All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (3 Viewers)

[Maxp]

I fear we are really going to be in a bad place due to the obvious cuts to the federal agencies that deal with infectious disease, but also the negative effect the Affordable Care act has had on non urban hospitals. Our front line defenses are ineffectual and our ability to treat the populous is probably at an all time low. Factor in the cost of healthcare and I can see our system crashing. What do you think about the politics of this virus?

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

They kept the $2,000 intentionally vague, I will acknowledge that. But in the grand scheme of things it seems like a hilariously petty thing to harp upon when the GOP doesn't want to give out a plug nickel.

 

[DaveXA]

They kept the $2,000 intentionally vague, I will acknowledge that. But in the grand scheme of things it seems like a hilariously petty thing to harp upon when the GOP doesn't want to give out a plug nickel.

Yeah, it's like arguing where to put a desk in an office thats on fire.

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

Yep. And the GOP does have a fair point that you can't continue to spend recklessly. But if they hadn't doubled-down on the Moron-in-Chief who basically ignored the virus for months things would be different. Trump could have marketed mask-wearing as a patriotic duty thing a la World War II. Instead he spun it into another right-of-center victim complex issue and here we are a year later still living with this thing widespread. Had there been any modicum of common sense in the Oval Office last March the virus would have been relatively contained a few months ago and we wouldn't need to be cutting more checks.

 

[MT15]

And thousands and thousands of people wouldn’t have died. Maybe even 100,000 people died needlessly due to mishandling this pandemic.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

The reconciliation is out. $1400 payments per adult and dependent. Same income limits and they are counting adult dependents now too. A family of 4 with 150k in income will get $5,600 even if the kids are over 18.

https://waysandmeans.house.gov/sites/democrats.waysandmeans.house.gov/files/documents/7.%20Tax.pdf

 

[wardorican]

The reconciliation is out. $1400 payments per adult and dependent. Same income limits and they are counting adult dependents now too. A family of 4 with 150k in income will get $5,600 even if the kids are over 18.

https://waysandmeans.house.gov/sites/democrats.waysandmeans.house.gov/files/documents/7.%20Tax.pdf

That's the house though. I expect it to be paired down a bit by the senate, absent a major public backlash.

This will also be the first time dependents over 18 (actually over 17) are considered.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

That's the house though. I expect it to be paired down a bit by the senate, absent a major public backlash.

This will also be the first time dependents over 18 (actually over 17) are considered.

There have been a lot of negotiations going on. I don't think the House would present an approach not agreed upon by Senate Democrats. The only issue I could see is Manchin, but I'd imagine getting this far they have circled with him. They wouldn't put Senate Democrats in the political position of people hearing about getting all this money and it's Democrats who tell them no. You do that kind of stuff to the opposing party, not your own.

 

[SaintForLife]

That's what I thought as well. I'd also dismiss anything that comes out of the daily poster.

Why do you dismiss anything from The Daily Poster? Was there anything that wasn't accurate in the two articles I posted from them?

 

[SaintForLife]

Everything I saw before the the GA election was also to bring it to $2,000 total also. The only place I saw people complaining were the MAGA people on tigerdroppings making the same arguments SaintsForLife is making here. Pretty sure Biden has lost ZERO support over this. Just something for the MAGA people to complain about. I sure hope Biden stays away from an outrageous tan suit.

They are so MAGA:




Also:

 

[wardorican]

They are so MAGA:




Also:

I think we can all see the confusion, and it's easier marketing to say $2000 check (That Trump pushed for earlier, just before the $600 was finalized), and it sparked a debate in Washington with Republicans not wanting to give out more money. That context has to be there for those who pay attention. I get that not a lot of people pay attention to details, so some will be upset by this.

From that headline..
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackbr...-go-out-the-door-immediately/?sh=796e9b8d744d

KEY FACTS
Biden referenced $2000 stimulus checks three times during his short speech in Atlanta, Georgia on Monday, claiming the debate about direct payments isn’t some “abstract debate,” it’s about “real lives.”
If Georgians send Sens. David Perdue and Kelly Loeffler back to Washington, Biden said, “those checks will never get there.”
Perdue and Loeffler joined Democrats and President Donald Trump in backing $2,000 direct payments last month, but Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) blocked the effort, calling $2,000 payments “socialism for the rich.”
Warnock and Ossoff have also publicly backed $2,000 direct payments.
Congress passed $900 billion in stimulus aid last month that will send $600—not $2,000 or $1,200 provided by the CARES act—direct payments to Americans making $75,000 or less (payments phase out based on annual income, with a cutoff of $87,000.)

Here's the full speech transcripts.

Georgia Runoff Election Democrat Rally Transcript: Joe Biden, Raphael Warnock, Jon Ossoff | Rev

Joe Biden campaigned in Georgia on January 4 in support of Raphael Warnock and Jon Ossoff for the Senate runoff election. Read the transcript of speeches from Biden, Warnock, and Ossoff here.

www.rev.com

I'll just hit the part of what Biden said. Sure, you can spin it either way. But, I believe the part about "the debate about $2000" is short hand for $600 vs $2000, they pick $2000, but $600 went out, so make up the difference.

Joe Biden: (47:26)
[crosstalk 00:47:26] By electing Jon and the Reverend, you can make an immediate difference in your own lives, the lives of the people all across this country. Because their election will put an end to the block in Washington, that $2000 stimulus check, that money would go out the door immediately, to help people who are in real trouble. Think about what it will mean to your lives, putting food on the table, paying rent

Joe Biden: (48:07)
Lives, putting food on the table, paying rent, paying part of your mortgage, paying down the credit card, paying the phone bill, the gas bill, the electric bill. Just look around. Millions of people in this country out of work through no fault of their own. No fault of their own. They’re struggling. Many are fearful and many have given up hope. Look at the lines at food banks, hours and hours and hours. This is the United States of America, for God’s sake and there are food lines like we’ve not seen since the depression and they’re getting longer. Families, children, people who have worked their whole lives and never asked for a thing except a fighting chance, now, they’re lining up for food in America and the debate over $2,000 isn’t some abstract debate in Washington, it’s about real lives. Your lives, the lives of good, hardworking Americans and if you’re like millions of Americans all across this country, you need the money, you need the help and you need it now.

Joe Biden: (49:00)
Look, Georgia there’s no one in America with more power to make that happen than you, the citizens of Atlanta, the citizens of Georgia and that’s not an exaggeration. That’s literally true. If you send Jon and the reverend to Washington, those $2,000 checks will go out the door restoring hope and decency and honor for so many people who are struggling right now, and if you send Senators Perdue and Loeffler back to Washington, those checks will never get there. It’s just that simple. The power is literally in your hands by electing Jon and the reverend you can break the gridlock that has gripped Washington and this nation.

Joe Biden: (49:57)
With their votes in the senate, we’ll be able to make the progress we need to make on jobs, on healthcare, on justice, on the environment and so many important things. By electing Jon and the reverend, you’ll be voting to get the states the resources they need to get the vaccines distributed. It’s a shame what’s happening now. It’s a literal shame. I’ve said it before, getting America vaccinated will be one of the most difficult operational challenges this nation’s ever faced but we’ve known it for the last months.

So, since most of us who follow this know what he meant, even though what he said could be construed a few ways, can you give Biden the same benefit of the doubt you'd give Trump when he'd speak in very abstract ways that created lots of backlash due to how literal you took him?

 

[SaintForLife]

I think we can all see the confusion, and it's easier marketing to say $2000 check (That Trump pushed for earlier, just before the $600 was finalized), and it sparked a debate in Washington with Republicans not wanting to give out more money. That context has to be there for those who pay attention. I get that not a lot of people pay attention to details, so some will be upset by this.

From that headline..
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackbr...-go-out-the-door-immediately/?sh=796e9b8d744d



Here's the full speech transcripts.

Georgia Runoff Election Democrat Rally Transcript: Joe Biden, Raphael Warnock, Jon Ossoff | Rev

Joe Biden campaigned in Georgia on January 4 in support of Raphael Warnock and Jon Ossoff for the Senate runoff election. Read the transcript of speeches from Biden, Warnock, and Ossoff here.

www.rev.com

I'll just hit the part of what Biden said. Sure, you can spin it either way. But, I believe the part about "the debate about $2000" is short hand for $600 vs $2000, they pick $2000, but $600 went out, so make up the difference.



So, since most of us who follow this know what he meant, even though what he said could be construed a few ways, can you give Biden the same benefit of the doubt you'd give Trump when he'd speak in very abstract ways that created lots of backlash due to how literal you took him?

The $600 checks were already being sent out when Biden made the speech you highlighted above when he said the $2000 check would go out immediately. I see you made no reference to AOC and Omar saying it was supposed to be $2000 checks.

It's okay to admit that Biden and the Georgia Democrats purposely blurred the lines to make it seem like people would get $2000 checks if they voted for the Democrats in the Georgia Senate race.

Can anyone post any quotes or videos of Biden or the Georgia Democratic Senate candidate saying the checks would be $1400 before that runoff election?

 

[wardorican]

The $600 checks were already being sent out when Biden made the speech you highlighted above when he said the $2000 check would go out immediately. I see you made no reference to AOC and Omar saying it was supposed to be $2000 checks.

It's okay to admit that Biden and the Georgia Democrats purposely blurred the lines to make it seem like people would get $2000 checks if they voted for the Democrats in the Georgia Senate race.

Can anyone post any quotes or videos of Biden or the Georgia Democratic Senate candidate saying the checks would be $1400 before that runoff election?

If you're more upset about 'blurring the lines' of $2000 total vs $2000 more vs actually getting any additional money into the hands that need it, well, I think your priorities are out of whack. Republican victories would mean $0 new aid.

AOC and Omar would give out $10,000 checks if they could, so they're being opportunist to use the same phrase to better support their messaging. They all do this to each other to see what the public latches onto.

 

[SaintForLife]

If you're more upset about 'blurring the lines' of $2000 total vs $2000 more vs actually getting any additional money into the hands that need it, well, I think your priorities are out of whack. Republican victories would mean $0 new aid.

AOC and Omar would give out $10,000 checks if they could, so they're being opportunist to use the same phrase to better support their messaging. They all do this to each other to see what the public latches onto.

I'm not upset and I see your strawman. I didn't complain about how much stimulus was and I'm good with $2000 or $1400.

 

[DaveXA]

I'm not upset and I see your strawman. I didn't complain about how much stimulus was and I'm good with $2000 or $1400.

So you're just complaining about messaging then?

 

[SaintForLife]

So you're just complaining about messaging then?

I'm pointing out how Biden and the Democrats purposely blurred the lines to make people in Georgia think they were getting $2000 stimulus checks if they voted for the Democratic candidates.

I'm also still waiting for a quote or a video of Biden or the 2 Georgia Senate candidates saying anything about $1400 checks before the runoff election.

 

[DaveXA]

I'm pointing out how Biden and the Democrats purposely blurred the lines to make people in Georgia think they were getting $2000 stimulus checks if they voted for the Democratic candidates.

I'm also still waiting for a quote or a video of Biden or the 2 Georgia Senate candidates saying anything about $1400 checks before the runoff election.

So yeah, messaging. Thanks.

 

[wardorican]

What do you think the US response should be at this point?

Right now the Democrats have a 1.9 trillion dollar bill with a lot of provisions in it. They're goin to have to tweak and define them differently with budget reconciliation.

Instead of deciding if a 'blurred line' is bad or just imprecise, why not push the items you'd like to see happen?

 

[V Chip]

We should be overjoyed that Biden and the Georgia Senators lied to gain control of the Senate?

LOL

As opposed to the Republicans who lied about EVERYTHING to gain control of the Senate (and Presidency, and taking over the Capitol).

Your incredulity is misplaced.