Voting Law Proposals and Voting Rights Efforts (2 Viewers)

[MT15]

This is, IMO, going to be a big topic in the coming year. Republicans have stated their aim to make voting more restrictive in just about every state where they have the means to do so. Democrats would like to pass the Voting Rights Bill named after John Lewis. I’m going to go look up the map of all the states which have pending legislation to restrict voting. Now that we have the election in the rear view, I thought we could try to make this a general discussion thread, where people who have concerns about voting abuses can post as well and we can discuss it from both sides. Please keep memes out of this thread and put them in the boards where we go to talk about the other side, lol.

 

[Peace]

You don't understand how mail-in ballots work, do you? What do you think is the process from when a voter receives their ballot until the point where it is counted?

You must think that every single person who has anything to do with collecting the ballots, delivering them and then receiving them is not only impervious to dishonesty, but is also rendered incapable of doing anything dishonest at any point in that process.

And we haven't even gotten to the voters themselves. You must believe that all voters everywhere are not only impervious to dishonesty, but are also rendered incapable of doing anything dishonest before they drop their ballots in the mail-in boxes.

Be honest. is that what you really believe?

 

[coldseat]

Sorry friend. Joe Biden is not the guy you want to put up for president unless you already KNOW he is going to win.

What does that even mean? Joe Biden ran for and won the Democratic primary. He was the candidate selected by Democratic voters to represent the party as the presidential candidate. Are you saying all Democratic voters where in on the cheat? Or are you saying that Biden's campaign cheated to win the Democratic primary and that other Democrats let him cheat, because it was already set up for him to win the presidency.

 

[Peace]

What does that even mean?

It means there's a possibility that democrats cheated to get Joe Biden into the White House, despite the lack of evidence at this time.

Now, I'm done with this subject. You've had your input and I've had mine. That's where this ends.

 

[coldseat]

It means there's a possibility that democrats cheated to get Joe Biden into the White House, despite the lack of evidence at this time.

Now, I'm done with this subject. You've had your input and I've had mine. That's where this ends.

Democrats didn't cheat. Biden is the legitimate president. That's all that needs to be said.

 

[Peace]

Democrats...

are capable of cheating just like Republicans are, and cheaters on both sides need to repent.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

You must think that every single person who has anything to do with collecting the ballots, delivering them and then receiving them is not only impervious to dishonesty, but is also rendered incapable of doing anything dishonest at any point in that process.

And we haven't even gotten to the voters themselves. You must believe that all voters everywhere are not only impervious to dishonesty, but are also rendered incapable of doing anything dishonest before they drop their ballots in the mail-in boxes.

Be honest. is that what you really believe?

You are not impervious to dishonesty, therefore it is reasonable to assume that you cheat on your taxes, your wife, and at golf. Is that fair? No, it's not. Now stop ducking the question. What do you think is the process from when a voter receives their ballot until the point where it is counted?

 

[cuddlemonkey]

It means there's a possibility that democrats cheated to get Joe Biden into the White House, despite the lack of evidence at this time.

Now, I'm done with this subject. You've had your input and I've had mine. That's where this ends.

There's a possibility that you cheat on your taxes, your spouse, and at golf, despite the lack of evidence at this time. Is that reason enough for the government to investigate you for tax fraud, your spouse to hire a private eye to trail you, and your golf buddies to shun you?

 

[zztop]

All This talk reminds me of

Thought Police - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Peace]

How would one witness first hand ever single election in the country?

You can't. You'd have to start with some kind of scrutinization in key areas of battleground states. That's where motivations would be highest anyways.

 

[CoolBrees]

So maybe I can clear up what happens with 100% mail in because for whatever reason this seems to be too difficult for some to grasp.

About two months before an election a post card is sent out to each address letting people know there is an election coming and how to register if you are not.

About a month before the election cycle (including city ones - we vote like every year it seems) a pamphlet shows up in the mail. One for each registered voter at that address. This is your first chance to know if there is a problem with your registration - you didn’t receive a pamphlet.

About two weeks before the voting day, you ballot shows up- with your name on the envelope and a big red OFFICIAL BALLOT on the front. Inside you find your ballot, instructions and return envelope. This is the second time you can find out there is a problem - you didn’t receive a ballot. (Incidentally, we have received all of the above for 11/8).

Now you vote - with a pen you fill in circles like in high school. Then you put it in the envelope and either put it in the mail box or if you want to be certain it isn’t tampered with, there are monitored vote boxes throughout municipal buildings (libraries etc). You can submit your vote any time after you have received it.

Once you have submitted your vote, you can check your ballot status by either calling the automated number or going online and entering your ssn. The message will simply let you know that your ballot was received and has been counted.

The whole process takes less than fifteen minutes and that is if it is a major election cycle.

In other words, there is no way to get a ballot, fill it out and resend without the real person not knowing and you can’t make up people, vote twice or for dead people.

 

[Optimus Prime]

I didn’t even think about people with disabilities
=====================================


In late January, a judge in Wisconsin ruled that there were just two ways someone in the state could return a mail-in ballot: they could either place it in the mail or return it to their local clerk in person.

That was a big problem for Martha Chambers. For the last 27 years, Chambers, who is 59 and lives in Milwaukee , has been paralyzed from the neck down after a horse-riding accident.

She can write and paint using a stick she holds in her mouth.

But when it comes to voting, she needs help with her ballot. “I can fill out my ballot. I can sign it. I can fill in the little dots,” she said. “But I can’t hand it, I can’t fold it, I can’t put it in the envelope,” she said. “ I could not put it in the mailbox. I can’t get out my door to put it in the mailbox.”

When Wisconsin’s spring primary came around, she didn’t want to go vote in person because of health concerns, so she voted absentee. She took a risk and decided to have someone else return her ballot for her, despite court rulings saying that was illegal. “Like a rebel,” she said. “We should be able to vote without any concern, just like anybody else.”

This year, Chambers was one of millions of Americans trying to figure out a dizzying array of new restrictions and seemingly constant changes that threaten their ability to vote.

Since the 2020 election, Republicans and GOP-aligned groups have focused on tightening laws that deal with transporting mail-in ballots and assisting voters, saying they are ripe for fraud. For the millions of US voters with disabilities, those restrictions are significant.

“Any of the restrictions that have been proposed, if they have an impact on access for voters as a whole, then they tend to impact access voters with disabilities exponentially,” said Michelle Bishop, voter access and engagement manager with the National Disability Rights Network.

Nearly 18 million Americans with disabilities voted in the 2020 election, an increase of six points from 2016, according to a recent study from Rutgers University. Voters with disabilities were nearly twice as likely to report some difficultycasting a ballot as voters without a disability in 2020.

A provision of the Voting Rights Act says “any voter who requires assistance to vote by reason of blindness, disability, or inability to read or write may be given assistance by a person of the voter’s choice, other than the voter’s employer or agent of that employer or officer or agent of the voter’s union.”………

US voters with disabilities face maze of new restrictions

Nearly 18 million Americans with disabilities voted in the 2020 election, but new laws this year may change turnout

www.theguardian.com

 

[MT15]

It means there's a possibility that democrats cheated to get Joe Biden into the White House, despite the lack of evidence at this time.

Now, I'm done with this subject. You've had your input and I've had mine. That's where this ends.

You know, I spent some time and Monte helped with a few things I forgot, about how it would be impossible to do enough fraud with mail in ballots to sway the election. You have never acknowledged any of it. So here are some easy to read bullet points:

1. Mail in ballots are matched to registered voters. If a mail-in ballot comes in that doesn’t correspond to a registered voter it won’t be counted. These ballots are often bar-coded, so that if the bar code doesn’t match the one mailed out - it won’t be counted.

2. In our state - and lots of other states - mail in ballots must be signed by the registered voter and the signature will be checked. If it doesn’t match - it will be put aside. In some states the voter will be informed and will have a chance to come in and sign an attestation with proper ID. They do this because as people age sometimes their signatures change.

3. Ballots are checked against a list of deaths since the last election. If a person has sent in a mail-in ballot and then shows up at the polls to vote, that is also flagged for investigation.

There are actually more checks and balances than this. But could you kindly answer how you think hundred of thousands of rogue, fake ballots were introduced into this system? Across five states?

 

[CoolBrees]

It’s just easier to believe in widespread voter fraud than you have been lied to. Admitting to getting duped is hard.

People still give Jim Bakker money for god sakes.

 

[Andrus]

To the new members, as well as reminding the old crowd.

Unlike other political communities, attempts to belittle, or crawl under the skin of either individuals or the collective holding opposing views is not tolerated here. So keep that in mind moving forward.

I don't have much time to monitor this board at this time as I have been working on a large project for a new client, and it doesn't appear that there is anyone else actively moderating right now. So, I will simply ban those that continue to break the rules for a period of time so that the message gets through. Read the board rules. Abiding by the rules saves us all time and headache.

Those of you accusing others of being simple minded, having reading comprehension issues, or being mentally challenged, put a lid on it! Most of the regulars here are intelligent and both highly educated and informed. They know the rules and will ignore such nonsense. Note that I said "Most", so this message cuts both ways.

 

[Optimus Prime]

A federal judge has rejected a lawsuit against a far-right activist group accused of intimidating Arizona voters with the “express purpose” of blocking them from casting their ballots in drop boxes in the state.

US District Judge Michail T Liburdi, who was appointed by Donald Trump, declined a request for a restraining order against Clean Elections USA and its founder Melody Jennings, who encouraged volunteers to stake out ballot boxes and photograph voters in an effort fuelled by baseless allegations that the 2020 presidential election was marred by fraud……

Judge refuses to shut down ‘voter intimidation’ at ballot drop boxes in Arizona

Federal lawsuit targets ‘organised vigilante groups’ fuelled by conspiracy theories

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Optimus Prime]

RACINE, Wis. — The Republican National Committee and its allies say they have staged thousands of training sessions around the country on how to monitor voting and lodge complaints about next month’s midterm elections.

In Pennsylvania, party officials have boasted about swelling the ranks of poll watchers to six times the total from 2020.

In Michigan, a right-wing group announced it had launched “Operation Overwatch” to hunt down election-related malfeasance, issuing a press release that repeated the warning “We are watching” 10 times.


Supporters of former president Donald Trump who falsely claim the 2020 election was stolen have summoned a swarm of poll watchers and workers in battleground states to spot potential fraud this year.

It is a call to action that could subject voting results around the country to an unprecedented level of suspicion and unfounded doubt.

“We’re going to be there and enforce those rules, and we’ll challenge any vote, any ballot, and you’re going to have to live with it, OK?” one-time Trump adviser Stephen K. Bannon said on a recent episode of his podcast.

“We don’t care if you don’t like it. We don’t care if you’re going to run around and light your hair on fire. That’s the way this is going to roll.”

Whether the flood-the-zone approach will materialize remains to be seen. Election officials will not know until Election Day how many poll watchers will turn up, making it impossible to be sure whether there will be a surge in volunteers.

In battleground states like Arizona and Wisconsin, many Republicans who have said they would serve as poll workers have not taken any shifts.

But the appeal from GOP figures who deny the results of the last presidential vote has created a dilemma for election officials, who rely on ordinary citizens to do the grunt work of democracy — checking in voters, for instance, or opening absentee ballots — but now fear some of those who show up could become agents of disruption…….

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/10/25/pro-trump-republicans-court-election-volunteers-challenge-any-vote/

 

[Peace]

You know, I spent some time and Monte helped with a few things I forgot, about how it would be impossible to do enough fraud with mail in ballots to sway the election. You have never acknowledged any of it. So here are some easy to read bullet points:

1. Mail in ballots are matched to registered voters. If a mail-in ballot comes in that doesn’t correspond to a registered voter it won’t be counted. These ballots are often bar-coded, so that if the bar code doesn’t match the one mailed out - it won’t be counted.

2. In our state - and lots of other states - mail in ballots must be signed by the registered voter and the signature will be checked. If it doesn’t match - it will be put aside. In some states the voter will be informed and will have a chance to come in and sign an attestation with proper ID. They do this because as people age sometimes their signatures change.

3. Ballots are checked against a list of deaths since the last election. If a person has sent in a mail-in ballot and then shows up at the polls to vote, that is also flagged for investigation.

There are actually more checks and balances than this. But could you kindly answer how you think hundred of thousands of rogue, fake ballots were introduced into this system? Across five states?

You know, I haven't spent any time looking into ways people can and have pulled off fake balloting, but I will do that going forward, as it's really foolish to talk about an election that was stolen when evidence hasn't been produced. On the other hand, it's equally foolish to think that it's impossible for fake balloting to occur.

My point in all this is that it was possible for cheating to take place in this last election, but I won't go into depth on it until I have more information.

 

[MT15]

You know, I haven't spent any time looking into ways people can and have pulled off fake balloting, but I will do that going forward, as it's really foolish to talk about an election that was stolen when evidence hasn't been produced. On the other hand, it's equally foolish to think that it's impossible for fake balloting to occur.

My point in all this is that it was possible for cheating to take place in this last election, but I won't go into depth on it until I have more information.

This is like an ostrich sticking it’s head in the sand, just so you’re aware. Yes, people vote fraudulently, however, it is done individually, and they are invariably caught.

It is very much impossible for massive mail-in voter fraud to take place on a scale where it tips a presidential election. And that’s because we have spent decades making improvements to our voting process. I would encourage you to go to your local precinct and learn about the voting process and all the safeguards that are built in.

Nobody thinks there was massive voter fraud that knows anything about how US elections are run.

And you are not being consistent here - we are only discussing this because you did talk about a stolen election. In fact, you said it was stolen. So don’t now wave it off and say it’s foolish to talk about stolen elections when you are the one who said it was stolen.