House Select Committee Hearings on Jan. 6 (4 Viewers)
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superchuck500
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Only someone with substantial experience in dealing with the conduct of congressional hearings would know if it was common.
I have actually represented congressional witnesses before (two to be precise) and there was communication with the committee’s staff office but not directly with any committee members. But in both instances it was a fairly mundane regulatory issue. I suspect in situations where the issues are more acute and of direct interest to a committee member, direct communication would be expected.
It strikes me as not different than a prosecutor or plaintiff lawyer being in communication with a third-party witness who has testimony favorable to their case - or a defense attorney being in communication with a third-party witness with testimony favorable to the defense. That happens very commonly. And if anything, I’d say a committee situation would more accommodating, not less.
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That is why I asked instead of assuming I already knew the answer.
superchuck500
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If you were to assume you already knew the answer, what do you think it would be?
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Here's the thing, I don't know. My GUESS is that it is at best unethical.
superchuck500
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Communicating with a witness is completely not unethical - and in fact happens quite often in similar contexts so I'm certain it happens in this context. The report makes no claim whatosever about it being inappropriate that Cheney had communications with Hutchinson.
What may be unethical and what the report does make allegations about is that the communication was without Hutchinson's counsel being involved despite the fact that she had counsel. In most contexts, it is unethical for a lawyer to communicate directly with a person who is represented by counsel - without first obtaining the consent of the person's lawyer.
But those rules apply to lawyers in the conduct of their representation of a party to a matter. There is no such rule to apply to parties to a matter . . . in other words, while the lawyer for a company cannot ethically communicate directly with a former employee who has a discrimination suit against the company and is represented by an attorney, there is no such rule about whether someone from the company can communicate with the employee without their attorney present.
While Cheney is a lawyer by background (and thus certainly knows this rule) she hasn't practiced law since 2001 and wasn't acting as a lawyer. She was not counsel to the committee. She was acting as a committee member - and so I don't think the general rule applies. The messages contain some evidence that she stated that she was concerned about speaking with Hutchinson directly without her lawyer present - and then later Hutchinson fired the lawyer. It's possible that Hutchinson responded that she wanted to communicate with Cheney directly and effectively waived her counsel in that regard. In that context, that doesn't strike me as unethical.
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Thanks.
See this is WHY I asked!
superchuck500
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My pleasure -
Another interesting element of this that I didn't mention in the above post about whether communication with a witness is common or unethical is the other allegation - which is that Cheney illegally persuaded Hutchinson to commit perjury (this is called subornation of perjury, 18 USC 1622).
The elements of subornation of perjury here would be that (1) Hutchinson did indeed commit perjury and did for a "corrupt purpose" and (2) Cheney persuaded Hutchinson to do so. In other words, a jury would have to find that Hutchinson's perjury was substantially "procured" by Cheney's efforts . . . or that Hutchinson was materially influenced to commit the perjury by Cheney.
It should be first said that the presentation here by Loudermilk is clearly nothing more than at attempt to make Trump and MAGA happy by feeding their narrative that it's all a false witch hunt and that it's perpetrators like Cheney were lying to America. Notwithstanding that most of what J6 presented was already public, Liz Cheney went to a top 5 law school and worked at various high positions at the State Department and private think tanks for years before coming to Congress. She didn't persuade a federal committee witness to commit perjury on the record.
But she also enjoys clear immunity from any investigation whatsoever under the Speech and Debate clause, the relevant elements of which here are called "legislative immunity". The founders recognized that a president (or judiciary) angered by actions at Congress could use his investigatory and prosecution powers to retaliate against the perpetrating members of Congress. The language is clear that it is not only a privilege from prosecution, but a liberty from "questioning" - which means an evidentiary liberty to refuse to be questioned or respond to subpoena.
The Select Committee was clearly a legislative function and the clause is designed precisely to avoid executive branch retaliation against legislators for activities at Congress. In other words, exactly what Loudermilk is asking DOJ to do. He knows that, he gave some passing comment about the immunity not applying but it clearly does.
Optimus Prime
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Committee 2.0
Curious what their findings will be
Maybe Jim Jordan gets on this one
=========================
House Republicans will continue investigating the January 6 insurrection, attempting to undermine the prior investigation that found Donald Trump responsible and rewrite the narrative about the deadly Capitol siege.
House speaker Mike Johnson announced on Wednesday that a new select subcommittee will be formed to investigate “all events leading up to and after January 6”. The move comes after the president pardoned or commuted sentences for every defendant convicted for their roles in January 6, including those convicted of violence against Capitol police and the leaders of extremist groups.
The pardons, and the repeated attempts to recast January 6 not as a day of violent rioting but as citizens airing grievances who were egged on by federal agents, could lead to further political violence, experts say.
The subcommittee will be chaired by Republican representative Barry Loudermilk of Georgia. In December, a previous version of the committee led by Loudermilk concluded that Liz Cheney should face charges for investigating Trump’s role in January 6. Trump has frequently taken aim at Cheney and his other political enemies. Joe Biden preemptively pardoned Cheney before leaving office on Monday.
Among those involved in the January 6 attack and its supporters, the belief that they were set up and not responsible for their actions is persistent. In recent weeks, they have pointed to a Department of Justice inspector general report that showed 26 informants were at the Capitol that day as evidence they were coerced.
Loudermilk claimed in a statement that January 6 resulted from a “series of intelligence, security, and leadership failures at multiple levels within numerous entities” that he will continue to try to uncover.
Johnson said the subcommittee will “uncover the full truth that is owed to the American people”.
“House Republicans are proud of our work so far in exposing the false narratives peddled by the politically motivated January 6 Select Committee during the 117th Congress, but there is still more work to be done,” Johnson said in a statement.…….
www.theguardian.com
Curious what their findings will be
Maybe Jim Jordan gets on this one
=========================
House Republicans will continue investigating the January 6 insurrection, attempting to undermine the prior investigation that found Donald Trump responsible and rewrite the narrative about the deadly Capitol siege.
House speaker Mike Johnson announced on Wednesday that a new select subcommittee will be formed to investigate “all events leading up to and after January 6”. The move comes after the president pardoned or commuted sentences for every defendant convicted for their roles in January 6, including those convicted of violence against Capitol police and the leaders of extremist groups.
The pardons, and the repeated attempts to recast January 6 not as a day of violent rioting but as citizens airing grievances who were egged on by federal agents, could lead to further political violence, experts say.
The subcommittee will be chaired by Republican representative Barry Loudermilk of Georgia. In December, a previous version of the committee led by Loudermilk concluded that Liz Cheney should face charges for investigating Trump’s role in January 6. Trump has frequently taken aim at Cheney and his other political enemies. Joe Biden preemptively pardoned Cheney before leaving office on Monday.
Among those involved in the January 6 attack and its supporters, the belief that they were set up and not responsible for their actions is persistent. In recent weeks, they have pointed to a Department of Justice inspector general report that showed 26 informants were at the Capitol that day as evidence they were coerced.
Loudermilk claimed in a statement that January 6 resulted from a “series of intelligence, security, and leadership failures at multiple levels within numerous entities” that he will continue to try to uncover.
Johnson said the subcommittee will “uncover the full truth that is owed to the American people”.
“House Republicans are proud of our work so far in exposing the false narratives peddled by the politically motivated January 6 Select Committee during the 117th Congress, but there is still more work to be done,” Johnson said in a statement.…….
House Republicans form new January 6 panel in attempt to undercut past inquiry
Mike Johnson says party has ‘exposed the false narratives’ of the attack but that ‘there is still more work to be done’
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Committee 2.0
Curious what their findings will be
Maybe Jim Jordan gets on this one
=========================
House Republicans will continue investigating the January 6 insurrection, attempting to undermine the prior investigation that found Donald Trump responsible and rewrite the narrative about the deadly Capitol siege.
House speaker Mike Johnson announced on Wednesday that a new select subcommittee will be formed to investigate “all events leading up to and after January 6”. The move comes after the president pardoned or commuted sentences for every defendant convicted for their roles in January 6, including those convicted of violence against Capitol police and the leaders of extremist groups.
The pardons, and the repeated attempts to recast January 6 not as a day of violent rioting but as citizens airing grievances who were egged on by federal agents, could lead to further political violence, experts say.
The subcommittee will be chaired by Republican representative Barry Loudermilk of Georgia. In December, a previous version of the committee led by Loudermilk concluded that Liz Cheney should face charges for investigating Trump’s role in January 6. Trump has frequently taken aim at Cheney and his other political enemies. Joe Biden preemptively pardoned Cheney before leaving office on Monday.
Among those involved in the January 6 attack and its supporters, the belief that they were set up and not responsible for their actions is persistent. In recent weeks, they have pointed to a Department of Justice inspector general report that showed 26 informants were at the Capitol that day as evidence they were coerced.
Loudermilk claimed in a statement that January 6 resulted from a “series of intelligence, security, and leadership failures at multiple levels within numerous entities” that he will continue to try to uncover.
Johnson said the subcommittee will “uncover the full truth that is owed to the American people”.
“House Republicans are proud of our work so far in exposing the false narratives peddled by the politically motivated January 6 Select Committee during the 117th Congress, but there is still more work to be done,” Johnson said in a statement.…….
House Republicans form new January 6 panel in attempt to undercut past inquiry
Mike Johnson says party has ‘exposed the false narratives’ of the attack but that ‘there is still more work to be done’
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your own eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.....
DJ1BigTymer
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They are, LITERALLY, rewriting history. Next, they will unimpeach trump....TWICE!Committee 2.0
Curious what their findings will be
Maybe Jim Jordan gets on this one
=========================
House Republicans will continue investigating the January 6 insurrection, attempting to undermine the prior investigation that found Donald Trump responsible and rewrite the narrative about the deadly Capitol siege.
House speaker Mike Johnson announced on Wednesday that a new select subcommittee will be formed to investigate “all events leading up to and after January 6”. The move comes after the president pardoned or commuted sentences for every defendant convicted for their roles in January 6, including those convicted of violence against Capitol police and the leaders of extremist groups.
The pardons, and the repeated attempts to recast January 6 not as a day of violent rioting but as citizens airing grievances who were egged on by federal agents, could lead to further political violence, experts say.
The subcommittee will be chaired by Republican representative Barry Loudermilk of Georgia. In December, a previous version of the committee led by Loudermilk concluded that Liz Cheney should face charges for investigating Trump’s role in January 6. Trump has frequently taken aim at Cheney and his other political enemies. Joe Biden preemptively pardoned Cheney before leaving office on Monday.
Among those involved in the January 6 attack and its supporters, the belief that they were set up and not responsible for their actions is persistent. In recent weeks, they have pointed to a Department of Justice inspector general report that showed 26 informants were at the Capitol that day as evidence they were coerced.
Loudermilk claimed in a statement that January 6 resulted from a “series of intelligence, security, and leadership failures at multiple levels within numerous entities” that he will continue to try to uncover.
Johnson said the subcommittee will “uncover the full truth that is owed to the American people”.
“House Republicans are proud of our work so far in exposing the false narratives peddled by the politically motivated January 6 Select Committee during the 117th Congress, but there is still more work to be done,” Johnson said in a statement.…….
House Republicans form new January 6 panel in attempt to undercut past inquiry
Mike Johnson says party has ‘exposed the false narratives’ of the attack but that ‘there is still more work to be done’
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MT15
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That’s actually not off the table, I don’t think.
Loudermilk is a liar, period.Committee 2.0
Curious what their findings will be
Maybe Jim Jordan gets on this one
=========================
House Republicans will continue investigating the January 6 insurrection, attempting to undermine the prior investigation that found Donald Trump responsible and rewrite the narrative about the deadly Capitol siege.
House speaker Mike Johnson announced on Wednesday that a new select subcommittee will be formed to investigate “all events leading up to and after January 6”. The move comes after the president pardoned or commuted sentences for every defendant convicted for their roles in January 6, including those convicted of violence against Capitol police and the leaders of extremist groups.
The pardons, and the repeated attempts to recast January 6 not as a day of violent rioting but as citizens airing grievances who were egged on by federal agents, could lead to further political violence, experts say.
The subcommittee will be chaired by Republican representative Barry Loudermilk of Georgia. In December, a previous version of the committee led by Loudermilk concluded that Liz Cheney should face charges for investigating Trump’s role in January 6. Trump has frequently taken aim at Cheney and his other political enemies. Joe Biden preemptively pardoned Cheney before leaving office on Monday.
Among those involved in the January 6 attack and its supporters, the belief that they were set up and not responsible for their actions is persistent. In recent weeks, they have pointed to a Department of Justice inspector general report that showed 26 informants were at the Capitol that day as evidence they were coerced.
Loudermilk claimed in a statement that January 6 resulted from a “series of intelligence, security, and leadership failures at multiple levels within numerous entities” that he will continue to try to uncover.
Johnson said the subcommittee will “uncover the full truth that is owed to the American people”.
“House Republicans are proud of our work so far in exposing the false narratives peddled by the politically motivated January 6 Select Committee during the 117th Congress, but there is still more work to be done,” Johnson said in a statement.…….
House Republicans form new January 6 panel in attempt to undercut past inquiry
Mike Johnson says party has ‘exposed the false narratives’ of the attack but that ‘there is still more work to be done’
DaveXA
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Committee 2.0
Curious what their findings will be
Maybe Jim Jordan gets on this one
=========================
House Republicans will continue investigating the January 6 insurrection, attempting to undermine the prior investigation that found Donald Trump responsible and rewrite the narrative about the deadly Capitol siege.
House speaker Mike Johnson announced on Wednesday that a new select subcommittee will be formed to investigate “all events leading up to and after January 6”. The move comes after the president pardoned or commuted sentences for every defendant convicted for their roles in January 6, including those convicted of violence against Capitol police and the leaders of extremist groups.
The pardons, and the repeated attempts to recast January 6 not as a day of violent rioting but as citizens airing grievances who were egged on by federal agents, could lead to further political violence, experts say.
The subcommittee will be chaired by Republican representative Barry Loudermilk of Georgia. In December, a previous version of the committee led by Loudermilk concluded that Liz Cheney should face charges for investigating Trump’s role in January 6. Trump has frequently taken aim at Cheney and his other political enemies. Joe Biden preemptively pardoned Cheney before leaving office on Monday.
Among those involved in the January 6 attack and its supporters, the belief that they were set up and not responsible for their actions is persistent. In recent weeks, they have pointed to a Department of Justice inspector general report that showed 26 informants were at the Capitol that day as evidence they were coerced.
Loudermilk claimed in a statement that January 6 resulted from a “series of intelligence, security, and leadership failures at multiple levels within numerous entities” that he will continue to try to uncover.
Johnson said the subcommittee will “uncover the full truth that is owed to the American people”.
“House Republicans are proud of our work so far in exposing the false narratives peddled by the politically motivated January 6 Select Committee during the 117th Congress, but there is still more work to be done,” Johnson said in a statement.…….
House Republicans form new January 6 panel in attempt to undercut past inquiry
Mike Johnson says party has ‘exposed the false narratives’ of the attack but that ‘there is still more work to be done’
Basically an investigation to whitewash what happened on 1/6. That is all.
Optimus Prime
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An aide to House Speaker Mike Johnsonstepped in to advise Republicans against issuing a subpoena to former White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson for fear that it might expose sexual texts lawmakers sent her, according to The Washington Post.
Hutchinson, a former Trump loyalist who worked for his chief of staff, gave sensational evidence to the congressional committee on the January 6 riot.
She testified that Trump wanted to join his supporters marching on the Capitol, and she claimed that he believed – but did not care – that some of them were armed.
Now Republicans are trying to establish their own counter-narrative about the riot with a new investigation.
They had discussed calling Hutchinson to testify again but, according to The Post, were advised not to by an aide to the Speaker.
Republican Rep. Barry Loudermilk had suggested in public that a subpoena be issued for Hutchinson.
However, an aide to Johnson warned Loudermilk’s staff that several colleagues had shared concerns that “sexual texts from members who were trying to engage in sexual favors” with Hutchinson could be shared publicly, correspondence from the time reveals, according to the paper.
It was not immediately clear who those lawmakers supposedly are or what was in the alleged text messages.…..
www.independent.co.uk
Hutchinson, a former Trump loyalist who worked for his chief of staff, gave sensational evidence to the congressional committee on the January 6 riot.
She testified that Trump wanted to join his supporters marching on the Capitol, and she claimed that he believed – but did not care – that some of them were armed.
Now Republicans are trying to establish their own counter-narrative about the riot with a new investigation.
They had discussed calling Hutchinson to testify again but, according to The Post, were advised not to by an aide to the Speaker.
Republican Rep. Barry Loudermilk had suggested in public that a subpoena be issued for Hutchinson.
However, an aide to Johnson warned Loudermilk’s staff that several colleagues had shared concerns that “sexual texts from members who were trying to engage in sexual favors” with Hutchinson could be shared publicly, correspondence from the time reveals, according to the paper.
It was not immediately clear who those lawmakers supposedly are or what was in the alleged text messages.…..
Speaker’s aide advised against subpoena for Cassidy Hutchinson: report
Aide to Speaker Mike Johnson reportedly feared the exposure of ‘sexual texts from members who were trying to engage in sexual favors’ with Hutchinson, a former Trump loyalist who had testified about the January 6 riot
www.independent.co.uk- Thread starter
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barbar
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That's absolutely pathetic. As someone who claims to be a born-again follower of Christ, Mike Johnson should want those texts exposed to help rid our government of sexual immorality, right?
My mom goes to church with him and LOOOVES him. whatever.... he's just a pushover for Trump...looking for that nugget of scraps Trump will give him if he is a good boy.
My mom goes to church with him and LOOOVES him. whatever.... he's just a pushover for Trump...looking for that nugget of scraps Trump will give him if he is a good boy.
barbar
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Optimus Prime
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WASHINGTON — The threats are back.
Since President Donald Trump issued sweeping pardons — along with 14 communications — on Monday for the roughly 1,500 people convicted of storming the U.S. Capitol and attacking law enforcement four years ago, there’s been an uptick in threats to the members who served on the January 6 Select Committee.
"Well, already the crazy calls have started coming back," a former member of the committee told Raw Story. The member is not being named due to safety concerns.
"Are you getting threats?" Raw Story asked.
"Oh yeah,” the member said. “Several members have indicated that since the pardon that they're getting, 'Hey, we're gonna come get you now' and that kind of thing."
"So has your office gotten them?" Raw Story inquired.
"Oh, yeah," they said.
"Does that worry you though?" Raw Story pressed.
"Personal safety is a concern, I think, for a lot of people," the committee member continued. "It puts the public at risk when you put people who have been convicted of assaulting law enforcement back on the streets and you kind of embolden the conduct that they did, like it was somehow okay? So you legitimize bad behavior by people who broke into the Capitol and did all kinds of crazy stuff."
While the former select committee member doesn’t think the threats are coming from those who’ve been pardoned, they’re bracing for what’s to come.
"Some of the folks that he pardoned are still a clear and present danger to the public, members of Congress, staff here on the Hill," the committee member said. "Some of them, as you know, have already publicly said that they're not going to change.”............
Since President Donald Trump issued sweeping pardons — along with 14 communications — on Monday for the roughly 1,500 people convicted of storming the U.S. Capitol and attacking law enforcement four years ago, there’s been an uptick in threats to the members who served on the January 6 Select Committee.
"Well, already the crazy calls have started coming back," a former member of the committee told Raw Story. The member is not being named due to safety concerns.
"Are you getting threats?" Raw Story asked.
"Oh yeah,” the member said. “Several members have indicated that since the pardon that they're getting, 'Hey, we're gonna come get you now' and that kind of thing."
"So has your office gotten them?" Raw Story inquired.
"Oh, yeah," they said.
"Does that worry you though?" Raw Story pressed.
"Personal safety is a concern, I think, for a lot of people," the committee member continued. "It puts the public at risk when you put people who have been convicted of assaulting law enforcement back on the streets and you kind of embolden the conduct that they did, like it was somehow okay? So you legitimize bad behavior by people who broke into the Capitol and did all kinds of crazy stuff."
While the former select committee member doesn’t think the threats are coming from those who’ve been pardoned, they’re bracing for what’s to come.
"Some of the folks that he pardoned are still a clear and present danger to the public, members of Congress, staff here on the Hill," the committee member said. "Some of them, as you know, have already publicly said that they're not going to change.”............
'Crazy calls have started': J6 committee members flooded with threats after Trump pardons
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