Trump Indictment ( includes NY AG and Fed documents case ) (1 Viewer)

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    SteveSBrickNJ

    SteveSBrickNJ

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    Former President D. Trump has been indicted by a New York Grand Jury. There will be much to talk about on this topic because this is just the first step in a lengthy process.
    Possibly it is worthy of its own thread here rather than posting about Trump's indictment in already existing threads? :unsure:
    *
    This 3/31/23 story might get the ball rolling....
    *
    www.yahoo.com

    Manhattan’s DA wanted a Friday Trump arrest. Trump’s team said no.

    Secret Service needed more time to prepare, according to the ex-president’s legal team.
    www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
     
    SaintForLife said:
    You know Page was a CIA source and its not illegal to be in contact with Russians right?

    It was a good flex that showed that they did spy on the Trump campaign. But I know you will forever carry on the discredited Trump Russia collusion narrative no matter what.
    Click to expand...
    He was evidently not trusted by his handlers. And you do realize that talking to people with the campaign doesn’t mean you are on the campaign, right? He had left the campaign, just because he talked to them, and we only have your word for that, doesn’t mean he was back on the campaign.

    Seriously, it’s not healthy to be obsessed like this. Go outside, that’s what I’m going to do.
     
    MT15 said:
    He was evidently not trusted by his handlers. And you do realize that talking to people with the campaign doesn’t mean you are on the campaign, right? He had left the campaign, just because he talked to them, and we only have your word for that, doesn’t mean he was back on the campaign.
    Click to expand...
    It's doesnt matter if he was on the campaign at that point. They were able to spy on the Trump campaign with the FISA Two hop rule also gave the FBI access to even more people than just Page:

    While most FISC warrants remain classified, the few which have emerged through leaks, or been forced into the public domain by First Amendment lawsuits, paint a rather bleak picture. These warrants tell us the FISC has issued “mass” warrants which permit government surveillance based on statistical “selectors.”

    These documents also tell us the FISC routinely includes authorization in their warrants for the government to surveil people in contact with their target, and people in contact with the contact; in a scheme referred to as “chaining,” these authorizations will include 2 or 3 “hops.” While the text of the Carter Page warrant application, and court approval, remain a secret, one shudders to think this authority was used to spy upon other members of the Trump campaign team who were in contact with Page.


    MT15 said:
    Seriously, it’s not healthy to be obsessed like this. Go outside, that’s what I’m going to do.
    Click to expand...
    You guys were obsessed with Trump being a Russian asset for over 4 years. Were you worried about the obsession then? Nope

    Yall only claimed it's time to move on after it's all been discredited.
     
    SaintForLife said:
    You guys were obsessed with Trump being a Russian asset for over 4 years.
    Click to expand...

    Trump still is a Russian asset. I mean, look at how he has you and the rest of Trump supporters defending Putin and Russia at every turn. He's extremely effective.

    Russia/Putin don't really have to do anything since Trump is has gleefully chosen that role. But it doesn't mean it's any better for the US.
     
    superchuck500 said:
    I don't know, I don't think those communications have been made public.
    Click to expand...
    Well, that's what I was getting at with my (someone smart-aleck) response earlier. I can't imagine that Trump (who clearly lied and said he returned everything) fought the subpoena in court claiming that he had every right to keep the documents that NARA was trying to retrieve, without there being ANY reporting of it. I'm 99.999% certain that "The PRA allows me to keep whatever I want" came about after the documents were seized as a way to make it look to his supporters that he did nothing wrong.

    I was trying to say that the fact that Trump never fought the subpoena and claimed that he had every right to keep those documents, and instead hid them and lied saying he returned them all, shows that he knew the wasn't entitled to have them.
     
    SaintForLife said:
    While the text of the Carter Page warrant application, and court approval, remain a secret, one shudders to think this authority was used to spy upon other members of the Trump campaign team who were in contact with Page.
    Click to expand...
    In other words, you don't know if the FBI surveilled anyone other than Carter Page.
     
    MT15 said:
    He was evidently not trusted by his handlers. And you do realize that talking to people with the campaign doesn’t mean you are on the campaign, right? He had left the campaign, just because he talked to them, and we only have your word for that, doesn’t mean he was back on the campaign.

    Seriously, it’s not healthy to be obsessed like this. Go outside, that’s what I’m going to do.
    Click to expand...
    Here's my take. I don't know if Page was dirty or not. But, putting myself in the mindset of the FBI:

    --We are investigating one of the two major party campaigns for improper/illegal contacts with Russians.
    --We have a member of the campaign who has been looked at in the past for contacts with Russians.
    --We begin investigating that individual to look at his contacts with Russians because we think that there have been efforts to recruit him as an asset.
    --The campaign begins stating publicly that he does not work for the campaign.
    --He says himself publicly that he is taking a leave of absence from the campaign.
    --(Using SFL's theory) We do not believe those statements, and believe he is still working for the campaign.

    Of course we are going to be suspicious that the campaign and this person suddenly start lying and saying he is not affiliated with the campaign, and have to wonder why they are working so hard to make us think that he is not working for them.
     
    Real good summary, but Carter Page was known to have been recruited by the Russians before. It wasn’t a hypothetical, it had happened once in the past.
     
    This guy is kinda a fun follow. What he is referring to here is the grand jury convened to consider Jan 6 conspirators.

     
    Donald Trump’s lawyers in the Mar-a-Lago documents matter are not wrong that the case is “extraordinary.”

    After all, a former and potentially future president has never before been indicted, much less accused of hoarding government secrets at his private estate.

    But that’s all the more reason Judge Aileen M. Cannon should treat their request this week to indefinitely postpone the trial with extreme skepticism.


    Monday night, the Trump legal team requested that his trial be delayed until all “substantive motions” in the case had been decided. These deliberations could effectively secure a delay until the November 2024 election is either imminent or over entirely — and the lawyers haven’t made this strategy a secret.

    They argue that securing an impartial jury during so intense a political moment will prove almost impossible, as well as that the “time and energy” required to conduct a presidential campaign will render the defendants unable to prepare for the trial.


    These tactics are easy to see through. Plenty of criminal defendants have busy schedules, and plenty of high-profile ones make the jury selection process highly challenging. That doesn’t stop their trials from happening.

    Mr. Trump knew he was being investigated when he decided to declare. Indeed, his allies have said privately that he views a 2024 win as a way to escape his legal hang-ups. He could direct his attorney general to drop the charges; he could even attempt to pardon himself.

    Indeed, his quest for a second term is precisely why a speedy trial is in the public interest: so voters can cast their ballots with full information, and so that there’s no opportunity to dodge accountability……

     
    Optimus Prime said:
    Donald Trump’s lawyers in the Mar-a-Lago documents matter are not wrong that the case is “extraordinary.”

    After all, a former and potentially future president has never before been indicted, much less accused of hoarding government secrets at his private estate.

    But that’s all the more reason Judge Aileen M. Cannon should treat their request this week to indefinitely postpone the trial with extreme skepticism.


    Monday night, the Trump legal team requested that his trial be delayed until all “substantive motions” in the case had been decided. These deliberations could effectively secure a delay until the November 2024 election is either imminent or over entirely — and the lawyers haven’t made this strategy a secret.

    They argue that securing an impartial jury during so intense a political moment will prove almost impossible, as well as that the “time and energy” required to conduct a presidential campaign will render the defendants unable to prepare for the trial.


    These tactics are easy to see through. Plenty of criminal defendants have busy schedules, and plenty of high-profile ones make the jury selection process highly challenging. That doesn’t stop their trials from happening.

    Mr. Trump knew he was being investigated when he decided to declare. Indeed, his allies have said privately that he views a 2024 win as a way to escape his legal hang-ups. He could direct his attorney general to drop the charges; he could even attempt to pardon himself.

    Indeed, his quest for a second term is precisely why a speedy trial is in the public interest: so voters can cast their ballots with full information, and so that there’s no opportunity to dodge accountability……

    Click to expand...
    The DoJ's response has a special reminder to the 11th Circuit ruling against Cannon.
    There is no basis in law or fact for proceeding in such an indeterminate and open-ended fashion, and the Defendants provide none.
    Click to expand...
     
    FullMonte said:
    I actually think this is a good thing. It's very early in the process, and it puts Judge Cannon in the position of having to either give Trump a huge gift, and open herself up to being forced to recuse herself...or....refusing a demand that Trump makes and enraging him.
    Click to expand...

    I think this thing is going forward and she's the judge - however she rules, I don't think she'll be recusing herself or forced off the case (barring something wacky). I think the trial judge has quite a bit of discretion on setting the trial schedule, and I don't think it's something that can be appealed in the classic sense. I suppose that if she outright refused to set a trial date, that might be something DOJ can take up to the 11th but it would have to be in some other posture (injunction or mandamus).

    I think anything this side of March is a win for DOJ. After that, it gets really tricky because the election season is really building momentum toward the conventions and a Trump trial in that period or even after (up through the election) could be so dramatic that it's just not in the interest of the court or the parties.

    Wild speculation - she sets it for late January or early February. Or she could set it for December 11 like the prosecution has asked, but maybe set a status conference in six weeks to have the defense explain its progress and difficulties, and then perhaps allow them to re-file their motion to continue with a better explanation of their specific needs. What they filed was just a bunch of conjecture that DOJ appropriately swatted.
     
    www.pbs.org

    What Iowa Republicans are thinking after Trump's federal indictment

    The news of former President Trump’s federal indictment comes as the GOP primary field is still taking shape. Judy Woodruff is in Des Moines, Iowa, to listen in on voter discussions led by conservative pollster Sarah Longwell. Trump's indictment is the focus of the first of two America at a...
    www.pbs.org www.pbs.org

    This is the BS that we are living in.

    • Judy Woodruff:
      From the 16 Republican voters we gathered yesterday evening, there were strong reactions to the second indictment of former President Donald Trump.

    • Ramona Fiscus, Republican Voter:
      I think he's being set up.

    • Woman:
      Oh, yes. Yes.

    • Sarah Longwell:
      Tell me why.

    • Ramona Fiscus:
      Well, it's just too arranged. Everything is just too arranged.

      And when the FBI went in and raided his property at Mar-a-Lago, how do we know what they did and what they didn't do?
    Click to expand...
     

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