The Impeachment Process Has Officially Begun (2 Viewers)

[Andrus]

By Laura Bassett

After months of internal arguing among Democrats over whether to impeach President Donald Trump, the dam is finally breaking in favor of trying to remove him from office. The Washington Post reported that House Speaker Nancy Pelosi would announce a formal impeachment inquiry on Tuesday, following a bombshell report that Trump illegally asked Ukraine’s government to investigate former Vice President Joe Biden, one of his political opponents. (He essentially admitted to having done so over the weekend.)

“Now that we have the facts, we’re ready,” Pelosi said Tuesday morning at a forum hosted by The Atlantic. At 5 p.m. the same day, she was back with more. "The actions taken to date by the president have seriously violated the constitution, especially when the president says Article Two says I can do whatever I want," referring to the segment of the Constitution that defines the power of the executive branch of the government. Pelosi's message was that checks and balances of those branches are just as central to the Constitution. And one more thing: "Today, I am announcing the House of Representatives is moving forward with an official impeachment inquiry," she said at a conference broadcast on Twitter by the Huffington Post. ...

Read the Full Story - InStyle

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Oh no, I'm sirius. I think you all may not be looking at this the right way.

We all know that the Senate is not going to remove the POTUS, correct? (If for some reason there is any question about that, we can come back to it.)

So, all Mitch is saying is the matter is ripe for disposal on arrival at the Senate and they can do that expeditiously. Nonetheless, if the POTUS wants his "day in court" to shed more light on the issues, he can respect that given the fact the POTUS didn't get that opportunity in the House.

If the right way of looking at it is the way that thinks it's ok for McConnell to let Trump design the process for his own trial and refuse to call witnesses, I'll happily continue looking at it the wrong way.

 

[Lapaz]

Oh no, I'm sirius. I think you all may not be looking at this the right way.

We all know that the Senate is not going to remove the POTUS, correct? (If for some reason there is any question about that, we can come back to it.)

So, all Mitch is saying is the matter is ripe for disposal on arrival at the Senate and they can do that expeditiously. Nonetheless, if the POTUS wants his "day in court" to shed more light on the issues, he can respect that given the fact the POTUS didn't get that opportunity in the House.

This is BS. McConnell may know that the Senate will acquit, but there is no excuse to coordinate with Trump. He’s undermining the trial. Trump didn’t get witnesses because he blocked every witness he could. He obstructed as much as he could so he doesn’t deserve to get any witnesses.

 

[samiam5211]

This is BS. McConnell may know that the Senate will acquit, but there is no excuse to coordinate with Trump. He’s undermining the trial. Trump didn’t get witnesses because he blocked every witness he could. He obstructed as much as he could so he doesn’t deserve to get any witnesses.

I don’t know.

Trump is much more likely to screw up his defense than it he left it to his defenders in the Senate.

 

[MT15]

I don’t think Mitch will ever allow Trump to call witnesses, even he’s not that dense.

also, I don’t think we should be using the Moscow Mitch slur in here.

 

[MT15]

I forgive you for saying that.

Maybe I just did not explain the reality of the situation well enough. Let me try again.

I think the Senate will likely take the position that the record has been made in the House and based on that record, a vote will result in acquittal.

It's the rough equivalent to a directed verdict at the close of a plaintiff's case. If you can get a directed verdict, it would be foolish to reopen the case.

Nonetheless, if the POTUS just insists on calling witnesses that he was not able to call in the House, they are not going to stand in his way.

Look at it this way. The Saints are down by two points, have the ball on the opponent's 15 yard line and there is 45 seconds left.

Drew, by the way, is one TD pass away from setting the single season record.

Although it's first down, the smart move is to run the clock down to 3 seconds and kick the FG.

That's where we are at and no matter how much the Defense wants us to put the ball in the air, the smart move is to take the win and move on.

You seem to think that Mitch is the judge in this case, which isn’t true. Mitch is supposed to be on the jury, maybe the jury foreman. He doesn’t get to decide on a directed verdict.

As the jury foreman, he takes an oath to impartially view the evidence before he makes his verdict. What Mitch said on Fox the other day makes a mockery of the entire US criminal justice system, in a roundabout way.

At the very least, it shows that he doesn’t take his oath seriously. It’s a dereliction of duty. I think he knows he will be defeated in the election and this is his last term in office, in my opinion.

 

[The moose]

I don’t think Mitch will ever allow Trump to call witnesses, even he’s not that dense.

also, I don’t think we should be using the Moscow Mitch slur in here.

I diss agree he earned [Mod edit] Mitch!

He keeps blocking election security legislation.

 

[MT15]

These types of nicknames are not allowed on this board. It’s been made pretty clear. If we expect the conservative side to adhere to the policies, then we need to do the same.

 

[Beach Friends]

You seem to think that Mitch is the judge in this case, which isn’t true. Mitch is supposed to be on the jury, maybe the jury foreman. He doesn’t get to decide on a directed verdict.

As the jury foreman, he takes an oath to impartially view the evidence before he makes his verdict. What Mitch said on Fox the other day makes a mockery of the entire US criminal justice system, in a roundabout way.

At the very least, it shows that he doesn’t take his oath seriously. It’s a dereliction of duty. I think he knows he will be defeated in the election and this is his last term in office, in my opinion.

I don't mean this disrespectfully, but I think you may be being a little naive here. This isn't Trump that is asking for an expedited procedure, it's members of Congress him to let this thing go.

Think about all the legislation that he has wanted that is suddenly moving. He just steamrolled the Democrats on the budget. Wounded presidents aren't able to do that. USMCA, China - all of this is moving.

Do you think members of Congress really want to see him exposing the money laundering scheme that is foreign aide? Hell no. Do you think Nancy wants him delving into Schiff's shenanigans? Nope, and don't be surprised to learn she has had her hand in the cookie jar as well.

They realize they have a tiger by the tail and they want this to end quietly.

Backroom deals are being made all over to ensure that this doesn't get put of hand.

That's why you see Trump walking around town with renewed swagger.

 

[The moose]

These types of nicknames are not allowed on this board. It’s been made pretty clear. If we expect the conservative side to adhere to the policies, then we need to do the same.

If they have a problem then kick me out.

Just like I'd expect election reform legislation to get off of his desk after the the last election.

I personally don't see it as a slur if he is working to not pass a thing having to do with election reform when you consider what has happened.

The day any election reform passes he will loose it when he starts working for us the people.

It is not we the comrades it is the people!

 

[MT15]

BF, You have a different view of things, I’ll give you that. Personally I don’t think any of what you just opined is factual, nor relevant to Mitch’s unethical approach to the upcoming trial in the Senate.

But if it was true, don’t you feel a bit betrayed by Trump letting this die quietly? According to you he has the swamp on the ropes, but he won’t finish the job?

At the risk of a threadjack, the USMCA contains significant concessions to things the democrats want, so much so that Mitch wasn’t exactly thrilled with it.

And if you really want to know how Trump is feeling just look at his Twitter feed. He’s pretty upset about being impeached and he’s pretty upset that Greta won Time Person of the Year over him. He’s doing nothing but watching tv and tweeting these days, apparently.

 

[Beach Friends]

BF, You have a different view of things, I’ll give you that. Personally I don’t think any of what you just opined is factual, nor relevant to Mitch’s unethical approach to the upcoming trial in the Senate.

But if it was true, don’t you feel a bit betrayed by Trump letting this die quietly? According to you he has the swamp on the ropes, but he won’t finish the job?

At the risk of a threadjack, the USMCA contains significant concessions to things the democrats want, so much so that Mitch wasn’t exactly thrilled with it.

And if you really want to know how Trump is feeling just look at his Twitter feed. He’s pretty upset about being impeached and he’s pretty upset that Greta won Time Person of the Year over him. He’s doing nothing but watching tv and tweeting these days, apparently.

Personally, I don't think a trial in the Senate is the best method to drill down to the root of the issues I mentioned. But there are going to be plenty of people who are disappointed. I think we need to have patience.

I really didn't expect you to accept what I wrote, but perhaps it will give you some food for thought. Do you really think that Trump is the only person who should be nervous about fully exploring the questions that would be raised by fully exploring the issues? I feel strongly that Joe Biden doesn't want to hear a lot of questions about the money laundering associated with foreign aide, but I doubt he is the only one who is squirming. I think it's a widespread problem that reaches across both sides of the aisle.

 

[Archies Ghost]

The impeachment articles are incredibly weak and the best thing for the country (and probably the Democrats) would be table the whole thing and pretend it never happened.

This seems very unlikely so if the House actually does vote and the vote passes, the best thing for the country would be a straight vote by the Senate.

If a trial were to ensue, it must necessarily favor the defendant as that is how our system works.

A lot of folks who spent thousands of characters explaining the analog to judicial proceedings seem to be suddenly forgetting everything they typed.

 

[FullMonte]

This pleases me very much.

The Senate should let the POTUS decide whether witnesses are called first, or we just go straight to an acquittal.

It pleases you that he is acting in direct opposition to the oath he is going to take prior to the trial?

 

[Saintamaniac]

I forgive you for saying that.

Maybe I just did not explain the reality of the situation well enough. Let me try again.

I think the Senate will likely take the position that the record has been made in the House and based on that record, a vote will result in acquittal.

It's the rough equivalent to a directed verdict at the close of a plaintiff's case. If you can get a directed verdict, it would be foolish to reopen the case.

Nonetheless, if the POTUS just insists on calling witnesses that he was not able to call in the House, they are not going to stand in his way.

Look at it this way. The Saints are down by two points, have the ball on the opponent's 15 yard line and there is 45 seconds left.

Drew, by the way, is one TD pass away from setting the single season record.

Although it's first down, the smart move is to run the clock down to 3 seconds and kick the FG.

That's where we are at and no matter how much the Defense wants us to put the ball in the air, the smart move is to take the win and move on.

I neither require nor asked for forgiveness from you for anything I said. For the actions and words of Mitch McConnell, the republican senator from Kentucky who has blocked numerous pieces of legislation designed to protect America from russian influence and thereby suggests that he is overly friendly to Moscow, to please anyone indicates to me a direct preference for shirtting upon the constitution and rule of law.

 

[Beach Friends]

I neither require nor asked for forgiveness from you for anything I said.

No, but you should have.

 

[N.O.Bronco]

.

The impeachment articles are incredibly weak and the best thing for the country (and probably the Democrats) would be table the whole thing and pretend it never happened.

This seems very unlikely so if the House actually does vote and the vote passes, the best thing for the country would be a straight vote by the Senate.

If a trial were to ensue, it must necessarily favor the defendant as that is how our system works.

A lot of folks who spent thousands of characters explaining the analog to judicial proceedings seem to be suddenly forgetting everything they typed.

Nothing in our legal system, or any legal system I am aware of, predicates that the defendant should decide how the court arbitrates or calls witnesses in their case, or would allow a member of the jury to serve as the pro-bono defense counsel or a collaborator to the accused’s counsel.

Which given McConnell’s language last night, is what he is flirting very hard with.

 

[coldseat]

There is no point in expecting that anything in Senate is going to approach a just and equitable result. No chance of that happening with Mitch McConnell in charge and the entirety of the Republican Senate willing to walk in lock step with Trump and McConnell. So there's little point in arguing what the impeachment trial should be. Everybody knows this and Trump supporters are gleeful about it (as evidenced here).

This was always going to be the case and those of us who have argued for impeachment already knew that going in. Once they vote to impeach Trump, the democrats will have accomplished what the power they hold allows and demands of them. The democrats in the Senate should continue to work with republicans where they can, but in the end, the result has already been preordained by McConnell and Trump.

After they Impeach Trump in the House, they need to move on to making this next election about 3 things. 1.) Health Care, the Environment, and other issue that are hurting Americans now (as they have been). 2.) The corruption of the Trump administration and the need to vote him out. 3.) The destructive result of having a Senate controlled by Republicans and McConnell and how he's wielded his power to pervert democracy.

That's it! Come up with catchy slogans that you can repeat adnauseam to drill it into every bodies head. Seems that's the only thing that really works in politics.

The Senate, along with the presidency needs to change hands in the next election. I'd say getting McConnell out of power is almost as important voting Trump out.

 

[Saintamaniac]

No, but you should have.

I'll make you a deal. When Republicans start respecting the constitution again, I'll do it then.