Russian attitudes taking hold in US (1 Viewer)

[mjcouvi]

If you think that outlook on life started with Trump you've been asleep (or pretended to be) for a very long time. The "cheat and lie to get ahead" philosophy as practiced by a large segment of the population is at least several decades old and rose to an art form during the Clinton years.

Several decades old? How about as old as spoken language?

 

[MT15]

I was listening to a show, so no link. I thought I made that clear. The Russian expert was a Yale professor if I remember correctly, and he was not talking about the Russian people. Rather he was talking about the gaslighting (for lack of a better word) that Putin has inflicted on the Russian state. Trump is echoing that exact same sort of gaslighting, and I gave a couple of examples that were widely reported when they occurred.

Archie’s Ghost could have just brought up his refutation about the Russian people, but couldn’t resist being insulting about it by referencing TDS. If he had responded in a more civil manner we could have been having a discussion about the recent efforts by the Russian people to get rid of Putin and his corruption, which I find encouraging, rather than people getting all “feely” about the observation made by the Russian expert.

 

[GMRfellowtraveller]

Nothing honestly. Just seems crazy for you to call Archie’s Ghost out about “proving his work” (as if that is a thing on a website forum) Why would you call out Archie’s ghost and not MT15?

Honest question?

she heard someone on the radio make a point
she summarized that point here,
said why it struck here
and then kind of extended the thought and sought comment

Archie's ghost said TDS with no explanation of how that accounted for anything
and then 'dem playbook' without saying what he meant by that and how trump is using it

those 2 posts are not remotely comparable

 

[MT15]

So a cogent comparison of similarities between Trump and Putin is “bashing”? But the name calling and intentional misuse of a word for the Democratic Party by Archie’s Ghost is just fine?

Lol.

 

[GMRfellowtraveller]

I don’t want to speak for anyone else, but I took what mt15 posted as another reason to bash trump comparing him to Putin. Hence the tds comment. I don’t think Archie needed to extrapolate any further to make his point.

She was quoting a Russian scholar and added perspective
Archie’s ghost was entirely dismissive without explaining his reasons
Not comparable at all

 

[Lazybones]

So a cogent comparison of similarities between Trump and Putin is “bashing”? But the name calling and intentional misuse of a word for the Democratic Party by Archie’s Ghost is just fine?

Lol.

Mt15- Yes comparing a sitting president of the USA to Putin is bashing. Unless you meant it as a compliment and I just misunderstood.

And I think it is appropriate to point out how the “left” uses gas every chance to make Trump out to be the biggest villain the world has ever seen.

 

[Lazybones]

She was quoting a Russian scholar and added perspective
Archie’s ghost was entirely dismissive without explaining his reasons
Not comparable at all

What does he have to explain? Do you need a peer reviewed article to say that the left is hyperbolic when it comes to anything trump?

 

[Dragon]

TBH I see Trump (and his election) more as a symptom than the cause.

But yes - he was pushing a lot of the same sentiments with his "draining the swamp" promises prior to the election and in many ways he does his own little Putin immitation with his attacks on the press and his calling political opponents criminals and traitors.

But the inherent mistrust between the politicians and the population was already there - Trump just exploited it to get elected.

When it comes to the russian population it is important to understand that they have never really had any long periods of democracy. They went from the Zar to hardcore communism in a span of 10 years and less than 10 years after the Berlin wall fell, they were back again with Oligarks controlling society.

Fear has always been a major factor in Russia - fear of saying or doing something wrong or catching the attention of the authorities.
Yes - luckily there are and always have been brave people who fight for democrazy but they often pay a high price.

The US has a strong democratic foundation but like all other foundations it can be lost if not supported and nurtured.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

Trump supporters: Comparing Trump to Putin is TDS.

Trump: Arrest my political enemies for treason! The press are the enemy of the people! There will be civil war if I'm legally removed from office! The whistleblower is a spy, and you know what we do to spies!

Sane people:

 

[GMRfellowtraveller]

What does he have to explain? Do you need a peer reviewed article to say that the left is hyperbolic when it comes to anything trump?

Yes, of course
Just repeating something over and over until it becomes reality is a significant problem (and why Oye stresses the importance of media literacy so often)
- and I’m talking both/every side here

You are making assumptions about TDS and hyperbole- cool, no problem there - but do you have any idea if your position has merit? And can you articulate that merit?

It’s perhaps informative that you and Archie’s ghost have spent the entire thread complaining that OP expressed an opinion and have spent zero time contradicting the opinion or expressing one of your own

 

[Lazybones]

Slow down. I was only interpreting what he said and responded to you.

Yes, I think the left is hyperbolic when it comes to trump. I think comparing the way our country is run by Donald trump (though I think he is a blow hard) is no comparison to the way Putin runs Russia.

I don’t need an article to support that.

 

[GMRfellowtraveller]

Slow down. I was only interpreting what he said and responded to you.

Yes, I think the left is hyperbolic when it comes to trump. I think comparing the way our country is run by Donald trump (though I think he is a blow hard) is no comparison to the way Putin runs Russia.

I don’t need an article to support that.

My overall point was that you were calling to see “his work.” This is not a college course, this is an internet forum. If OP doesn’t want to be challenged on the PREMISE of her opinion, post it in the safe place.

The overall point is that he did NOT offer a challenge
challenges are always welcome
a dismissal is not a challenge

You still haven’t said why it doesn’t work saying Trump employs similar means that Putin does

 

[Lazybones]

The overall point is that he did NOT offer a challenge
challenges are always welcome
a dismissal is not a challenge

You still haven’t said why it doesn’t work saying Trump employs similar means that Putin does

Getting into a tit for tat on everything the president does is non productive. What’s next a “daily trump tracker”?

The old esops fable still holds true. The problem is that this buffoon is going to get re-elected because of it. The left and the media has played this wrong from jump street and many of you have fell right in line.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

The premise of the position is wrong. The OP doesn’t want an honest conversation comparing trump and Putin.

Getting into a tit for tat on everything the president does is non productive. What’s next a “daily trump tracker”?

The old esops fable still holds true. The problem is that this buffoon is going to get re-elected because of it. The left and the media has played this wrong from jump street and many of you have fell right in line.

So how should they have played it?

Don't point out his lies.
Don't point out his racism.
Don't point out his Tweets.
Don't point out his urinating daily on the Constitution.
Don't point out his rampant corruption.
Don't point out his autocratic nature and desires.

Every single thing he does if you mention it you have TDS, or some other mind-numbingly dumb talking point.

Just sit in the corner and be quiet. It will pass.

That's incredibly stupid.

 

[Lazybones]

So how should they have played it?

Don't point out his lies.
Don't point out his racism.
Don't point out his Tweets.
Don't point out his urinating daily on the Constitution.
Don't point out his rampant corruption.
Don't point out his autocratic nature and desires.

Every single thing he does if you mention it you have TDS, or some other mind-numbingly dumb talking point.

Just sit in the corner and be quiet. It will pass.

That's incredibly stupid.

Focus on the important gaffes and lies. As I stated making comparisons to trump and Putin puts trump back into the White House.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

When it is done over and over and over and over. Yes it is TDS. And yes it is incredibly stupid. That is why I wish they would stop.

Focus on the important gaffes and lies. As I stated making comparisons to trump and Putin puts trump back into the White House.

No, the attitude of pretending that it all doesn't matter and the weak approach of complacency puts him back. Pretending we aren't dealing with a wannabe autocrat that would behave EXACTLY like Putin were it not for institutional guard rails (that he's chipping away at) is what will put him back. Claiming all criticism is TDS is not only what will put him back, but it's also incredibly forking stupid.

I'm convinced he's going to win because there are too many people that are too shortsighted to understand how tenuously we are holding on to the the American experiment right now. Who think no matter how many Pittsburgh's and El Paso's we have words don't matter. Who think that the corrosion of our institutions is okay because "Muh 401k is lit!!!!".

Greed, hatred, lack of empathy and intellectual dishonesty are going to put him back, not calling out his bullshirt.

 

[Lazybones]

Well if you think it’s a winning strategy, keep it going. I have never witnessed petulance win anyone over.

 

[Saint by the Bay]

Well if you think it’s a winning strategy, keep it going. I have never witnessed petulance win anyone over.

There's nobody to win over. If you're still a Trump supporter @ 2:45 PM on 10/1/19 there is zero that can be done to change your mind.