Euthanasia; Yeah or Nay? (2 Viewers)

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    Farb

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    This is becoming a talking point or will be soon. I personally have no issue with medical assisted suicide in a hospice care environment. There is a push, and this is in Canada, to include the mentally ill, disabled, and even the homeless. That I cannot get behind. What does everyone else think about it?

    https://www.thestar.com/opinion/con...-of-abuse-is-becoming-ever-more-apparent.html

    How does the unthinkable become not only thinkable, but seemingly inevitable? How do we normalize things we recently considered not just abnormal, but horrifying?

    The question arises because a major Canadian medical organization is pushing the idea of allowing doctors to do something that’s long been considered unthinkable and abnormal: killing infants who are born with conditions that make survival impossible.

    The Quebec College of Physicians made the case for this before a parliamentary committee studying changes to Canada’s law on medical assistance in dying (MAID), a.k.a. assisted suicide.

    To be clear, the college’s proposal involves only newborns with severe malformations whose chance for life is “basically nil.” It wouldn’t be a license to kill babies. But let’s also be clear about this: authorizing doctors to actively euthanize infants — rather than allowing nature to take its course — does cross a line once thought inviolable.


    The college suggests blurring things in other ways, too. It supports extending MAID to “mature minors,” i.e. teenagers aged 14 to 17, and wants us to think about allowing euthanasia for old people who are just “tired of living.”

    Now, Canada’s laws on MAID have long been stretched far beyond the original (and praiseworthy) concept of sparing terminally ill people from unnecessary agony at the end of their lives, allowing a so-called “death with dignity.” When the law was passed in 2016 it didn’t specify that a person must be terminally ill to qualify for a medically assisted death, and last year it was amended to remove the requirement that death be “reasonably foreseeable.”

    https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/famil...ssion-wasn-t-fit-for-assisted-death-1.4609016

    A British Columbia man who struggled with depression and showed no signs of facing an imminent demise was given a medically-assisted death despite desperate pleas from his loved ones, family members say.

    Alan Nichols was admitted to Chilliwack General Hospital in June, at age 61, after he was found dehydrated and malnourished. One month later, he died by injection.

    Days before his death, family members begged Nichols, a former school janitor who lived alone and struggled with depression, not to go through with the procedure. They still don’t know why doctors approved the life-ending procedure and insist that Nichols did not fit the government criteria of facing an “imminent death.”

    https://www.foxnews.com/media/canad...law-include-mentally-ill-enable-mature-minors
     
    Fascists don't like the idea of any form of suicide, because they want to be the only ones that get to decide who lives and dies, and when and how they die.

    A society of people who are willing to take their own lives than suffer a life they do not want is the fascists worst nightmare. It's hard to enslave and oppress a group of people with the threats of pain and death, if that group of people would respond by taking their own lives instead.

    For fascists, their disapproval of euthanasia does not come from a place of compassion, it comes from their obsessive compulsive need for control.
    LOL. Yes, everyone that is against state supported suicide is a fascist. Very wise take.
     
    I've always wondered the cognitive distance it takes to see this as evil. We consider euthanizing our pets that are in chronic pain as a mercy. I don't know if anti-depressants "cure" all these cases. You can look at famous examples like David Foster Wallace.

    I can't recall Farb's position from the abortion thread, does anyone remember if Farb is pro capital punishment?
    Farb is pro-capital punishment. Farb is also pro-life with little to no exceptions and Farb is also anti-state supported suicide.

    Do you consider dogs and people to be the same sentient creatures?
     
    Yes, it really is that simple.

    This klezmer song without words beautifies the general concept starting at the other end of life set on another primitive planet:


    What I find most troubling is that it was the medical community that told her "we can no longer help you, nothing will get better' or something along those lines. If those are the mental 'professionals' that are funneling people to state sponsored euthanasia, then we are all in trouble.
     
    No, suicide is never the only option, but people still choose it every day.
    according the mental health professional that was treating this person, that was the only option.
     
    according the mental health professional that was treating this person, that was the only option.
    This isn’t an honest framing. But you probably know that.
     
    Farb is pro-capital punishment. Farb is also pro-life with little to no exceptions and Farb is also anti-state supported suicide.

    Do you consider dogs and people to be the same sentient creatures?

    So a person doesn't have the agency to take their lives, but the state does?

    Farb, a lot of pet owners have something called empathy. Plenty of people consider their pets as genuine parts of their families.
     
    Fascists don't like the idea of any form of suicide, because they want to be the only ones that get to decide who lives and dies, and when and how they die.

    A society of people who are willing to take their own lives than suffer a life they do not want is the fascists worst nightmare. It's hard to enslave and oppress a group of people with the threats of pain and death, if that group of people would respond by taking their own lives instead.

    For fascists, their disapproval of euthanasia does not come from a place of compassion, it comes from their obsessive compulsive need for control.

    LOL. Yes, everyone that is against state supported suicide is a fascist.
    Please point me to where I said, "everyone that is against state supported suicide is a fascist." You want be able to, because my post doesn't say that. I quoted my post so that everyone can easily see that I never said that, @Farb . So that everyone can easily see how you constantly say people say things they didn't actually say, Farb .

    Now what's interesting, Farb, is that I wasn't responding to you or about you, Farb. I didn't say everyone opposed to euthanasia is a fascist and I wasn't responding to you or about you, Farb, yet you thought a post talking about fascists was talking about you, Farb. That's intersting, Farb. I don't know what it means, Farb, but it is an interesting reaction.
     
    Does the Netherlands have state sponsored healthcare?
    The United States has a significantly higher suicide rate than Netherlands, so the Netherlands is doing a better job of preventing suicides than the US is. Authoritarian countries with strict laws against attempting suicide have even higher suicide rates.

    So, if the goal is sincerely to save people from suicide, then we'd be better off doing what they are doing in Netherlands. If the goal is to control people and make them do the "right" thing, then we should do what they are doing in Russia and other fascist societies.
     
    Does the Netherlands have state sponsored healthcare? No idea, but I think it might.
    they have universal healthcare, but everyone has to purchase their own individual health care plan (or have it through an employer)
    so no, they do not have free healthcare paid for by the state.
    they just keep prices from being out of control unlike here where an ingrown toe nail can cost you $10k.
     
    I think it would be more humane than not for the option to be available to go the route of assisted suicide in situations like terminal late stage cancer.

    I had a family member who was dying of cancer and in the last day or two she was asking for the family to throw her off the balcony to end it. Just unnecessary suffering for all there.
     
    Does the Netherlands have state sponsored healthcare? No idea, but I think it might.
    Single payer is not “state sponsored”.

    The rest is none of your business.

    You cannot be pro-life if:

    You support capital punishment. To use your term that is state sponsored murder.

    You do not care what happens to a baby after it is born. You certainly can be anti-abortion but not caring what happens after a baby is born is not pro-life. Gain some intellectual honesty.
     
    So a person doesn't have the agency to take their lives, but the state does?

    Farb, a lot of pet owners have something called empathy. Plenty of people consider their pets as genuine parts of their families.

    Yes.

    Do you consider pets and humans the same?
     
    Please point me to where I said, "everyone that is against state supported suicide is a fascist." You want be able to, because my post doesn't say that. I quoted my post so that everyone can easily see that I never said that, @Farb . So that everyone can easily see how you constantly say people say things they didn't actually say, Farb .

    Now what's interesting, Farb, is that I wasn't responding to you or about you, Farb. I didn't say everyone opposed to euthanasia is a fascist and I wasn't responding to you or about you, Farb, yet you thought a post talking about fascists was talking about you, Farb. That's intersting, Farb. I don't know what it means, Farb, but it is an interesting reaction.
    You pointed it out just fine, no need to for me to help. But I will. You said Fascists don't like any form of suicide...blah blah. I don't like any forms of suicide. I think they are evil, inhumane and incredibly sad. That makes me a facist in your book, and that is fine. The alt-left uses all the 'ists' for name calling so people won't actually speak the reality and truth. I don't care what the mentally unstable call me as most normal people are starting to not care anymore either. I find that rather interesting as well, don't you?
     
    The United States has a significantly higher suicide rate than Netherlands, so the Netherlands is doing a better job of preventing suicides than the US is. Authoritarian countries with strict laws against attempting suicide have even higher suicide rates.

    So, if the goal is sincerely to save people from suicide, then we'd be better off doing what they are doing in Netherlands. If the goal is to control people and make them do the "right" thing, then we should do what they are doing in Russia and other fascist societies.
    I don't know off hand, but maybe you do, what demographic in the US is committing more suicide?
     
    they have universal healthcare, but everyone has to purchase their own individual health care plan (or have it through an employer)
    so no, they do not have free healthcare paid for by the state.
    they just keep prices from being out of control unlike here where an ingrown toe nail can cost you $10k.
    Do you think medically assisted suicide is out of pocket or do you think it is covered under their health plan?
     

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