General Election 2024 Harris vs Trump (5 Viewers)

[SamAndreas]

Today it begins, Kamala has reached the point that she's the Democratic Party nominee:

There's video from today. this link has video from her first public appearance since Biden endorsed her:

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/07/22/live-updates-harris-democrats-biden-drops-out-trump-campaign.html

She spent yesterday on the telephone for most of the day. I read that yesterday that she called the party leaders in all 50 states. That would take me three days.

She's renamed her YouTube channel, that's the where to go for video: https://www.youtube.com/@kamalaharris

This is her video on her channel from two hours ago:



To play it, start it, and then move it up to 5:47. This was one of those live videos which don't start at zero.

I've named this thread General Election 2024 Harris vs Trump

Trump needs an introduction post as well, a MAGA suporter ought to write it: @Farb, @SaintForLife , @Others, calling for someone to please introduce your GOP candidate for this 2024 general election thread.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Is that the fault of the electorate? Think you are going to get anywhere with those folks blaming them?

I don’t think so. It’s easy to blame other people for a loss. Blame the refs. Blame the other team. Whatever.

Part of politics is also motivating people to get out and vote for a particular candidate or party. In order to do that you need to listen first and then reach out and communicate with people where they are using means of communication they use.

That’s just my opinion. And I’m no expert. To me the dialogue is good. We should be talking about the issues and the policy. It should not be a war but a conversation. We can’t keep demonizing the other party simply because they have a different point of view. It’s not sustainable.

Yet the guy who won did so by running a campaign built on demonization, violent rhetoric, and a distinct lack of dialogue, especially when it came to issues and policies.

 

[Sharon]

Is the the fault of the electorate? Think you are going to get anywhere with those folks blaming them?

I don’t think so. It’s easy to blame other people for a loss. Blame the refs. Blame the other team. Whatever.

Part of politics is also motivating people to get out and vote for a particular candidate or party. In order to do that you need to listen first and then reach out and communicate with people where they are using means of communication they use.

That’s just my opinion. And I’m no expert. To me the dialogue is good. We should be talking about the issues and the policy. It should be a war but a conversation. We can’t keep demonizing the other party simply because they have a different point of view. It’s not sustainable.

Again, I disagree. You do seem to be an expert, or at least well-versed, on the concept of using words to manipulate and influence others.

For some reason the new "in" thing is this whole "blame" thing. Who does that? What mature person goes around blaming others when they don't get their way? I don't get it. More twisting of words.

Good government that functions should not be part of a "game" where winners and losers are determined by fear tactics and other such nonsense. That is what is not sustainable. So, who benefits from watching our government institutions implode? What did you expect?

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Blame the electorate for what? Not agreeing? Forgive me but I don’t see this as a good strategy.

Politics is about marketing ideas. It’s about the candidate and the party and messaging and policy. Obviously that didn’t work for the Democrats this last cycle. I don’t know that is the fault of the electorate.

Better candidates, better policy, better messaging. Actually listening to the electorate and addressing their concerns instead of insulting their intelligence and telling them what THEY think.

We need better candidates from BOTH parties. Better choices. That has not happened in a while. Maybe, Hopefully next time it will. It would be nice to be able to vote FOR something instead of AGAINST the other candidate.

More both sides bullshirt. One campaign ran on fear, hate, and lies. One campaign ran on policies and empathy.

 

[TampaJoe]

Yet the guy who won did so by running a campaign built on demonization, violent rhetoric, and a distinct lack of dialogue, especially when it came to issues and policies.

I don’t know that he insulted the electorate. Thats the point. He demonized the candidates no doubt. But he obviously appealed to the voter. You don’t do that by insulting the voter.

my point is that public servants work for the public. I don’t think it’s smart to insult the folks you work for. It is smart to listen to them even though you may not agree with what they have to say. And make no mistake, the GOP think they have a mandate and don’t care what Dems think. IMO, they are making the same mistake. Now is exactly the time to listen to them. IMO, the electorate is tired of partisan bickering and wants government to work.

 

[TampaJoe]

Again, I disagree. You do seem to be an expert, or at least well-versed, on the concept of using words to manipulate and influence others.

For some reason the new "in" thing is this whole "blame" thing. Who does that? What mature person goes around blaming others when they don't get their way? I don't get it. More twisting of words.

Good government that functions should not be part of a "game" where winners and losers are determined by fear tactics and other such nonsense. That is what is not sustainable. So, who benefits from watching our government institutions implode? What did you expect?

I’m no more an expert than anyone else. I’m just a single voter with an opinion and I’m not attempting to manipulate anyone. Since when is looking for compromise and agreement considered manipulation. There is much blaming these days. Maybe it’s time to end that and move towards actually solving problems.

 

[TampaJoe]

More both sides bullshirt. One campaign ran on fear, hate, and lies. One campaign ran on policies and empathy.

Yeah yeah yeah. Lather rinse repeat. Heard all that before. How did all that work out for you?

The whole politics of fear thing depends on whose side you are on. The other side always runs on the politics of fear. Unless you think accusing an entire party of supporting Nazis, Facists, and predicting the end of Democracy is a hopeful positive message. The GOP is no better as you point out.

Whatever. It didn’t work. It failed miserably. So continue that strategy if you choose. Or you can recognize it failed miserably.

 

[Sharon]

my point is that public servants work for the public. I don’t think it’s smart to insult the folks you work for.

Is this a threat?

 

[faceman]

Is this a threat?

no, he is saying freedom of speech comes with repercussions.

 

[fooferdoggie]

no, he is saying freedom of speech comes with repercussions.

not when its trump.

 

[faceman]

not when its trump.

cult of personality. learn and live. we have to defeat it

 

[bird]

Blame the electorate for what? Not agreeing? Forgive me but I don’t see this as a good strategy.

Politics is about marketing ideas. It’s about the candidate and the party and messaging and policy. Obviously that didn’t work for the Democrats this last cycle. I don’t know that is the fault of the electorate.

Better candidates, better policy, better messaging. Actually listening to the electorate and addressing their concerns instead of insulting their intelligence and telling them what THEY think.

We need better candidates from BOTH parties. Better choices. That has not happened in a while. Maybe, Hopefully next time it will. It would be nice to be able to vote FOR something instead of AGAINST the other candidate.

Don’t care. I will blame the electorate for voting for a convicted felon, a failure as president the first time around, for simply believing racist bullschlitz etc ad nauseum ad infinitum.

Addressing their concerns is an interesting comment. So, exactly, what should be done about the price of groceries beyond using it as a rhetorical prop?

The next candidate for your party will be the hack known as J.D.Vance, who was not a hillbilly by any stretch of the imagination.

Political economy is not about the marketing of ideas. The electorate is uninterested in ideas which we have seen for more than 50 years. They are only interested in whining. Am I talking down to the electorate? You bet. They deserve it. They don’t demand better. Beyond that political economy is about who gets what, where, when, how and why. They system we have has devolved to one dollar, one vote which results in an onslaught of nonsense form hundreds of sources in the extremely fractured media/social media.

The electorate does not have to agree with me. They most certainly don’t get to evade criticism and contempt.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

When a government for the people by the people fails the fault is the people.

We are absolutely 100% the problem. The candidates are just a reflection of us.

 

[TampaJoe]

Is this a threat?

No. I don’t make threats.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Yeah yeah yeah. Lather rinse repeat. Heard all that before. How did all that work out for you?

The whole politics of fear thing depends on whose side you are on. The other side always runs on the politics of fear. Unless you think accusing an entire party of supporting Nazis, Facists, and predicting the end of Democracy is a hopeful positive message. The GOP is no better as you point out.

Whatever. It didn’t work. It failed miserably. So continue that strategy if you choose. Or you can recognize it failed miserably.

I'm not saying it works. I am saying that your argument is crap. This is what you said:

"Better candidates, better policy, better messaging. Actually listening to the electorate and addressing their concerns instead of insulting their intelligence and telling them what THEY think.

We need better candidates from BOTH parties. Better choices. That has not happened in a while. Maybe, Hopefully next time it will. It would be nice to be able to vote FOR something instead of AGAINST the other candidate."

Not only are you both sidsing the whole thing, you are ignoring the fact that Kamala Harris was a very good candidate that ran a good campaign and proposed policies that addressed people's concerns and energized a lot of people. Tell me how she wasn't good enough and was on the same level as Trump.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

I don’t know that he insulted the electorate. Thats the point. He demonized the candidates no doubt. But he obviously appealed to the voter. You don’t do that by insulting the voter.

my point is that public servants work for the public. I don’t think it’s smart to insult the folks you work for. It is smart to listen to them even though you may not agree with what they have to say. And make no mistake, the GOP think they have a mandate and don’t care what Dems think. IMO, they are making the same mistake. Now is exactly the time to listen to them. IMO, the electorate is tired of partisan bickering and wants government to work.

Again, you keep saying the exact things Kamala was doing, yet you insist on this both sides bullshirt. I never said Trump insulted the electorate, but now that you mention it, he did. It wasn't even subtle.

 

[J-DONK]

o

I don’t know that he insulted the electorate. Thats the point. He demonized the candidates no doubt. But he obviously appealed to the voter. You don’t do that by insulting the voter.

my point is that public servants work for the public. I don’t think it’s smart to insult the folks you work for. It is smart to listen to them even though you may not agree with what they have to say. And make no mistake, the GOP think they have a mandate and don’t care what Dems think. IMO, they are making the same mistake. Now is exactly the time to listen to them. IMO, the electorate is tired of partisan bickering and wants government to work.

This is not how conserativism works.

The public just wants someone to blame, and punish. Trump gave them that.

I guess Republicans listened to voters in the sense they knew what the major issues were from polling.

Trump has ran the same playbook 3 times. You create an outgroup(illegal immigrants). These are the people to blame for all your woes. They are taking your (black) jobs. They are the reason eggs cost more, etc. Democrats are to blame(open border). I'm going to stop this.

The reason why people say this is close to Nazi, and compare Trump to Hilter.. If you swap out illegal immigrants for jews, voila. Hilter was making the exact same pitch.

FYI: They do the same thing with trans stuff, but there just aren't enough trans people for it to matter. Democrats are for "them" I am for "you".

It's the same play over, and over.

Obviously if Hitler was doing this same strategy. It's been around a long, long time.

 

[Sharon]

No. I don’t make threats.

Do you at least acknowledge that at times people hear what they want to hear, and then respond emotionally (sometimes irrationally) without having all the facts? Perhaps they read their own meaning into someone else's message?

In other words, when emotions run high, it's not that difficult to convince yourself you're right, when you are very, very wrong.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

The both sides arguments are just yet another lazy way of saying “I’m better than you”. It’s like spouting conspiracy theories, you can feel smarter than others without putting in the work to actually be smarter than others.

Trying to talk someone out of it is a waste of time because to accept that would absolutely crush their egos and belief they are better than all the ignorant manipulated masses. Their psyche can’t handle that fact and their emotional defense mechanisms block all information that contradicts what they have convinced themselves of.