All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (3 Viewers)

[Maxp]

I fear we are really going to be in a bad place due to the obvious cuts to the federal agencies that deal with infectious disease, but also the negative effect the Affordable Care act has had on non urban hospitals. Our front line defenses are ineffectual and our ability to treat the populous is probably at an all time low. Factor in the cost of healthcare and I can see our system crashing. What do you think about the politics of this virus?

 

[FullMonte]

Please help me understand how it’s now bad to say the Virus originated in China? Is it just because Trump said that?
And I’m asking an honest question, so maybe my post won’t be deleted. Just an honest Q.

Since UTJ answered that question, I'd like to flip it around and ask you a serious question.

With the official names being SARS-COV2 and COVID-19, is there any actual reason to call it a different name based on where it came from? How does that somehow make anything better?

 

[Humperdoo]

Since UTJ answered that question, I'd like to flip it around and ask you a serious question.

With the official names being SARS-COV2 and COVID-19, is there any actual reason to call it a different name based on where it came from? How does that somehow make anything better?

Oh I get that point fully, I just call it the virus. Easier.
I just don’t understand how it’s bad to state where something originated.

I do see both sides tho.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

Oh I get that point fully, I just call it the virus. Easier.
I just don’t understand how it’s bad to state where something originated.

I do see both sides tho.

Because it demonstrably raises harm to people completely unaffiliated with the virus simply because they are profiled based on the implied connection.

So either you are indifferent with that because you really want to make sure people associate the virus with a certain place/people, despite the cost, or you are openly okay and encouraging of it.

 

[Humperdoo]

Because it demonstrably raises harm to people completely unaffiliated with the virus simply because they are profiled based on the implied connection.

So either you are indifferent with that because you really want to make sure people associate the virus with a certain place/people, despite the cost, or you are openly okay and encouraging of it.

You are something else. Kudos.
I’m done trying to converse with you.
Stay well, you and yours.

 

[Lapaz]

That is literally the opposite of the facts. The vast majority of people can get this virus and be fine. With nothing but a few days of downtime and and maybe a week of recovery, at worst. Only a very small percentage of people should actually stay in their home, or remain out of crowded spaces, etc.

And can you actually prove that shutting down the country was effective? What data can you point to that actually proves the nation as a whole would have been worse off if we never shut down? You can't because there is none. Actually, the more data that comes in, the more it shows that it wasn't actually that effective and that far more people had it than initially beleived, they just didn't know what it was or were asymptomatic.

All the data indicates this virus has in excess of a 1% fatality rate. New York estimated based on its antibody tests that 10% of its population has gotten the virus. At the time they had lost over 20k people, and about 200k actively infected. If none of those active died, they still had a 1% fatality. Since then over 7k of those died, so approaching 2% with a large number still infected. The WHO still estimates the fatality rate will be over 3%. If we allow it to spread and let people do as they like, everyone in the country will be infected by the end of the year. What is 2%, which is close to the best case scenario, of 330M? The answer is 6.6M would die, and millions more hospitalized, since it is estimated that about 10% require hospitalization. It would actually be much worse, because 30M hospitalizations would devastate our health care industry, so many people would die due to unrelated health issues. I can imagine many other repercussions, such as food shortages, and shortages of all services. Other countries are dealing with it with a combination of quarantines or extensive tests. Other countries are getting it under control. We need to keep up the effort to get it under control, not do as you like, because the risk of doing as you like is potentially devastating.

 

[stevo3]

Because it demonstrably raises harm to people completely unaffiliated with the virus simply because they are profiled based on the implied connection.

So either you are indifferent with that because you really want to make sure people associate the virus with a certain place/people, despite the cost, or you are openly okay and encouraging of it.

No. Because it accurately describes where it was first discovered or something notable about it.

Like Ebola. First discovered near the Ebola River in the Congo.

MERS. Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome

Norovirus. Norwalk, Ohio.

Lou Gherig's Disease

Legionnaire's Disease

Sudan Virus. Etc.

It's not a new thing. Just a lot of people now want to oppose anything the bad orange man says so if he calls it the Wuhan Virus, then it absolutely cannot be called that.

And yes. I absolutely want it associated with China. Their deciet and dishonesty in the beginning of the outbreak is what allowed it to grow into a pandemic, kill hundreds of thousands of people both directly and indirectly, and absolutely devistate our economy and way of living.

 

[BobE]

No. Because it accurately describes where it was first discovered or something notable about it.

Like Ebola. First discovered near the Ebola River in the Congo.

MERS. Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome

Norovirus. Norwalk, Ohio.

Lou Gherig's Disease

Legionnaire's Disease

Sudan Virus. Etc.

It's not a new thing. Just a lot of people now want to oppose anything the bad orange man says so if he calls it the Wuhan Virus, then it absolutely cannot be called that.

And yes. I absolutely want it associated with China. Their deciet and dishonesty in the beginning of the outbreak is what allowed it to grow into a pandemic, kill hundreds of thousands of people both directly and indirectly, and absolutely devistate our economy and way of living.

What? China is the most honest government in the history of Governments. Everything else is just racist.

 

[not2rich]

And yes. I absolutely want it associated with China. Their deciet and dishonesty in the beginning of the outbreak is what allowed it to grow into a pandemic, kill hundreds of thousands of people both directly and indirectly, and absolutely devistate our economy and way of living.

Blame can absolutely be put on China.

Blame can also be put on our own Administration.

Don't let your anger at China blind you to our Federal Government's own incompetence in dealing with reality.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

No. Because it accurately describes where it was first discovered or something notable about it.

Like Ebola. First discovered near the Ebola River in the Congo.

MERS. Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome

Norovirus. Norwalk, Ohio.

Lou Gherig's Disease

Legionnaire's Disease

Sudan Virus. Etc.

It's not a new thing. Just a lot of people now want to oppose anything the bad orange man says so if he calls it the Wuhan Virus, then it absolutely cannot be called that.

And yes. I absolutely want it associated with China. Their deciet and dishonesty in the beginning of the outbreak is what allowed it to grow into a pandemic, kill hundreds of thousands of people both directly and indirectly, and absolutely devistate our economy and way of living.

Setting aside I am still waiting for you to provide me examples of classy imitations in blackface.....

So let me just clarify here, the main argument you are resting on is that because it was routinely done prior, that justifies it’s continual use today?

 

[stevo3]

Setting aside I am still waiting for you to provide me examples of classy imitations in blackface.....

So let me just clarify here, the main argument you are resting on is that because it was routinely done prior, that justifies it’s continual use today?

Robert Downey Jr's role in Tropic Thunder was absolute Gold. White Girls was hilarious.

Justin Trudeau, the governor of Virginia...... Oh, wait....

On to the actual topic of the thread, it has been commonplace to name viruses in this manner for as long as there have been scientists / physicians discovering them. Only this time, because China knew the scale at which it would be held culpable for the growing pandemic, it unleashed it's propoganda machine on the twitter verse and social media world and the lemming lackey "journalists" were all too eager to comply because it gave them yet another shot to attack the bad orange man who was still using the name of it's origin. Let's not forget that all of these very same "journalists" were routinely using it before the mandate came down from their chinese masters.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

Robert Downey Jr's role in Tropic Thunder was absolute Gold. White Girls was hilarious.

Justin Trudeau, the governor of Virginia...... Oh, wait....

On to the actual topic of the thread, it has been commonplace to name viruses in this manner for as long as there have been scientists / physicians discovering them. Only this time, because China knew the scale at which it would be held culpable for the growing pandemic, it unleashed it's propoganda machine on the twitter verse and social media world and the lemming lackey "journalists" were all too eager to comply because it gave them yet another shot to attack the bad orange man who was still using the name of it's origin. Let's not forget that all of these very same "journalists" were routinely using it before the mandate came down from their chinese masters.

What made RDJ’s portrayel gold exactly? A classy imitation?

And I guess Il’ll take your long-winded answer as a yes? It is ok because it was routinely done prior.

So would you say the same about using any variation of the N-word in casual conversation when referring to black people? After all, black people hated it because it naturally carried an antagonistic and inferior stigma, but white people were outraged that they were being asked to refrain from a common vernacular established for 100’s of years....or, perhaps, does the argument that something was done prior not actually automatically justify the continuation of something? Do we not in fact have plenty of examples of language and behavior that was done for generations that wasn’t then and is or should no longer be acceptable?

 

[Humperdoo]

Robert Downey Jr's role in Tropic Thunder was absolute Gold. White Girls was hilarious.

Justin Trudeau, the governor of Virginia...... Oh, wait....

On to the actual topic of the thread, it has been commonplace to name viruses in this manner for as long as there have been scientists / physicians discovering them. Only this time, because China knew the scale at which it would be held culpable for the growing pandemic, it unleashed it's propoganda machine on the twitter verse and social media world and the lemming lackey "journalists" were all too eager to comply because it gave them yet another shot to attack the bad orange man who was still using the name of it's origin. Let's not forget that all of these very same "journalists" were routinely using it before the mandate came down from their chinese masters.

I loved Tropic Thunder.
And it’s only ok to make fun of Trump as he’s a white male, I guess?

 

[not2rich]

Robert Downey Jr's role in Tropic Thunder was absolute Gold. White Girls was hilarious.

Justin Trudeau, the governor of Virginia...... Oh, wait....

On to the actual topic of the thread, it has been commonplace to name viruses in this manner for as long as there have been scientists / physicians discovering them. Only this time, because China knew the scale at which it would be held culpable for the growing pandemic, it unleashed it's propoganda machine on the twitter verse and social media world and the lemming lackey "journalists" were all too eager to comply because it gave them yet another shot to attack the bad orange man who was still using the name of it's origin. Let's not forget that all of these very same "journalists" were routinely using it before the mandate came down from their chinese masters.

The "orange man" says Wuhan or Chinese virus to start culture war arguments like the type happening on this thread. That way, people aren't discussing whether his response to the pandemic is actually competent or not. Sure, China has a propaganda machine, but let's not pretend we don't too. We just get to choose the propaganda we follow.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

The "orange man" says Wuhan or Chinese virus to start culture war arguments like the type happening on this thread. That way, people aren't discussing whether his response to the pandemic is actually competent or not. Sure, China has a propaganda machine, but let's not pretend we don't too. We just get to choose the propaganda we follow.

People talk of Orwell far too much, and Aldous Huxley far too little.

 

[not2rich]

I loved Tropic Thunder.
And it’s only ok to make fun of Trump as he’s a white male, I guess?

No. We make fun of him because he's not a serious person. He's about nothing but himself. He's a clown. That's why. If he weren't the most powerful person in the country, it would simply be amusing, but under the circumstances it's scary.

 

[Humperdoo]

No. We make fun of him because he's not a serious person. He's about nothing but himself. He's a clown. That's why. If he weren't the most powerful person in the country, it would simply be amusing, but under the circumstances it's scary.

Fair enough. Although...
Would it be allowed if Trump were a poc, a woman or a woc?
I’d bet not.

 

[J-DONK]

Blame can absolutely be put on China.

Blame can also be put on our own Administration.

Don't let your anger at China blind you to our Federal Government's own incompetence in dealing with reality.

Democrats messed up defending China at all. They truth is China has sucked through this whole process, and so has Trump. There is enough blame to go around. We will probably never know were this virus came from, but the official story out of China is that it originated in a wet market miles from the virus lab. That's one crazy coincidence. It would be like having a virus outbreak miles from the CDC.

Trump also has bungled this thing the whole way through. He didn't prepare at all. He hasn't shown any remorse for the dead. He still hasn't coordinated PPE supplies by making FEMA the single buyer. He is just confiscated supplies states buy, which is insane. He also hasn't pushed for people do simple things like mandatory basic ppe when in public, (ie wearing some kind of mask).

I'm not even opposed to reopening on some scale but it could be done in a much smarter way. Every single thing Trump does is in the dumbest way possible. I want to point out a huge irony here. Does everyone here remember Sarah Palin, and conservatives putting on a huge scare campaign to squash single payer health care with death panels? Where did all you people disappear too? I hope on the other end of this we take a long hard look at non-employer based healthcare, and "essential worker" minimum pay wages. If you are to important to the economy to stay home, you should be making a real wage.

 

[not2rich]

Fair enough. Although...
Would it be allowed if Trump were a poc, a woman or a woc?
I’d bet not.

Obama had 1000x more class and poise than Trump. Yet it didn't prevent the birtherism nonsense or the charge he was "the most divisive President EVER."

If Obama had said the "black" version of what Trump says routinely, y'all would be losing your minds about him being racist and soiling the dignity of the Oval Office.

But Trump says what he says, and y'all think it's funny or "telling it like it is," or putting the "elites" and "liberal media" in their place.

So, yeah, if Trump were a poc or woc saying his nonsense, people like you wouldn't be cheering him on and he wouldn't have been elected President in the first place.