Barr attempts to fire US Attorney for SDNY, who refuses to step down (1 Viewer)

[GrandAdmiral]

Well it will be interesting what develops from this over the next few weeks...

Powerful US attorney who investigated Trump associates refuses to step down after Barr tries to push him out | CNN Politics

In a fast-escalating crisis Friday night, Attorney General William Barr tried to oust Geoffrey Berman, the powerful US attorney for the Southern District of New York who has investigated a number of associates of President Donald Trump, but Berman defied him by refusing to step down.

www.cnn.com

Moral of the story: don't piss off the fair leader.

 

[MT15]

Trump lies reflexively and without thinking.

Barr lies as well, hard to say which one is lying now.

Oh, and Mueller didn’t look at anything financial about Trump, did he? I seem to remember that he was told that finances were off limits. What we found out after the fact was that Mueller was fairly restricted in what he could look at.

It‘s pretty fair to say there were / are a bunch of financial irregularities involving the 2016 campaign, the inaugural committee, and the entire Trump organization. We have sworn testimony that Trump committed bank and insurance fraud regularly. Propublica has done some in depth reporting as well. Tax evasion caused Trump’s sister to have to leave the bench, IIRC.

Trump is legally vulnerable in a financial sense. It’s only a matter of time before all the dirt comes to light.

 

[SaintForLife]

I disagree that it was unwarranted or premature.

When it happened, and the inability to be on the same page, and trying to get Clayton in there in such underhanded fashion are still disconcerting.

And I'm fine with Strauss taking over and Berman testifying. But Clayton is still out there. I don't feel this is over.

IMO it's a clear pattern of outrage and exaggeration by the Democrats and the media to try to discredit Barr before the Durham investigation is complete. I don't have a problem with what you are saying. I do notice the amplified outrage when a Republican fires or replaces US Attorneys compared to when a Democrat does the same.

Obama to replace U.S. Attorneys

<p><strong>Blog:</strong> President Barack Obama plans to replace a "batch" of U.S. Attorneys in the next few weeks and more prosecutors thereafter, according to At</p>

www.politico.com

 

[superchuck500]

 

[LA - L.A.]

Executive privilege.

(Not saying it applies - just that it is often in play when an exec official is called to testify).

Thanks for answering. I hadn't considered that executive privilege could come in to play. I personally hope he testifies before the Judiciary committee.

 

[superchuck500]

Thanks for answering. I hadn't considered that executive privilege could come in to play. I personally hope he testifies before the Judiciary committee.

Other issues for his testimony could be grand-jury information (e.g. if they want to know about active investigations) or deliberative-process privilege if they want to know about various input into prosecutorial decisions.

 

[LA - L.A.]

Other issues for his testimony could be grand-jury information (e.g. if they want to know about active investigations) or deliberative-process privilege if they want to know about various input into prosecutorial decisions.

Then to amend my position, I'd like him to testify while also respecting standing law and institutional procedures. I'd like him to disclose anything that established precedent says he's at liberty to disclose. I'd like him to disclose anything that on balance will preserve the integrity of our government and its institutions.

 

[Saintamaniac]

So Neal Katyal thinks that technically, Berman isn't fired because trump reflexively lied when asked about the situation and told reporters he had nothing to do with it and that it was between Barr and Berman. So Trump has made it seem like Barr lied on Trump in his letter firing Berman. So now, Trump will have to admit he lied about not being involved or Berman isn't fired.

'Berman is still the US Attorney for SDNY': Legal experts conclude Trump screwed up firing with statement to the press

The bizarre saga over who is in control of the DOJ's Southern District of New York continued on Saturday.On Friday evening, the Department of Justice put out a statement claiming that U.S. Attorney Geoffrey Berman would be stepping down from leading the SDNY.But the office put out a statement...

www.rawstory.com

 

[MT15]

Well, one of them is lying. That’s for sure.

 

[SaintForLife]

Well, one of them is lying. That’s for sure.

Trump contradicts his own message quite often right? Their messaging is a poop show, but it's the norm with Trump.

 

[wardorican]

I know I posted the article after your post, but it talks about Beerman agreeing to step down after getting an assurance that the investigations will continue unimpeded.

It seems like all the consternation was premature.

Actually, it sounds like it was 100% accurate, and he only stepped down when his concern was alleviated.

 

[Ayo]

Actually, it sounds like it was 100% accurate, and he only stepped down when his concern was alleviated.

I also wonder if there's a shrewdness behind it. By stepping down, it looks like Trump and Barr get what they wanted - he wasn't seen to be fit, so he's gone.

So how does or might that change firing up the next one in line? I think his stepping down - as he did - meant that he had some real leverage and would have been able to at least string out some litigation. So he steps down, hands the reins over to Strauss, and makes it harder for them to fire someone else.

No idea, of course. But it crossed my mind

 

[MT15]

Trump contradicts his own message quite often right? Their messaging is a poop show, but it's the norm with Trump.

He hung Barr out to dry then. He denied doing what Barr just put in writing that he did. So either the POTUS is so brain dead that he forgot firing someone that he just fired today, or he’s lying knowing full well it makes Barr look like an incompetent fool, or Barr is lying. This isn’t a messaging problem, this is an incompetence problem or a corruption problem.

Doing a screen shot to capture two short tweets:

 

[Maxp]

He hung Barr out to dry then. He denied doing what Barr just put in writing that he did. So either the POTUS is so brain dead that he forgot firing someone that he just fired today, or he’s lying knowing full well it makes Barr look like an incompetent fool, or Barr is lying. This isn’t a messaging problem, this is an incompetence problem or a corruption problem.

Doing a screen shot to capture two short tweets:

Sadly, neither man cares. There isn't an ounce of integrity between them. No one will hold either accountable and the credibility of our government will continue crumble.

 

[FullMonte]

IMO it's a clear pattern of outrage and exaggeration by the Democrats and the media to try to discredit Barr before the Durham investigation is complete. I don't have a problem with what you are saying. I do notice the amplified outrage when a Republican fires or replaces US Attorneys compared to when a Democrat does the same.

Obama to replace U.S. Attorneys

<p><strong>Blog:</strong> President Barack Obama plans to replace a "batch" of U.S. Attorneys in the next few weeks and more prosecutors thereafter, according to At</p>

www.politico.com

I have to ask....are you actually comparing a new president, 4 months into his first term replacing a bunch of US federal attorneys with the sitting president, less than 5 months before his term ends, firing one particular attorney who has been investigating the president's associates?

Do you honestly believe those are equivalent?

 

[JRad]

IMO it's a clear pattern of outrage and exaggeration by the Democrats and the media to try to discredit Barr before the Durham investigation is complete. I don't have a problem with what you are saying. I do notice the amplified outrage when a Republican fires or replaces US Attorneys compared to when a Democrat does the same.

Obama to replace U.S. Attorneys

<p><strong>Blog:</strong> President Barack Obama plans to replace a "batch" of U.S. Attorneys in the next few weeks and more prosecutors thereafter, according to At</p>

www.politico.com

I think you’re really overestimating how much anyone cares about the Durham investigation. Barr doesn’t have to be discredited by the media, he’s shown far too much willingness to act for, as opposed to independent of, Trump. That’s a problem.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

Won't those investigations continue no matter who is the US Attorney ? If the new US Attorney tries to stop any investigations into Trump won't we hear about it?

The SDNY has been investigating Trump for a while right? If Trump and Barr were trying to stop an investigation, why did they plan to leave Berman in place until July 3rd? Why did Berman act like he wasn't supposed to remain in place until July 3rd when he said he was still coming into work?

I assume Mueller looked at Trump's tax returns and accounting records. I'm curious what people think the SDNY will find that Mueller couldn't. I don't have a problem with the SDNY investigating Trump. Are people claiming something imminent was about to happen so that's why they removed Berman? Berman was only appointed as temporary until the judges appointed him to serve longer.

There is no evidence and no indication in the report that Mueller looked at Trump’s taxes or followed the money. In fact, that was one of the big surprises, seeing first hand how narrowly he interpreted his rather broad mandate.

 

[Ayo]

Bolton's book alleges assurances made to Erdogan by Trump that he would get Obama's people out of SDNY, in relation to investigations into Halkbank

Bolton suggests possible 'obstruction' by Trump in SDNY Turkey investigation

The Trump administration's ongoing efforts to oust the U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York Geoffrey Berman have set off a firestorm in Washington.

abcnews.go.com

In his exclusive interview during a one-hour special airing Sunday, 9 p.m. ET with ABC News Chief Global Affairs Correspondent Martha Raddatz prior to the stunning series of events Friday night, former national security adviser John Bolton discussed an episode from his forthcoming memoir, "The Room Where It Happened," in which he said President Trump previously floated the idea of intervening in the Southern District related to its investigation of a state-owned Turkish bank.

"What Erdogan wanted was basically a settlement that would take the pressure off Halkbank," Bolton said in his interview last week with Raddatz. "And the president said to Erdogan at one point, 'Look, those prosecutors in New York are Obama people. Wait till I get my people in and then we'll take care of this.'"

 

[SaintForLife]

Barr lies as well, hard to say which one is lying now.

Oh, and Mueller didn’t look at anything financial about Trump, did he? I seem to remember that he was told that finances were off limits. What we found out after the fact was that Mueller was fairly restricted in what he could look at.

It‘s pretty fair to say there were / are a bunch of financial irregularities involving the 2016 campaign, the inaugural committee, and the entire Trump organization. We have sworn testimony that Trump committed bank and insurance fraud regularly. Propublica has done some in depth reporting as well. Tax evasion caused Trump’s sister to have to leave the bench, IIRC.

Trump is legally vulnerable in a financial sense. It’s only a matter of time before all the dirt comes to light.

3:14 p.m. Mueller is asked about Trump's tax returns

"Your office did not obtain the president's tax returns which could otherwise show foreign financial services, correct?" Rep. Raja Krishnamoorthi, an Illinois Democrat, asked.

"I'm not going to speak to that," Mueller said.

"In July 2017, the president said his personal finances were off limits or outside the per view of your investigation. And he drew a red line around his personal finances.Were the president's personal finances outside the purview of your investigation?" Krishnamoorthi asked.

"I'm not going to get into that," Mueller responded.

"Were you instructed by anyone not to investigate the president's personal finances?" Krishnamoorthi said.

"No," Mueller answered.

Report doesn't exonerate Trump, Mueller testifies, and he could be charged after leaving office

Robert Mueller has testified that his report does not exonerate President Donald Trump as he has claimed and that he could be charged after leaving office.

abcnews-go-com.cdn.ampproject.org

We don't know for sure if Mueller got Trump's taxes, but based on his answers it sounds like he did to me. Since Mueller was looking for connections with Trump and Russia it seems like his tax returns would be the first place to start.

CNN legal analyst:

"I believe Mueller has already obtained tax returns in the Russia investigation," Renato Mariotti, a former federal prosecutor in the Securities and Commodities Fraud Section of the U.S. Attorney's Office in Chicago, said on Twitter on Aug. 10. He later wrote in The Hill he often used tax returns in his own federal investigations, and that it is almost a necessity in an investigation like Mueller's. It's also done without knowledge of the subjects of the investigation.

"A federal prosecutor obtains tax returns by seeking an ex parte order from a federal judge. That means that the person who is being investigated doesn't know that the tax returns are being sought or if the judge issues the order," he said. "Basically, it's done in secret."

Mariotti also said that "the July FBI raid at the home of former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort tells us a great deal about the status of … Mueller's investigation."

Before taking "an aggressive, public action" like having the FBI search a subject's home, Mariotti wrote, a "typical step" federal prosecutors take in white-collar investigations is obtaining tax returns.

"A prosecutor would first take steps that can be done covertly, without the subject knowing, to gather evidence that can serve as the basis for more aggressive actions like search warrants," he wrote. "I worked with federal prosecutors who obtained tax returns in every single white-collar investigation they worked on."

Mariotti also said it ordinarily would require a senior Justice Department official to sign off on a request to the IRS for tax returns in a non-tax federal investigation. But, in this case, Mueller already has that authority.

"Mueller has authority to do so because the statute permits 'United States attorneys' to obtain tax returns and he has the power of a 'United States attorney' pursuant to the special counsel regulations," he wrote, noting that "even the tax return of someone other than Manafort" could be helpful to Mueller, and that "he could have tax return information for many individuals."

Why Robert Mueller Probably Has Trump's Tax Returns

As the special counsel's probe continues, actions point to access to the president's closely held financial information.

www-usnews-com.cdn.ampproject.org