The Voting Thread (Procedures, Turnout, Legal Challenges)(Update: Trump to file suit in PA, MI, WI, AZ, NV, GA) (5 Viewers)

[Lapaz]

There is a lot of push-back from Trump on voting by mail, but most states allow it, and 1/3 allow it without any excuse. His rationale is that it will lead to vast fraud, but of course that isn't his real reason. His real reason is that he thinks it will be worse for conservatives, but studies have shown that states that have instituted much broader voting by mail haven't had any statistical changes in party voting.

Stanford study: Mail voting doesn't benefit one party over another

Coronavirus-spurred limits have intensified a push to allow more mail balloting in November.

www.politico.com

Voting Outside the Polling Place: Absentee, All-Mail and other Voting at Home Options

Most states offer at least one method for any eligible voter to cast a ballot before Election Day. While some states provide early in-person voting, this webpage addresses absentee voting and all-mail voting.

www.ncsl.org

Although, normally voting by mail doesn't affect party votes, I bet it might this year if we have another resurgence of Covid, because I think the right is much more apt to discount the virus than the left. I know that is why Trump is against it.

Whether you're left or right wing, expanding mail in votes is the right thing to do to reduce the likelihood of spreading the virus, to expand voter participation, and to make it easier for those that do show up to stay distant. It will also allow any people with susceptibilities to remain safer. I think voting by mail could be made extremely secure by having people vote using traditional postal mail, coupled with requiring a confirmation either by phone, email or text. If done by phone, then voters can provide confirmation that can include confirming their form number. If done by email or text, it can include a picture of their form, and then confirmation that that was their form. Rather than staffers individually calling people, this can be automated by having voters call the number, text the number, or email the address provided to them on their form. A website can even be created with a database of those that have voted, and perhaps a link to allow people to confirm their vote was correctly registered. For people without computers, a site can include a means to access the database over the phone with some confirmation information. These types of systems are used extensively by banks and other sites that need security, so I think they are mature enough to use. We could even use such a site for people to confirm their vote on the day of the election.

 

[bdb13]

Do I think Trump will be successful? I would say more no than yes, he would have to prove alleged fraud/glitches/mistakes in at least 3 other states to flip where Biden has leads.

This is where you're viewing it wrong imo.. this isn't some long shot like 25% chance or 10% chance for Trump.

It's zero. This was the strategy they were rolling with had Pennsylvania been the deciding state, and when the election didn't fall that way they implemented the strategy anyway with the goal now being to fundraise rather than to actually win the Presidency.

 

[First Time Poster]

Beyond agreeing with the reasoning of people like SuperChuck on why Trump's attempts will not be successful here... there just has to be an understanding from judges and whoever else that are having to seriously deal with this shirt that the societal ramifications of any complicity in attempts to steal or overturn this election are so blatantly grave.

It's scary to have so many elected Republicans going along.. for sure.

But I also think it's pretty clear that most of this is Trump acting as the straight up con man that he is, milking his die-hard supporters for every penny while his ship continues to sink.

What a frigging crook bro. And they flock to him, lambs to the slaughter, flies to the shirt, lemmings to the cliff.

 

[Farb]

If you want the other half of the country to feel this election was valid and legit, unlike 4 years ago, then why not check any all creditable acts of election fraud? Do I think it will be enough to over turn the election, absolutely not, we are stuck with [Mod Edit Partisan trigger] until they figure out to get Harris as POTUS. BUT....
If both sides want to avoid the reeducation camps, blocklists and have this country move forward, why not prove, beyond a doubt that our elections processes work and are above corruption? If we don't, we will have half the country doing the childish "not my president" and #resist crap again and that comes along with all the investigations, impeachments that will surly come down the pike.
If there is nothing wrong, then why stop investigations and litigation that will protect our election integrity? I thought everyone would welcome a chance that Joe won fair and square.

 

[CoolBrees]

Saying his lawsuits have merit and there is a possibility that he could be right about mass voter fraud is akin to saying thinking the earth is flat has merit and there is a possibility you could be right.

Both ideas are false in their face and anyone with a modicum of intelligence can see that. Our system for voting is damn near airtight. What’s ironic is that it is the R’s that have pushing all of these voter rules to ensure fraud (read- voter suppression) were not possible.

Many states have 100% mail in. Pennsylvania has had absentee voting like every other state for years and years. This wasn’t a new process, there were just more people who used it- hence the discrepancy at the end of Tuesday night compare to Friday morning. He’s down 10’s of thousands of verified votes across multiple states. There is no maybe. It’s over. Except for the marks who won’t admit they were -and are still being- conned.

The election wasn’t close. The electoral college isn’t close. He is conning people. And like the marks they are, they would rather keep being grifted instead of admitting they’re being conned.

This is straight out of the con man handbook. I have said it before, thousands of people went to their penniless graves insisting that Jim Baker hadn’t conned them and was a godly man. Despite, you know, the whole going to prison for fraud thing they may have been right.

Trump is out in the open using the defense fund to pay his campaign debt. It says it right on the forking plea for money. He is conning every last one of you. If you give him money you are a mark. It sucks I know but the sooner people wake up and realize that he only wants to drain your bank account the better.

 

[NoPartyMike]

Whatever they find won't be enough to flip the election, but it's not a bad thing to double check the validity of the voting process.

 

[MT15]

If you want the other half of the country to feel this election was valid and legit, unlike 4 years ago, then why not check any all creditable acts of election fraud? Do I think it will be enough to over turn the election, absolutely not, we are stuck with [Mod Edit Partisan trigger] until they figure out to get Harris as POTUS. BUT....
If both sides want to avoid the reeducation camps, blocklists and have this country move forward, why not prove, beyond a doubt that our elections processes work and are above corruption? If we don't, we will have half the country doing the childish "not my president" and #resist crap again and that comes along with all the investigations, impeachments that will surly come down the pike.
If there is nothing wrong, then why stop investigations and litigation that will protect our election integrity? I thought everyone would welcome a chance that Joe won fair and square.

Nobody is saying to stop any creditable investigations. There just hasn’t been a single creditable allegation. Can you show us one that you think should be pursued?

The real issue is that there’s nothing that has been shown yet that has any validity. Nothing.

 

[bdb13]

If you want the other half of the country to feel this election was valid and legit, unlike 4 years ago, then why not check any all creditable acts of election fraud? Do I think it will be enough to over turn the election, absolutely not, we are stuck with [Mod Edit Partisan trigger] until they figure out to get Harris as POTUS. BUT....
If both sides want to avoid the reeducation camps, blocklists and have this country move forward, why not prove, beyond a doubt that our elections processes work and are above corruption? If we don't, we will have half the country doing the childish "not my president" and #resist crap again and that comes along with all the investigations, impeachments that will surly come down the pike.
If there is nothing wrong, then why stop investigations and litigation that will protect our election integrity? I thought everyone would welcome a chance that Joe won fair and square.

They can go through the legal process, that's fine. I think most people's problem, or my problem anyways, is the President and his supporters messaging that's being paired with the legal fight.

The Trump team knows this is over, but they're leading their supporters on in this scorched Earth strategy. Remember when I said I had problems with the way Democrats handled Kavanaugh?

If you squint there's actually a lot of similarities in what the Republicans are doing now compared (and on a much grander scale) to what Democrats did then.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

Whatever they find won't be enough to flip the election, but it's not a bad thing to double check the validity of the voting process.

As is often the case people are debating two different things.

1. Trump has every right to turn over every rock, exhaust every legal avenue and milk his supporters for as much "legal defense fund" money as possible. (OK, that last one was snarky)

2. Running around saying the election is being stolen, claiming massive voter fraud with no evidence and refusing to accept the current outcome of the election is irresponsible, classless, destructive to the faith in our elections, playing to our international adversaries, and frankly, repugnant.

People seem to be arguing that people don't want him to have his day in court. That is in no way what people are arguing. People are saying STOP LYING. This isn't a game, it's not just about partisan BS. This is the faith the world has in our institutions (which is already weakened) and the faith we and others have in our democracy for no other reason than to protect a narcissist's fragile emotional state.

Look at the election. Do it. File more lawsuits to be thrown out like 11 already have been. Just do it the right way not this trashy, amateur, elementary schoolyard, landscape company drive-way way. Have some damn dignity and respect for this country.

 

[superchuck500]

This is embarrassing.

 

[bdb13]

As is often the case people are debating two different things.

1. Trump has every right to turn over every rock, exhaust every legal avenue and milk his supporters for as much "legal defense fund" money as possible. (OK, that last me was snarky)

2. Running around saying the election is being stolen, claiming massive voter fraud with no evidence and refusing to accept the current outcome of the election is irresponsible, classless, destructive to the faith in our elections, playing to our international adversaries, classless and frankly, repugnant.

People seem to be arguing that people don't want him to have his day in court. That is in no way what people are arguing. People are saying STOP LYING. This isn't a game, it's not just about partisan BS. This is the faith the world has in our institutions (which is already weakened) and the faith we and others have in our democracy for no other reason than to protect a narcissist's fragile emotional state.

Look at the election. Do it. File more lawsuits to be thrown out like 11 already have been. Just do it the right way not this trashy, amateur, elementary schoolyard, landscape company drive-way way. Have some damn dignity and respect for this country.

Exactly. You can see the success of Trump though because he's managed to get his supporters to believe that that's where the fight is.

 

[MT15]

What a buffoon. Way to go to West Point and not learn a damn thing about honor.

 

[NoPartyMike]

2. Running around saying the election is being stolen, claiming massive voter fraud with no evidence and refusing to accept the current outcome of the election is irresponsible, classless, destructive to the faith in our elections, playing to our international adversaries, and frankly, repugnant.

Agreed, and imo, this type of bluster from him is one of the big reasons he's now a 1 term pres.

 

[coldseat]

If you want the other half of the country to feel this election was valid and legit, unlike 4 years ago, then why not check any all creditable acts of election fraud? Do I think it will be enough to over turn the election, absolutely not, we are stuck with [Mod Edit Partisan trigger] until they figure out to get Harris as POTUS. BUT....
If both sides want to avoid the reeducation camps, blocklists and have this country move forward, why not prove, beyond a doubt that our elections processes work and are above corruption? If we don't, we will have half the country doing the childish "not my president" and #resist crap again and that comes along with all the investigations, impeachments that will surly come down the pike.
If there is nothing wrong, then why stop investigations and litigation that will protect our election integrity? I thought everyone would welcome a chance that Joe won fair and square.

The other half of the country will never admit that Trump lost fair and square. They will forever think that the election was stolen without any evidence.

At least when some Democrats claimed this four years ago, there was the outside Russian Interference and the questions surrounding the Trump organizations involvement with it. In other words, there were real reasons for concern. But they didn't sue their way to stop a legitimate election, Clinton conceded the day after the election, Obama administration released funds for transition and we all went forward with Trump as our elected president, even among all of the questions and suspicions.

There is nothing here except baseless conspiracy theories that aren't even plausible. Why should eveything be held up with the transition, possibly harming the future of our country, because of the same baseless lies of voter fraud that we've been hearing since he started campaigning 4 years ago and have never been proven?

 

[CoolBrees]

In Maricopa County they are contesting like 180 votes. Out of over 2.1 million. That is outstanding accuracy. Like off the charts perfect. Literally 100% accurate to the 10 thousandths place. It’s mind boggling actually.

If a manufacturing operation were to report operating at a .00008571 accuracy you would be either not actually checking or have developed a machine that is 1million times more accurate than the most accurate we currently have.

 

[Sandman]

If you want the other half of the country to feel this election was valid and legit, unlike 4 years ago, then why not check any all creditable acts of election fraud? Do I think it will be enough to over turn the election, absolutely not, we are stuck with [Mod Edit Partisan trigger] until they figure out to get Harris as POTUS. BUT....
If both sides want to avoid the reeducation camps, blocklists and have this country move forward, why not prove, beyond a doubt that our elections processes work and are above corruption? If we don't, we will have half the country doing the childish "not my president" and #resist crap again and that comes along with all the investigations, impeachments that will surly come down the pike.
If there is nothing wrong, then why stop investigations and litigation that will protect our election integrity? I thought everyone would welcome a chance that Joe won fair and square.

No problem with recounts in races that are close enough for a recount. No problem with a legitimate lawsuit filed on good faith and with supporting evidence.

I do have a problem with any attempt to delay the certification of the election results while baseless lawsuits are filed. Baseless lawsuits should not form the basis in the delay in the transition to Biden.

My biggest issue is that this was the Trump
Strategy all along. Delay mail-in results, cry fraud, file baseless lawsuits, refuse to acknowledge Biden’s victory, block certification of elections because of lawsuits pending, and try to get the legislatures to assign electoral voters because the election can’t be certified.

None of this is being done in good faith. Why should we be forced to pretend it is so that people who will never accept the results “feel good?”

 

[bdb13]

This is embarrassing.

You know up until this weekend I was actually happy with the split result with the Republicans holding the Senate.. I'm pretty moderate so I thought I liked that more than an emboldened Democratic party holding the Presidency along with both the House and Senate..

But you know, screw that now.

 

[superchuck500]

Pompeo full clip is slightly less unnerving.

 

[Mr. Blue Sky]

I do however love a good ol shirtshow though, because the USA has been one gigantic shirtshow the entire year.

Still not sounding any better, no matter how many times you say it.


Matter of fact, this attitude doesnt just make you a part of the problem- it makes you and your ilk THE problem.