Now is not the time to talk about gun control (2 Viewers)

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    coldseat said:
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    Nothing in politics is as effective as fear. And conservatives such as Boebert know exactly how to weaponize it. The conservative mind is more concerned that a drag queen is entering a classroom to read a story to children than a gunman is entering a classroom to shoot them. And I will never understand that.

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    This about sums everything up!
    Click to expand...

    There is no understanding it and there is no reason or logic to it….there are a lot of evil folks out there…most of them masquerading as true ”Christians”…..
     
    coldseat said:
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    Nothing in politics is as effective as fear. And conservatives such as Boebert know exactly how to weaponize it. The conservative mind is more concerned that a drag queen is entering a classroom to read a story to children than a gunman is entering a classroom to shoot them. And I will never understand that.

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    This about sums everything up!
    Click to expand...


    Quote in the article you reference:

    Boebert tweeted: “A ‘kid-friendly’ drag show in Texas was guarded by masked ANTIFA guards armed with AR-15′s. Remember, they only want YOUR guns. They want to use theirs to protect their depravity.”

    And a poster in here tried to tell me that drag queens weren't marginalized in this country. I'm pretty sure that referring to them as depraved is marginalizing them.
     
    BTW, note that the two young men who stepped forward to disarm the shooter at Club Q were unarmed.

    So much for the right-wing theory/excuse that you need to be armed yourself to stop a shooter.
     
    coldseat said:
    Us gays have learned not to wait for or trust LEO's. We're going to handle it when the murderers come into our space, armed or not.


    1669048584446.png
    Click to expand...


    Just as an notable factual update, the Club Q patron who jumped on and initially subdued the attacker was a straight male there with his family celebrating a birthday and to watch his daughters best friend perform drag.

    Notch one for the allies. Thank you Richard Fierro!

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    COLORADO SPRINGS — Richard Fierro went to Club Q in Colorado Springs on Saturday night to celebrate a friend’s birthday with his family, enjoying a drag show that included a performance by his 22-year-old daughter’s best friend.

    By night’s end, the air of celebration would be cut off by gunfire. Three of Fierro’s loved ones would be shot — one fatally — and Fierro, a U.S. Army veteran, would find himself rushing to confront and subdue the gunman.

    On Monday, he brushed aside his actions as necessary as chaos overtook the club.
    “I had my whole Colorado Springs family in there. I had to do something: He was not going to kill my family,” Fierro said. “I just want people to take care of people, the people who are hurt and no longer with us. I still got two of my best friends who are in the hospital. They still need prayers; they still need support.”

    ........

    When the first shots rang out, Fierro said, “I dove when I heard it and I pushed my friend down. He went to the floor and ended up getting shot.” So did his friend’s wife and his daughter’s boyfriend.

    Fierro’s daughter broke a knee as she ran for cover until a stranger pulled her to safety in a rear dressing room. He said his wife “got sucked into the crowd that went to the patio.”

    As Fierro got up from the floor, he said, he saw the man with a gun.

    “I looked across the room and the guy was standing at the door. I ran across the bar, grabbed the guy from the back and pulled him down and pinned him against the stairs,” he said.

    Fierro weighs 300 pounds, but said the gunman was bigger, wearing body armor and carrying both a handgun and an AR-15 style rifle.

    “He went for his weapon, and I grabbed his handgun,” Fierro said, but “his AR was right in front of him.”

    Fierro said he started shouting orders to a young man who had stopped in front of the shooter to assist.

    “I said ‘Kick him! Move the AR!’ Then I just started hitting him. But he was in armor plates, so I started hitting him wherever there was skin,” Fierro said. “The back of his head was my target.”

    Fierro said he felt his military training kick in.

    “I’m an officer and that’s what we do: I took control of the scene as best I could. I’m just hitting the guy with the pistol, beating the back of his head,” he recalled. “I’m yelling to people at the same time, ‘Call the police! Let’s go!’”

    When the young man assisting him flagged, Fierro said he hailed a passing drag queen in high heels to help, shouting, “Kick him!”
    “She kicked him because the other guy was tired,” he said.

    By the time the first police officer arrived minutes later, Fierro said, “I was in the middle of a puddle of blood.”
    ============

     
    Cannot forget the far rights hateful rhetoric’s role and responsibility in this violence

    Then afterwards deny it had anything to do with it

    It was all mental illness.
    ============================


    After the shooting at the LGBTQ Club Q in Colorado Springs, Rep. Lauren Boebert (R-Colo.), gun rights advocate and representative for her state’s 3rd Congressional District, tweeted the following:

    “The news out of Colorado Springs is absolutely awful. This morning the victims & their families are in my prayers. This lawless violence needs to end and end quickly.”

    In her tweet, Boebert left out the “news” that a lone gunman entered an LGBTQ space and began shooting, killing five and injuring at least 25.

    I’m betting Boebert did not mention these specifics because that would ruin her brand: the gun-toting, queer-hating, God-loving, outlaw whose job it is to own the liberals.

    If she had tweeted the specifics of the night and its tragic outcome, it might cause some of her followers to see LGBTQ people as human beings. And she can’t have that.

    I don’t go to clubs and bars anymore. But when I was younger, queer spaces were a lifeline. They weren’t just bars; they were shelters where I could escape all the judgment of the world.

    All the Christians who seemed to delight in telling me that I was hell-bound. All the pressure to be a “real man.” All the pretending to be someone I wasn’t, just to fit into a social order that I didn’t understand. They were, in short, places where I felt free.

    Everyone should have such a place. For heterosexual people, that place is the whole wide world. For heterosexual people, that place includes public parks and restaurants and any street they care to walk down, hand in hand.

    But LGBTQ people must find — or more accurately — create those spaces. And because of the shooting at Club Q, there is, for now, one fewer place for the queer community of Colorado Springs to go.

    You know who will get the blame for Colorado Springs, right? Each time these things happen, the right-wing go-to is to blame “mental illness.”

    That’s what some thought drove Robert Bowers to the Tree of Life synagogue in Pittsburgh to kill 11 human beings. That’s what others believed made Dylann Roof stroll into a Black church in Charleston, S.C., to murder nine human beings.

    And, sooner or later, conservatives will say it was “mental illness” that drove this newest killer of the marginalized to commit the latest atrocity.


    But are we ever going to ask why so many supposedly mentally ill people seem to carry right-wing talking points along with their AR-15s?


    It’s right-wing rhetoric that sparks these nightmares. And here’s the bonus for the instigators: The bottomless list of homophobes and transphobes on the right don’t need to throw the rock and then hide their hands. Instead, they use someone else’s hands entirely.

    After ginning up hatred for a particular community through fear, lies and conspiracies, all they have to do is sit back and wait for someone to do their work for them…….

     
    BullSheetBuddha said:
    Quote in the article you reference:

    Boebert tweeted: “A ‘kid-friendly’ drag show in Texas was guarded by masked ANTIFA guards armed with AR-15′s. Remember, they only want YOUR guns. They want to use theirs to protect their depravity.”

    And a poster in here tried to tell me that drag queens weren't marginalized in this country. I'm pretty sure that referring to them as depraved is marginalizing them.
    Click to expand...

    I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that poster will tell you that that comment was about guns and fearmongering around guns... and name calling, I don't think the poster feels it is marginalization. Think of all of the things you call right wingers in public and in private. Are you marginalizing right wingers?

    The one thing drag queens have going for them, they can take the costume off.
     
    Last edited:
    SystemShock said:
    I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that poster will tell you that that comment was about guns and fearmongering around guns... and name calling, I don't think the poster feels it is marginalization. Think of all of the things you call right wingers in public and in private. Are you marginalizing right wingers?

    The one thing drag queens have going for them, they can take the costume off.
    Click to expand...
    And right-wing-nutjobs look like anybody else. What's your point?

    I mean, if "both sides" are using the word 'depravity', one uses it to describe a drag show while the other uses it to describe armed insurrection.
     
    Taurus said:
    And right-wing-nutjobs look like anybody else. What's your point?

    I mean, if "both sides" are using the word 'depravity', one uses it to describe a drag show while the other uses it to describe armed insurrection.
    Click to expand...
    My point about the costume off comment?
     
    Taurus said:
    Yes

    Drag queens and seditionists can both look like average citizens if they want to.
    Click to expand...

    The fundamental difference that Systemshock is missing. The left will often times call out behavior they find troubling. "The Jan 6th rioters are depraved nuts."

    Both statements are trying to do the same thing, create an outgroup.

    In this case, the left is trying to demonize, and ostracize sedition. The right is trying to demonize, and ostracize LGBTQ. These are not the same.

    It's the same old game of false equivalency.
     
    SystemShock said:
    I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that poster will tell you that that comment was about guns and fearmongering around guns... and name calling, I don't think the poster feels it is marginalization. Think of all of the things you call right wingers in public and in private. Are you marginalizing right wingers?

    The one thing drag queens have going for them, they can take the costume off.
    Click to expand...
    Do you know that there was a drag show going on at Club Q when the shooting occurred?
     
    SystemShock said:
    I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that poster will tell you that that comment was about guns and fearmongering around guns... and name calling, I don't think the poster feels it is marginalization. Think of all of the things you call right wingers in public and in private. Are you marginalizing right wingers?

    The one thing drag queens have going for them, they can take the costume off.
    Click to expand...

    Drag Queens are marginalized in the same ways that LGBTQ+ people in general are marginalized. However, because the stand out so much, they definitely receive more ire from the right wing. So in that sense they are more targeted for hatred, case in point.

    I'm not really sure what the point of this argument really is. There isn't a marginalization metric and those of us that belong to groups that are generally considered as marginalized don't go around constantly proclaiming how marginalized we are.
     
    Seems to me when Boebert uses the word “depravity” to describe the drag show she is specifically marginalizing drag queens. Specifically. And by inference all LBGTQ folks and all the people who attend such shows. How can that not be marginalization?
     
    MT15 said:
    Seems to me when Boebert uses the word “depravity” to describe the drag show she is specifically marginalizing drag queens. Specifically. And by inference all LBGTQ folks and all the people who attend such shows. How can that not be marginalization?
    Click to expand...
    The way I read it, her intent was to marginalize the whole thing, including those who support it.
     
    coldseat said:
    Drag Queens are marginalized in the same ways that LGBTQ+ people in general are marginalized. However, because the stand out so much, they definitely receive more ire from the right wing. So in that sense they are more targeted for hatred, case in point.

    I'm not really sure what the point of this argument really is. There isn't a marginalization metric and those of us that belong to groups that are generally considered as marginalized don't go around constantly proclaiming how marginalized we are.
    Click to expand...
    Coldseat, this is what I mean by being marginalized:

    "I don’t go to clubs and bars anymore. But when I was younger, queer spaces were a lifeline. They weren’t just bars; they were shelters where I could escape all the judgment of the world. All the Christians who seemed to delight in telling me that I was hell-bound. All the pressure to be a “real man.” All the pretending to be someone I wasn’t, just to fit into a social order that I didn’t understand. They were, in short, places where I felt free."

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/11/21/colorado-springs-club-q-lgbtq-homophobia-hate/

    So the point is that's certainly not fair and it should be recognized. Anyone in this society should be able to be themselves anywhere at any time.
     
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