Trump Indictment ( includes NY AG and Fed documents case ) (2 Viewers)

[SteveSBrickNJ]

Former President D. Trump has been indicted by a New York Grand Jury. There will be much to talk about on this topic because this is just the first step in a lengthy process.
Possibly it is worthy of its own thread here rather than posting about Trump's indictment in already existing threads?
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This 3/31/23 story might get the ball rolling....
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Manhattan’s DA wanted a Friday Trump arrest. Trump’s team said no.

Secret Service needed more time to prepare, according to the ex-president’s legal team.

www.yahoo.com

 

[LA - L.A.]

Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

Yes, If the special counsel was a properly appointed United States Attorney, i.e. a current District Attorney.

The above statement is deceitful and untrue. Every judge, except for Cannon who was appointed by Trump and has already been overturned twice by the 11th district for her very wrongful interpretations of the law, has ruled that a Special Counsel can be appointed by the Attorney General and they do not have to be a US Attorney. This person, whoever they are, is intentionally trying to deceive and distract people.

They desperately want to take attention away from the fact that Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Yes, If the special counsel was a properly appointed United States Attorney, i.e. a current District Attorney.

The answer is obvious and the question lacks relevance.

By your rationale, the President can summarily fire any Special Counsel appointed to investigate them. Do you not see how ridiculous that is?

 

[Sendai]

Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.


The above statement is deceitful and untrue. Every judge, except for Cannon who was appointed by Trump and has already been overturned twice by the 11th district for her very wrongful interpretations of the law, has ruled that a Special Counsel can be appointed by the Attorney General and they do not have to be a US Attorney. This person, whoever they are, is intentionally trying to deceive and distract people.

They desperately want to take attention away from the fact that Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

There is absolutely nothing preventing the DOJ from prosecuting the case. The District Attorney could re-file the case Monday. Probably get a different judge.

 

[LA - L.A.]

There is absolutely nothing preventing the DOJ from prosecuting the case. The District Attorney could re-file the case Monday.

There's no reason for the DOJ to re-file the case before the 11th Circuit rules on the appeal of Cannon's decision. Since Cannon is the only judge that has ever said that the AG can't create a Special Counsel who wasn't already a US Attorney, it's important to get the 11th Circuit's decision on Cannon's rogue legal interpretation and ruling.

 

[Sendai]

There's no reason for the DOJ to re-file the case before the 11th Circuit rules on the appeal of Cannon's decision. Since Cannon is the only judge that has ever said that the AG can't create a Special Counsel who wasn't already a US Attorney, it's important to get the 11th Circuit's decision on Cannon's rogue legal interpretation and ruling.

I doubt the 11th will have the final word and the originalist/textualist cabal could easily side with Cannon. Meanwhile they can prosecute and appeal at the same time.

 

[Sendai]

By your rationale, the President can summarily fire any Special Counsel appointed to investigate them. Do you not see how ridiculous that is?

If the special counsel is a presidentially appointed and senate approved United States Attorney, like John Durham, of course the President can, at will.

 

[LA - L.A.]

Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

I doubt the 11th will have the final word...

It doesn't matter.

...and the originalist/textualist cabal could easily side with Cannon.

And they could easily not hear the case at all.

Meanwhile they can prosecute and appeal at the same time.

Why are Trump and his minions so desperate to get the DOJ to re-file the case? Why are they so terrified of the 11th circuit hearing and ruling on the appeal?

I think it's because they know that the 11th Circuit will most likely overturn Canon for a third time, possibly remove her from the case, the Supreme Court probably will leave the decision with the 11th Circuit, and a new judge might move the case forward quick enough for very damning evidence of Trump's crimes to be made public before the election. The DOJ re-filing the case guarantees that no evidence will be made public before the election.

 

[Sendai]

Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.


It doesn't matter.


And they could easily not hear the case at all.


Why are Trump and his minions so desperate to get the DOJ to re-file the case? Why are they so terrified of the 11th circuit hearing and ruling on the appeal?

I think it's because they know that the 11th Circuit will most likely overturn Canon for a third time, possibly remove her from the case, the Supreme Court probably will leave the decision with the 11th Circuit, and a new judge might move the case forward quick enough for very damning evidence of Trump's crimes to be made public before the election. The DOJ re-filing the case guarantees that no evidence will be made public before the election.

Trump and minions don’t want the case re-filed. And they’ll appeal the 11th if they overturn Cannon. I can see 4 SC Justices take interest in this on the appointments clause issue. But the thing trumps lawyers want is the delay in hopes he wins the election and then can stop the case.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

If the special counsel is a presidentially appointed and senate approved United States Attorney, like John Durham, of course the President can, at will.

And the second part, where I asked if you understand how stupid that is?

 

[LA - L.A.]

Trump violated the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructed justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

Trump and minions don’t want the case re-filed.

Trump, his minions and you absolutely want the case re-filed, because that would cause a bigger delay than if Smith wins his appeal in the 11th Circuit.

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

If the special counsel is a presidentially appointed and senate approved United States Attorney, like John Durham, of course the President can, at will.

no mention of Mueller or Danforth? i why would you leave those out of your example?

 

[Sendai]

no mention of Mueller or Danforth? i why would you leave those out of your example?

Because, unlike John Durham, neither was presidentially appointed and senate approved.

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

Because, unlike John Durham, neither was presidentially appointed and senate approved.

exactly, so there is a precedent. it has been done before. you don't think that has any weight on the situation?

 

[Sendai]

exactly, so there is a precedent. it has been done before. you don't think that has any weight on the situation?

I doubt it will with the Supreme Court. There is no Supreme Court precedent for Special Counsel-whoops forgot Watergate but that court was nothing like the current court so that precedent becomes pretty iffy. There is Supreme Court precedent for the Independent Counsel but that’s because there was congressional legislation authorizing the office as the constitution requires. There is no current congressional legislation authorizing the Special Counsel.

 

[LA - L.A.]

I doubt it will with the Supreme Court.

I doubt the Supreme Court will hear it if the 11th Circuit overturns Canon and their decision reads the same as the DC Circuits decision. Trump just went full on crazy, so I expect the Heritage Foundation justices to distance themselves from Trump and hang him out to dry for violating the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructing justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

 

[Sendai]

I doubt the Supreme Court will hear it if the 11th Circuit overturns Canon and their decision reads the same as the DC Circuits decision. Trump just went full on crazy, so I expect the Heritage Foundation justices to distance themselves from Trump and hang him out to dry for violating the Espionage Act by taking, keeping and hiding national security documents that belong only to the US government and obstructing justice to try to hide and perpetuate his crimes. Trump betrayed the trust of we the people of the United States and he put our national security at risk because he's a selfish, thuggish criminal.

Again , nothing is stopping this case from being re-filed.

The appeal of a foundational element of the constitution is red meat for the court’s conservatives.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Again , nothing is stopping this case from being re-filed.

The appeal of a foundational element of the constitution is red meat for the court’s conservatives.

Have you realized how ridiculous it is for a president to be in a position to fire the special counsel while under investigation by the special counsel?

 

[Sendai]

Have you realized how ridiculous it is for a president to be in a position to fire the special counsel while under investigation by the special counsel?

Get Congress to do its job and legislate the Special Counsel as they did with Independent Counsel Act and it’s solved. Or have an Assistant United States Attorney bring the case.

Plus he’s the former president, can’t really fire anyone in government.