Ruth Bader Ginsburg has passed (Replaced by Amy Coney Barrett)(Now Abortion Discussion) (1 Viewer)

[GrandAdmiral]

Ugh... breaking news I DID NOT want to see.

ETA: Reported on CNN.

 

[Farb]

So, Farb, you don’t want to be forced to take a vaccine, but you’re fine with forcing women to have children? It’s okay for the government to force a woman to go through a pregnancy, even if she has an abusive partner, or was raped repeatedly by her father, step-father, or uncle? But you don’t want anyone telling you that you have to take a vaccine that will do nothing to affect the rest of your life? Is that the situation?

If the only option I had was to take a vaccine or kill a life, I would take a vaccine. I am also willing to sacrifice and accept the consequences of my own actions.

And does anyone know how many rapes and incest lead to abortions? We talk like this is something that happens often and I bet it is rare, that is why those that like the option of destroying a life that might inconvenience then always bring it up.

 

[Farb]

You obviously haven't been paying attention to the voter suppression bills being passed by the Republican fascists in Texas and Georgia. Those aren't "a few tax bills".

Democrats aren't trying to take away people's right to vote. Only your party is doing that.

Oh, I have and we have very different opinions on what is 'voter suppression'.
We also have very different opinions on what fascist means and well as what my party is.
But hey man, good to see you on this board!

 

[Kerry Won Ohio]

Oh, I have and we have very different opinions on what is 'voter suppression'.
We also have very different opinions on what fascist means and well as what my party is.
But hey man, good to see you on this board!

147 Republicans voted on Jan 6 to overturn the election results in Pennsylvania, with zero evidence of voter fraud.

There is your definition of fascism, which is the definition of fascism for any reasonable, intelligent person.

 

[Farb]

147 Republicans voted on Jan 6 to overturn the election results in Pennsylvania, with zero evidence of voter fraud.

There is your definition of fascism, which is the definition of fascism for any reasonable, intelligent person.

by voting? Sure. That is fascism.

 

[Kerry Won Ohio]

by voting? Sure. That is fascism.

Missing the point. Why would they attempt to overturn the election results with no evidence of voter fraud?

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

Yeah, abortion issue aside, the private action enforcement and bounty are really problematic - especially when you consider why they drafted it that way.

But one thing I continue to be deeply confused about is why this fervent advocacy for the unborn, which I recognize has its logic and appeal, doesn’t translate into the same enthusiasm for child welfare after birth. Not all, I recognize, but many “conservatives” these days actively support agendas that pretty clearly do not benefit children. Examples include more hot-button recent issues like border separation and school Covid policies, or more general, long-term issues like enhanced supports for low-income/at-risk households, school meal programs, and making schools safer from gun violence.

I’m not suggesting that being pro-life must mean you support a “liberal” social agenda - that’s not my angle. I’m talking about some basic policy-level elements that would seem to go hand-in-hand with the same motivations to so aggressively protect the unborn.

Yet it’s pretty rare, it seems, that conservatives bring the same energy to child welfare after birth (excepting of course the conspiratorial, often delusional anti-pedo groups - that’s a rabbit hole and not what I’m referring to). Some even support policies that seem pretty patently harmful to children.

I know there’s more dynamics at play and some of it is purely tribal behavior. But that’s something that has confused me foe a long time and still does.

It's the irrationality of religious/political fanaticism.

 

[zztop]

A Texas state judge issued a temporary restraining order against an anti-abortion group Friday, preventing it from suing abortion providers employed by Planned Parenthood under a harsh new abortion law that went into effect earlier this week.

Travis County District Judge Maya Guerra Gamble ruled that under the Senate Bill 8 law, Planned Parenthood faced and its staff and patients faced "probable, irreparable, and imminent injury" if they were sued by the nonprofit group Texas Right to Life, its legislative director and 100 unidentified individuals.

However, her three-page order does not prevent others from using the new law against Planned Parenthood or other abortion providers in Texas.

A hearing on a preliminary injunction request was set for Sept. 13.

 

[MT15]

Pregnancies through incest are not “exceedingly rare”. Pregnancies through rape may be less common, but still happen regularly if the timing is wrong. The chromosome abnormality in the tweet thread I posted (just that one alone) happens in 1-3% of pregnancies. None of these are exceptions in the Texas law nor in many of the laws the radical evangelicals are trying to force through. It’s a true tyranny of the minority.

Abusive, controlling men use pregnancy and having a child to control the unlucky women who are involved with them. To bind these women to them forever, so to speak.

I am just saying this stuff because it needs to be said. Farb actually said “you do the crime, you do the time” about pregnancy. Farb, your whole deal is about punishing women. Your phrasing gives you away. You can say you care about the unborn, but your phrasing gives away the real reason.

 

[zztop]

And this from the comments on that thread speaks to the cruel things anti-abortionists have been allowed to be codified into law in some states:

That is some forked up shirt that women have to go through.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Stopping destroying a developing human life is not birth control. If you don't want to have a child then don't have sex. If you are coerist into having sex or unprotected sex at that, then that is really on you and no one else. That is called bad decisions and generally in life, those have consequences. If you do the crime, you do the time.



Yes. If I were King, the only possible exclusions would be rape and incest (so beyond rare they shouldn't even be listed) and medical. Anything other than that, and that is ANYTHING else is just convenience and that is a hard no.

And this is all based on your religious beliefs and nothing in the law, right?

 

[zztop]

I'm very anti-religion when it comes to meddling with laws and politics (separation of church and state etc)

But occasionally I'll have to throw this out because it is very succinct, and also happens to come from a nun:

"I do not believe that just because you're opposed to abortion that that makes you pro-life. In fact, I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. And why would I think that you don't? Because you don't want any tax money to go there. That's not pro-life. That's pro-birth. We need a much broader conversation on what the morality of pro-life is."

Sister Joan Chittister

 

[MT15]

I saw another quote on Twitter about how easy it is to virtue signal that you revere all life by choosing to champion the unborn. The unborn cannot make any demands of you, once they are born and actually need things, they are no longer the unborn and you can just look the other way.

The real agenda, of course, is letting women know that they do not control their own healthcare. Or rather only poor women, because the teenaged daughters or adult mistresses of these hypocritical people will still get abortions. It is only the poor women who are in desperate situations who will be denied.

 

[zztop]

Theres some NSFW language

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

George is an absolute legend and what real libertarians should be.

 

[Paul]

George is an absolute legend and what real libertarians should be.

I loved him. Chapelle is also pretty good. Not afraid of the PC police. I also like Bill Maher, he is quite the liberal but despises the cancel culture people.

 

[Paul]

I saw another quote on Twitter about how easy it is to virtue signal that you revere all life by choosing to champion the unborn. The unborn cannot make any demands of you, once they are born and actually need things, they are no longer the unborn and you can just look the other way.

The real agenda, of course, is letting women know that they do not control their own healthcare. Or rather only poor women, because the teenaged daughters or adult mistresses of these hypocritical people will still get abortions. It is only the poor women who are in desperate situations who will be denied.

I would not like a woman to abort my kid, but I would not do anything to stop it. I am pro-choice, but I think abortion is a very barbaric violent act. If I was a woman I would never abort my baby.

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

I loved him. Chapelle is also pretty good. Not afraid of the PC police. I also like Bill Maher, he is quite the liberal but despises the cancel culture people.

I was half-expecting Chapelle to run for the Senate in Ohio but I'm sure he has zero interest in that.

 

[Farb]

Pregnancies through incest are not “exceedingly rare”. Pregnancies through rape may be less common, but still happen regularly if the timing is wrong. The chromosome abnormality in the tweet thread I posted (just that one alone) happens in 1-3% of pregnancies. None of these are exceptions in the Texas law nor in many of the laws the radical evangelicals are trying to force through. It’s a true tyranny of the minority.

Abusive, controlling men use pregnancy and having a child to control the unlucky women who are involved with them. To bind these women to them forever, so to speak.

I am just saying this stuff because it needs to be said. Farb actually said “you do the crime, you do the time” about pregnancy. Farb, your whole deal is about punishing women. Your phrasing gives you away. You can say you care about the unborn, but your phrasing gives away the real reason.

Yep, I hate women. I want to punish women. The fact that you have to drill down to this idiotic response to a moral and legal debate is kind of gross, but not unexpected.

Do you think I want to punish women or do I want to protect an innocent's right to life? Your binary thought process is why the pro destroying of a human in the womb movement is losing and losing badly. (fingers crossed).

If you want to discuss how to get the men that got the girl pregnant, I am all for that. I think the guy should be forced, by law and policy to help provide for the woman and baby. 100% on board with that. If that is the case, there are going to be other fights about what if the female wants an abortion and and the male, who is now has legal skin in game, does not, who wins that one?

Edited to add: For the lame and lazy talking point about bad people who don't want babies skulls crushed in the womb so the parents can still afford to netflix and chill, just like to virtue signal and not actually do anything, what about those of us that actually do something? Believe it or not, there are more people that you think that actually financially, physically and spiritually help any and all mothers. I know for a fact of 2 mothers that recently made the decision to keep their babies with the help and service of a group I am very active in.