Does Trump ever do any jail time? (2 Viewers)

[Optimus Prime]

Everything I've seen and heard says that the split second Donald Trump is no longer president there will be flood of charges waiting for him

And if he resigns and Pence pardons him there are a ton of state charges as an understudy waiting in the wings if the fed charges can't perform

What do you think the likelihood of there being a jail sentence?

In every movie and TV show I've ever seen, in every political thriller I've ever read about a criminal and corrupt president there is ALWAYS some version of;

"We can't do that to the country",

"A trial would tear the country apart",

"For the nation to heal we need to move on" etc.

Would life imitate art?

Even with the charges, even with the proof the charges are true will the powers that be decide, "we can't do that to the country"?

 

[brandon]

I think they will be more thoughtful than that.

I just have to have faith that Trumpism hasn't so infected the courts that such a ruling would be allowed to stand.

I think this just may be where your faith in the system is finally broken.

 

[MT15]

 

[Optimus Prime]

..........Judge Cannon is worried about a hypothetical threat to Trump’s reputation posed by the leak of materials seized from his hall closet and desk drawers, and because of that, she has prohibited the FBI from investigating Trump for willingly, knowingly, obstinately leaving stuff about Human Source Operations lying around a hotel targeted by foreign intelligence services.

For a year, Donald Trump left 325 files lying around his club, unsecured. After he gave 184 of them back in January 2022, he went to great efforts to prevent the FBI from reviewing what kind of damage he had done, delaying their access by a month. All the while, he secretly kept at least 141 more of those files in his desk drawer and hall storage room, even after it was public that he had been storing sensitive records in his poorly secured resort. The government subpoenaed him. He stalled again. He gave back 38 of those documents, while still hiding another 103, still lying around his poorly protected club. He bought a padlock, his lawyers have claimed in leaks to the press. Finally, on August 8, the FBI came and seized another 103 documents, still including documents protected as part of highly sensitive compartments that, if disclosed, could get people killed.

Judge Aileen Cannon has ruled that it is more important that Donald Trump’s reputation be protected from hypothetical leaks than that FBI be able to remedy the possibility that leaks facilitated by Donald Trump’s obstinance and neglect could get people killed............

Aileen Cannon Prioritized Donald Trump's Reputation over CIA Assets' Lives - emptywheel

Donald Trump has already been given 18 months during which his failure to prevent leaks of highly classified documents could get people killed. Yesterday, Judge Aileen Cannon ruled that -- to protect him from merely hypothetical leaks -- he must be given more time to get people killed.

www.emptywheel.net

 

[superchuck500]

 

[MT15]

Of course he doesn’t say he declassified them because he made it up after the fact. Similarly to the way his Kracken lawyers never actually alleged election fraud in their many lawsuits.

Ty Cobb has some thoughts:

“Regarding the former president’s legal prospects, Mr Cobb said: “I think the president is in serious legal water, not so much because of the search, but because of the obstructive activity he took in connection with the January 6 proceeding.”

“I think that and the attempts to interfere in the election count in Georgia, Arizona, Pennsylvania, and perhaps Michigan. That was the first time in American history that a president unconstitutionally attempted to remain in power illegally,” he added.

Mr Cobb believes the possibility of an indictment against Mr Trump is “very high”.

Regarding the motives of the former president for denying the outcome of the 2020 election and attempting to overturn the results, Mr Cobb said: “I believe former President Trump to be a deeply wounded narcissist, and he is often incapable of acting other than in his perceived self-interest or for revenge.””

Former Trump lawyer Ty Cobb warns ex-president ‘in serious legal water’

Ty Cobb represented Trump during Russia collusion investigation

www.independent.co.uk

 

[FullMonte]

This shows how careless Trump is with classified material (as if we didn't already know). No, the DOJ does not assume that materials that are marked classified remain classified in perpetuity. The DOJ is well aware (as should at least 1 person in Trump's orbit be) that a document that is marked classified must be treated as if it is classified until it is properly marked as declassified.

I also enjoy the part that says " Third, the Government continues to ignore the significance of the Presidential Records Act (“PRA”). If any seized document is a Presidential record, Plaintiff has an absolute right of access to it while access by others, including those in the executive branch, has specified limitations."

So, I started browsing through the president records act. The very first section after the "definitions" is titled "Ownership of Presidential Records," which says "The United States shall reserve and retain complete ownership, possession, and control of Presidential records; and such records shall be administered in accordance with the provisions of this chapter." So, I'm not sure how he can make the claim that somehow the PRA gives him more control over those records than the government has.

Section 2204 is titled "Restrictions n access to Presidential records." This section starts off by saying that the President (prior to the conclusion of his term) shall specify a duration, not to exceed 12 years, "for which access shall be restricted with respect to information, in a Presidential record, within one or more of the following categories." I can't be the only one who suspects that Trump made no such order to restrict information. I don't see anything in the act that specifically restricts the current president's access to any records, as Trump's team claims.

 

[FullMonte]

Regarding the motives of the former president for denying the outcome of the 2020 election and attempting to overturn the results, Mr Cobb said: “I believe former President Trump to be a deeply wounded narcissist, and he is often incapable of acting other than in his perceived self-interest or for revenge.””

really? Does he also "believe" that water is wet? that it is dark at night? etc...etc...

 

[MT15]

really? Does he also "believe" that water is wet? that it is dark at night? etc...etc...

Well, when it is a former Trump lawyer who defended him during his first impeachment, I thought it was newsworthy. There have been precious few Rs willing to tell the truth about Trump.

 

[superchuck500]

Trump in DC this evening. Unannounced, nobody sure why. His schedule is usually publicized.

 

[MT15]

Twitter is having a heyday with this - the golf attire, including golf shoes, the jacket strategically draped over his shoulders to obscure his hands….. lol.

You can just imagine where this is going.

 

[Lapaz]

Trump in DC this evening. Unannounced, nobody sure why. His schedule is usually publicized.

Why is it news?

 

[MT15]

I think it’s because he has always previously announced his comings and goings as if he were still the president (kinda in a sad, deluded way). He arrived in golf clothes, including golf cleats, which is also unusual. And it’s just kinda weird. People have assumed he wouldn’t want to voluntarily visit DC.

 

[UriUT]

I think it’s because he has always previously announced his comings and goings as if he were still the president (kinda in a sad, deluded way). He arrived in golf clothes, including golf cleats, which is also unusual. And it’s just kinda weird. People have assumed he wouldn’t want to voluntarily visit DC.

He's obviously there to be back in the White House, duh! Qanons have predicted this date a thousand times now. This thousandth one is actually coming true!!!!!

 

[FullMonte]

Trump has filed to ask the judge to deny the DOJs request.

I like the part where they say that the DOJ wants to do a risk analysis, but there is no indication that any documents were compromised, and Mae-A-Lago is a “secure, controlled access compound.”

DocumentCloud

www.documentcloud.org

 

[Optimus Prime]

Yes, because people use folders marked Top Secret just for fun all the time
=================================================
Lawyers for former president Donald Trump filed court papers Monday arguing against any pause in a judge’s order for a special master to review documents seized at Mar-a-Lago last month, suggesting that some of the documents marked classified may not be, and that Trump may have the right to keep the materials in his possession.....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/09/12/trump-classified-special-master/

 

[UriUT]

So is this a reason??

Wow.



Edit: **wild speculation**

 

[GrandAdmiral]

I would have loved to have seen him dragged from the White House screaming and crying...

Exclusive: 'I'm just not going to leave': New book reveals Trump vowed to stay in White House

Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.

www.cnn.com

 

[bdb13]

I would have loved to have seen him dragged from the White House screaming and crying...

Exclusive: 'I'm just not going to leave': New book reveals Trump vowed to stay in White House

Former President Donald Trump repeatedly told aides in the days following his 2020 election loss that he would remain in the White House rather than let incoming President Joe Biden take over, according to reporting provided to CNN from a forthcoming book by New York Times reporter Maggie Haberman.

www.cnn.com

He is truly an out and out authoritarian/autocrat and was only constrained at all because he had to work within our democratic system. But because he is truly those things he was willing to basically go all in on breaking the system itself.

It hadn't taken root enough yet in positions that mattered for him and his allies to successfully pull off the overthrowing the government last time.. but we can all recognize it's all worse off now because - on the other side of everything that's happened - most Republicans have decided that they're with him.