Law Enforcement Reform Thread (formerly Defund the Police) (2 Viewers)

[First Time Poster]

So I got busy the other day with the intention to revisit this topic and answer some of the responses put forward but I realized the thread was deleted. But, I felt we had good dialogue happening before I left so I wanted to restart the topic to get the conversation going again. We started some dialogue about it on the liberal board but I feel this topic transcends party lines so I'm making a MCB thread. Post #2, or my next post, is the post I made on the liberal board when asked to elaborate how I felt.

 

[MT15]

you do see the dates on tweets, right?

 

[SaintForLife]

It seems pretty well organized to me despite the media claiming otherwise

 

[MT15]

SFL, you remember that when the story was first published, everyone was reporting that the police went to the wrong house, don’t you? It was a garble of the actual errors, because they were looking for someone who hadn’t lived there in quite some time.

Why do you persist in posting tweets from months or years ago and pretending they represent current stances or current knowledge? That tweet from the DNC is consistent with knowledge at that time.

 

[MT15]

It seems pretty well organized to me despite the media claiming otherwise

so, you are going to claim that the “media” is calling this spontaneous, when your only source is a tweet from “the new home of Bill O’Reilly” and it clearly is being sarcastic about the word spontaneous?

Good lord.

 

[JimEverett]

SFL, you remember that when the story was first published, everyone was reporting that the police went to the wrong house, don’t you? It was a garble of the actual errors, because they were looking for someone who hadn’t lived there in quite some time.

Why do you persist in posting tweets from months or years ago and pretending they represent current stances or current knowledge? That tweet from the DNC is consistent with knowledge at that time.

You would think and hope they would show more responsibility in such a time and want to know the facts before just running off and spouting whatever that might inflame the public.
Every time an even like this happens we know false stuff will come out

 

[Ayo]

The Taylor case is a tragedy, but

there’s a lot after that “but” and then tragedy component gets lost in what ends up reading like more of a justification than anything.

There are also details this post doesn’t include which are also germane. So I don’t think one can argue selective framing, credibly, while selectively framing in the very same post ostensibly critical of it

 

[Ayo]

so, you are going to claim that the “media” is calling this spontaneous, when your only source is a tweet from “the new home of Bill O’Reilly” and it clearly is being sarcastic about the word spontaneous?

Good lord.

The department asked for a state of emergency declaration. That was a pretty clear sign of what would likely come.

and Breonna has been on the lips of society for a long time now and assumptions of a lack of justice for her has long been a belief of many, based on, you know, American history

To read organization as some nefarious plot that invalidates the protesting is such a bizarre take.

I am buying more canned goods and non perishables and hand sanitizer and disinfectant wipes because I am anticipating a second wave.

How would that be a “surprise”? And why is that so nefarious? I’m not in a conspiracy with COVID.

 

[SaintForLife]

so, you are going to claim that the “media” is calling this spontaneous, when your only source is a tweet from “the new home of Bill O’Reilly” and it clearly is being sarcastic about the word spontaneous?

Good lord.

I wasn't referring the the tweet when I referenced the media. You see that spontaneous is in quotes right? The reason I posted the tweet for for the video.

 

[SaintForLife]

You would think and hope they would show more responsibility in such a time and want to know the facts before just running off and spouting whatever that might inflame the public.
Every time an even like this happens we know false stuff will come out

It doesn't fit their narrative to wait for the facts. They want to maximize the anger and rage.

 

[SaintForLife]

SFL, you remember that when the story was first published, everyone was reporting that the police went to the wrong house, don’t you? It was a garble of the actual errors, because they were looking for someone who hadn’t lived there in quite some time.

Why do you persist in posting tweets from months or years ago and pretending they represent current stances or current knowledge? That tweet from the DNC is consistent with knowledge at that time.

If the DNC even cared about being responsible they wouldn't have put a statement out that unless they were absolutely sure it was true. They know exactly what they are doing.

 

[SaintForLife]

there’s a lot after that “but” and then tragedy component gets lost in what ends up reading like more of a justification than anything.

There are also details this post doesn’t include which are also germane. So I don’t think one can argue selective framing, credibly, while selectively framing in the very same post ostensibly critical of it

Yeah why would we care what the facts are before helping to incite riots and inflame racial tensions?

 

[N.O.Bronco]

Yeah why would we care what the facts are before helping to incite riots and inflame racial tensions?

So in that spirit, what are ALL the “facts” behind the Uhaul story you just drove by with?

Seems like that little drive by that was all over right wing Twitter inferences quite a lot without actually verifying and substantiating anything. For someone that claims to be so passionate about wrongful incitement, about verification before insinuation or implied confirmation, what gives?

 

[MT15]

You would think and hope they would show more responsibility in such a time and want to know the facts before just running off and spouting whatever that might inflame the public.
Every time an even like this happens we know false stuff will come out

it was being universally reported and I seem to recall the PD even making such a statement in the immediate aftermath. Could be mistaken about that, but I recall there being conflicting official statements at the time.

Also, I’m not really defending the tweet, I was mainly objecting to SFL putting it up as if it’s an indication of what the DNC is saying right now.

 

[Ayo]

Yeah why would we care what the facts are before helping to incite riots and inflame racial tensions?

I don't know. I think you're in a better position to answer that than I am.

I'm not the one selectively cherry picking to argue against selectively cherry picking.

I've never once cited the nature of the warrant, but that's what your post seemed focused on. You're mad at other people for focusing on one thing while you, yourself, are focused on one thing.

If it was about 'facts' then you'd have more to say, or at least I'd presume.

 

[MT15]

I wasn't referring the the tweet when I referenced the media. You see that spontaneous is in quotes right? The reason I posted the tweet for for the video.

so wouldn’t it be helpful to actually demonstrate some media that are calling it spontaneous then? otherwise you're doing the exact thing you like to accuse everyone else of doing.

 

[coldseat]

It doesn't fit their narrative to wait for the facts. They want to maximize the anger and rage.

I wonder if you're as critical of the media when they report the "facts" that police departments put out in the aftermath of theses encounters that often turn out to be lies, distortions and cover-ups of what actually happened. Do you criticize "the media" for trying to sway public opinion or create public outrage at demonstrators in those occasions? Somehow, I don't remember you ever complaining about "the media" doing that.

"The media" in reporting news that has conflicting information is often trying to arrive at the truth of what occurred. That truth is initially often hidden and needs to be brought out through critical analysis of information that is reported. Though it may be messy and there are errors made, "the media" often arrives at that truth and then reports it as such.

To me that is much more preferred than what happens with the conservative news media. What you see from news media on that right is that once a narrative has been created to explain what occurred in a conservative framework, facts and information is either cultivated, elevated or ignored in order to continue to drive that narrative.

 

[Lapaz]

I don't know how you can call Walker's action wanton disregard for life. He was in his own apartment. Legally owned a gun. Had people in plain clothes breaking into his home in the middle of the night without identifying themselves. What exactly are you expectations of him in that situation? To stop and ask who's breaking into his apartment before he shoots? Oh wait, he actually did that. What else should he have done?

The police, by contrast carried out several actions that lead to Walker's response and caused the homicide of Taylor at their hands. This wasn't some tragic accident. They carried out a raid at night on a warrant that should have never been issued, the didn't announce themselves clearly (if at all), when Walker yelled for them to identify themselves, they did not (so he actually did try to identify them). Then they broke in and the shooting started. NONE OF THIS IS THE FAULT OF TAYLOR OR WALKER!

Sorry, but this was a total police fork up and cover up. Not only should heads roll but people should be held criminally responsible. But of course, the won't be.

I read there was a witness that heard them announce themselves, and this happened just after midnight, so most people were asleep. Also, while it may be legal to shoot people inside your house, I think it is wonton disregard for life to do so. I wouldn't start shooting without knowing who I'm shooting. I would tell them to stop or I will shoot. Realistically, Walker didn't ask for them to ID themselves, and Walker said they were aggressively banging on the door, so they didn't immediately break-in. I don't blame Taylor, but I do blame Walker for starting the shootout. I also blame the cop that was shooting from the outside, and he was the one charged. Whether the cops should've been there to search the house is a different matter. I think it was wrong for them to go there in the middle of the night, but once Walker started shooting, he made a fatal error. I don't think there is evidence of a cover-up. That is conspiratorial. The cops made mistakes, but the fatal mistake was Walker's.

 

[MT15]

Oh, look, speaking of trying to inflame without knowing the facts,