All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (1 Viewer)

[Maxp]

I fear we are really going to be in a bad place due to the obvious cuts to the federal agencies that deal with infectious disease, but also the negative effect the Affordable Care act has had on non urban hospitals. Our front line defenses are ineffectual and our ability to treat the populous is probably at an all time low. Factor in the cost of healthcare and I can see our system crashing. What do you think about the politics of this virus?

 

[The moose]

This would be a fantastic help to most Americans, wouldn't it? Unfortunately Republicans would likely be fiercely against it:

Democratic senators propose $2,000 monthly payments to most Americans

Kamala Harris, Bernie Sanders and Ed Markey want to dramatically expand support during the coronavirus crisis.

www.politico.com

Definitely a fight.

The other side will want to prop up corporate entities rather than actually helping people.

 

[JimEverett]

This would be a fantastic help to most Americans, wouldn't it? Unfortunately Republicans would likely be fiercely against it:

Democratic senators propose $2,000 monthly payments to most Americans

Kamala Harris, Bernie Sanders and Ed Markey want to dramatically expand support during the coronavirus crisis.

www.politico.com

I think Hawley's plan is more on the right track. Subsidizing payrolls makes much more sense, imo.

 

[The moose]

This will be a used to force the Feds to 'bailout' the states. Cuomo said as much in his news conference.

Well considering only eleven states accually pay in more than they take out you could say that all the states that have been feeding off new York stop feeding off the tit and pay your own way!


I see you are from Alabama and your state is currently drinking the milk that New York provides you and they provide a bunch. Infact most the states that make our country go around are blue.

A good read for you.

Zirpoli: The states that are givers and takers of federal dollars may surprise

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky is concerned about “bailing out” states who are deeply in debt due to the costs associated with COVID-19. In particular, he stated tha…

www.baltimoresun.com

Yep high time for the thirty nine other states to figure out how to pay their own way! Could not agree more!

 

[efil4]

I think Hawley's plan is more on the right track. Subsidizing payrolls makes much more sense, imo.

yes because all business owners are morally and ethically sound people.

I know two businesses that applied for and received PPE and are not paying employees.

If the feds do not have "auditing" procedures in place in an attempt to discourage fraud, then we are doomed to see it repeated.

getting the money in the hands of the employee is what makes sense. Not the employer.

 

[JimEverett]

yes because all business owners are morally and ethically sound people.

I know two businesses that applied for and received PPE and are not paying employees.

If the feds do not have "auditing" procedures in place in an attempt to discourage fraud, then we are doomed to see it repeated.

getting the money in the hands of the employee is what makes sense. Not the employer.

Does the federal government not have auditing plans in place? Do you think there is massive payroll tax fraud in the country?

I am not opposed to delivering money directly to employees either - but we have seen the logistical nightmare of doing it that way with state unemployment offices swamped.

Which I guess partially explains the lure of just sending out checks to everyone. But I think making people whole or as whole as practically possible should take precedence over general stimulus.

 

[FullMonte]

So when a legislature passes legislation creating parks for the public and provides funding for them yearly how can a Governor unilaterally shut them down during a pandemic but is unable to bypass the legislature on taxes?

Well, closing a park during a pandemic doesn't stop the parks from being funded. I could be wrong, I"m just going by what I understand about how it works in the federal level. I'm fairly certain the president cannot override a law passed by congress by executive order. I'm assuming states work on a similar system.

 

[Heathen]

I think Hawley's plan is more on the right track. Subsidizing payrolls makes much more sense, imo.

How so?

I think the closer you can get to getting the money directly to the people you're intending on getting it to, the better. Unfortunately this is a time where there isn't a lot of trust in the companies people are working for (fraud, job cuts, working more hours for lower wages just to keep 'a' job, etc).

I'm not saying subsidizing payroll is a bad idea, but it's one or more steps out from doing it directly. I know people have had issues with receiving their stimulus payment and that needs to be addressed. I personally received mine pretty quickly but may have been an outlier.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Does the federal government not have auditing plans in place? Do you think there is massive payroll tax fraud in the country?

I am not opposed to delivering money directly to employees either - but we have seen the logistical nightmare of doing it that way with state unemployment offices swamped.

Which I guess partially explains the lure of just sending out checks to everyone. But I think making people whole or as whole as practically possible should take precedence over general stimulus.

What would be your preferred method of 'making people whole'?

 

[JimEverett]

How so?

I think the closer you can get to getting the money directly to the people you're intending on getting it to, the better. Unfortunately this is a time where there isn't a lot of trust in the companies people are working for (fraud, job cuts, working more hours for lower wages just to keep 'a' job, etc).

I'm not saying subsidizing payroll is a bad idea, but it's one or more steps out from doing it directly. I know people have had issues with receiving their stimulus payment and that needs to be addressed. I personally received mine pretty quickly but may have been an outlier.

It is the intended recipients that is at issue for me.

I understand the idea of a stimulus in the literal sense of the word. And all things being equal its a good thing. But I feel its more important to compensate people for their actual loss, or a close to it s is reasonably possible.

There are middle-class people who have lost their jobs that were making far more than $2,000 a month and probably a substantial number who have obligations that far exceed $2,000 a month. I think a better practical approach is to reach those people as opposed to a blanket $2,000 a month for everyone approach.

Perhaps you could do both. Although the costs I imagine would become unsustainable quickly. Perhaps a plan that merged the pandemic unemployment into a guaranteed payment while also trying to address the actual loss of income directly caused by the disease and the government's response.

 

[JimEverett]

Well, closing a park during a pandemic doesn't stop the parks from being funded. I could be wrong, I"m just going by what I understand about how it works in the federal level. I'm fairly certain the president cannot override a law passed by congress by executive order. I'm assuming states work on a similar system.

Looking up the question I found this: https://www.nga.org/wp-content/uplo...move-Legal-Barriers-to-Emergency-Response.pdf

So Cuomo does have the power to override statutes during a state of emergency. Although I did not read the paper so I have no idea of the limitations on that power.

 

[SaintForLife]

Bipartisan corruption. Disgusting

 

[SystemShock]

That is just plain silly talk.

Pay the tax.

Where ever you came from to help I am more than certain you were paid a higher wage than your home state to do the job.Exceptionally higher!

I don't think the people that went to fight the pandemic did it for any other reason except to fight the pandemic so hopefully that they would not have to fight it at home.

Hell they make so much more in New Orleans being a RN I personally know some that commute from north of Jackson Mississippi.

So yes they were paid and paid well.

Yep.
They should've stayed home and let NYC burn... or fester, for that matter.

 

[The moose]

Yep.
They should've stayed home and let NYC burn... or fester, for that matter.

What I am saying is starting pay for an RN in New York is the max pay for the like Oklahoma City. So yes they got paid well I am more than sure at least thirty to forty percent more. And yes I don't think even one of them went to get paid. It was about containing the virus and trying to save lives.

Realistically I would have no problem with them waiving all tax on people busting their arse during this from the grocery clerks to bus drivers and the like but they are not. I just left a packed grocery store a couple hours back full of people risking their lives so we can eat for pathetic money. They are in this fight just as much.

The meat processing industry's labor is paying a huge price for the pork chops I am gonna have tonight.

 

[wardorican]

I think Hawley's plan is more on the right track. Subsidizing payrolls makes much more sense, imo.

I think there is a fundamental problem with that. Many industries will not bounce back, and any federal support will be temporary (maybe a few months?). Those companies will still have to lay some people off, or a lot, depending on the industry.

Also, states, like Florida, have a "Short Term Compensation" program, that essentially covers around 40% of a companies payroll, to avoid layoffs. However, in Florida, it is basically handled through Unemployment. So, we all have to go through the same hoops to access it. It would be so much easier if when the Companies apply for STC (which they have to do now), they could just tell the State which employees qualify (if a monetary limit) and which ones don't, and the State pays the company, who then pays the employee. Heck, I've been twisting in the wind for 3 weeks, and I still don't know if I make too much to qualify for any funds. If I don't get at least $1 from the state, I don't get a penny from the Federal government. that will really suck. If I lived in another state, the rules would be very different.

I think it's better to just get money in the hands of America's. However, I'm not sure $2000/individual ($4k per married couple), from March, until a couple months after it's declared over is the way to go. That just sounds like a ton of debt, and not all of us need it.

I mean.. well, I do. Not as bad as many others, but still, I'm not going to be down $4000 a month.

 

[Savage]

Not sure if this is legit, but if so wow.. China is a problem that everyone has been willing to overlook because they like their cheap shirt.

 

[Surviving Saint]

What would be your preferred method of 'making people whole'?

Open everything back up. Put people back to work. It's simple and if you are scared of that then stay home.

 

[The moose]

Open everything back up. Put people back to work. It's simple and if you are scared of that then stay home.

Sure I get forced empathy is a hard thing to do.

I understand you only care about you and maybe yours.

You know what if you can't work because of your industry plenty are hiring go right on get you one big bad man!

Meat packing plants are hiring, FedEx, Walmart, bus drivers, go and quit your bitchin.

Now if you are better than them so you won't that is the problem.

Those are the people you look down on potentially paying the biggest price.

 

[The moose]

Not sure if this is legit, but if so wow.. China is a problem that everyone has been willing to overlook because they like their cheap shirt.

Well all I can say is consider the source Benny Johnson.

That is the dude that got fired from BuzzFeed for plagiarizing.

41 instances of plagiarism were found and corrected.

He is an absolute joke but a broke clock is telling the truth two minutes a day.