. Maybe it will result in a shutdown at that time, but springing this on everyone now is juvenile.

 

[superchuck500]

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

Weird.

The major difference that I can see from this bill and the one they killed is the temporary suspension of the debt ceiling. Weird.

 

[superchuck500]

Weird.

The major difference that I can see from this bill and the one they killed is the temporary suspension of the debt ceiling. Weird.

Temporary through 2027.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

Temporary through 2027.

What peculiar timing, eh?

 

[superchuck500]

What peculiar timing, eh?

Yup

 

[fooferdoggie]

Weird.

The major difference that I can see from this bill and the one they killed is the temporary suspension of the debt ceiling. Weird.

except from what I heard that was not even on the table yet its the wrong time for it.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2024/12/19/congress/house-democrats-government-funding-deal-00195436

This is not how democracy works...

“This was done on short notice,” said Rep. Richard Neal (D-Mass.), the top Democrat on the Ways and Means Committee, who said he was opposed. “We reached an agreement on a bipartisan basis between the respective leadership and the membership of both parties, only to have an interruption take place and then a veto occurs after the agreement has been rendered and reached.”

President-elect Donald Trump and Elon Musk worked to spike the original deal on Wednesday, sending the House careening down an alternate path with a deadline looming.

“Elon Musk is not my constituent. My constituents are hard-working people who work very hard every day for every dime they have, and I'm sure as hell not bailing out on them in the final week,” said Rep. Ann McLane Kuster (D-N.H.), chair of the centrist New Democrat Coalition.

Top Democrats weren’t involved in the drafting of the legislation, and the unveiling caught senior lawmakers by surprise.

Republicans argue the burden is now on Democrats to justify any opposition to a continuing resolution — “CR” for short — that averts a government shutdown and also prevents the U.S. from defaulting on its more than $36 trillion in debt next year.

“Fundamentally, Democrats are going to have to explain why a clean CR with disaster relief, keeping the government functioning and open — and doing, by the way, exactly what they argued a year ago — why they wouldn’t support that,” Rep. Marc Molinaro (R-N.Y.) said as he left Johnson’s office Thursday afternoon.

Those policies are typically something Democrats would support, GOP lawmakers note, without acknowledging that backing the plan threatens Democrats’ negotiating power going forward.

 

[Dragon]

Trumps tax cuts for the 1% is about to expire. Guess why he want the debt ceiling suspended

 

[Texan1211]

There are several ways to cut the deficit (and eventually debt) -- but it boils down to taking in more money than you spend. The Republicans have never really cared about the deficit.. it's just a talking point to them. It wasn't even much of a talking point for the Democrats, but the deficit has tended to be smaller when the Democrats have both chambers and the presidency than when the Republicans have the trifecta.

But I think one of the central problems is that in Congress you need to compromise to get things done. You don't get to rule, you have to govern. And that means no one gets everything they want.... so if you prioritize smaller debt, then maybe compromise by being willing to raise taxes on rich people in return for certain cuts in spending.

I agree. there is no political will to really do anything about our staggering debt. The evidence is clear on that as evidenced by how much and how fast it grew.