Durham investigation (Update: Sussman acquitted) (16 Viewers)

[SaintForLife]

It looks like the first shoe has dropped with the Durham investigation with the Clinesmith plea deal. Clinesmith wasn't a low level FBI employee involved in the Crossfire Hurricane investigation.

He worked with Strzok to arrange sending an FBI agent into Trump-Flynn briefing, was on the Mueller team, he took part in the Papadopoulos interviews, and he participated in the FISA process.



From the NYT article:

Ex-F.B.I. Lawyer Expected to Plead Guilty in Review of Russia Inquiry (Published 2020)

Prosecutors did not reveal any evidence of the kind of broad anti-Trump conspiracy among law enforcement officials that the president has long alleged.

www.nytimes.com

I wonder who else knew about the lies?

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

I don't really follow this story that closely because it's trivial in the grand scheme of things but... just so you know allegations in a complaint are not evidence.

 

[MT15]

Sussman, Joffe, & Marc Elias spent weeks coordinating their efforts with the Clinton Campaign deciding how to use this information to 'demonstrate' secret communications between Trump & the Russians.

Sussman billed his time on the project to the Clinton Campaign. Including billing them for a meeting with Fusion GPS to coordinate it's usage in opposition research materials.
Steele met with Sussman on this day, in the same or a different meeting.

Sussman continued to bill the Clinton Campaign for their oppo research efforts on the Alfa Bank story.

Sussman met with Elias, Fusion GPS, experts & reporters regarding the false white paper. And billed it to Hillary Clinton's campaign.

SFL - what you are quoting is a Durham filing, is it not?

yet, I do not believe Durham has charged anything about these allegations of a conspiracy and in fact these allegations were made without providing proof, if what I am reading is correct. His allegations have often had nothing to do with the case he was filing about, from what I am reading. He’s been criticized a bit for his sensational filings where he spins all sorts of conspiracies without proof.

So, what you posted is just Durham’s empty words.

 

[UriUT]

So while we have this “serious” investigation on hunter biden and this special counsel, there are real allegations towards a family of trump that had real consequences in US policy. Remember the brutal killing of an American journalist. Recall the crown prince unexpectedly, due in part to American intelligence, arrested and at times tortured those in the Saudi government who were considered the opposition. And think back to the time when a small Middle East country faced embargos and existential danger from its neighbor. Yet after a certain investment to the tune of a billion dollars, which initially was presented as Canadian, where this trump family member had his cash sink 666 building removed from his portfolio, that Mid East country was saved.

Finally this was revealed today.

Before Giving Billions to Jared Kushner, Saudi Investment Fund Had Big Doubts (Published 2022)

Before committing $2 billion to Mr. Kushner’s fledgling firm, officials at a fund led by the Saudi crown prince questioned taking such a big risk.

www.nytimes.com

But Robert Weissman, president of the nonprofit group Public Citizen, called Mr. Kushner’s relationship with the Saudis “extremely troubling,” arguing that his stance toward the kingdom’s leadership as a senior adviser “makes the business partnership appear even more to be both a reward to, and an investment in, Kushner.”

And also recently, there are reports that there are missing records of gifts by foreign governments in the pence and trump logs. To contrast this, staff during obamas time had panic attacks and reported it to superiors when they found bags full of jewelry when in Saudi Arabia.

So while this fancy investigation goes on and on and on an on without clear results, we have kushner reaping benefits from some disturbing “policies” contrary to American interests. A great distraction I’d say.

 

[coldseat]

When is this investigation ending? It feels like it's been going on for over a decade with very little of substance. Durham needs to stop grifting off the government by keeping his never ending investigation going.

 

[FullMonte]

Yes that's correct. I'm specifically referring to the Trump Russia collusion narrative. Durham has claimed it was created by Hillary's team and disseminated to the media, FBI, CIA, OIG through attorneys to try to use attorneys client privilege as cover for their illegal activities. I'm not saying Russia didn't interfere with our election although their actions were greatly exaggerated.

Natalia Veselnitskaya was the Russia lawyer at the Trump Towe meeting. She was also a client of Fusion GPS who helped assemble the Steele Dossier. Veselnitskaya also met with GPS Fusion before and after the Trump Tower meeting.

A witness told Mueller that Veselnitskaya loved Hillary Clinton:

Special Counsel Mueller Investigation Records Part 12

vault.fbi.gov

I don't think sanctions were discussed.

Ok...so, the claim that Trump's campaign was conspiring with Russia was created by Hillary's team, but....we know for a fact that members of Trump's campaign met with who they thought was a Russian government lawyer offering them dirt on Hillary.

So, I take it that your position is that Hillary's team completely made up a story that Trump's campaign was conspiring with Russia...but they were incredibly lucky in that members of Trump's campaign were actually conspiring with Russia.

As for discussing sanctions on Russia. Here is an article from 2017 where Sean Spicer says that the meeting was to discuss adoptions. There are sanctions on Russia that relate to american families adopting Russian children.

Sean Spicer still thinks Trump Jr. met with Russians because of adoption

Vox is a general interest news site for the 21st century. Its mission: to help everyone understand our complicated world, so that we can all help shape it. In text, video and audio, our reporters explain politics, policy, world affairs, technology, culture, science, the climate crisis, money...

www.vox.com

As for the woman being a client of Fusion GPS, that's not the least bit relevant. The only thing that is relevant in this issue is what the members of Trump's campaign thought she was. They thought she was an attorney for the Russian government, and they thought she was offering them dirt on Hillary.

 

[Taurus]

When is this investigation ending? It feels like it's been going on for over a decade with very little of substance. Durham needs to stop grifting off the government by keeping his never ending investigation going.

This whole episode is the result of the Dems inability to speak clearly and the Reps skill at confusion.

The very basics are that the FBI was listening in on Russian phone calls, as is their custom, when what do you know there were Trump campaign people on the other end of those calls.
So the Feds followed up on that, as they're supposed to do.

 

[V Chip]

It's funny that people still believe that Hillary hired people to create what became the Steele Dossier...

The Steele Dossier origin was Republican opposition research, funded by Paul Singer and the Washington Free Beacon. After they stopped funding, the DNC picked up on the same research and began funding it. Steele wasn't on the research then but picked up where the original research by Fusion GPS led.

 

[SaintForLife]

Ok...so, the claim that Trump's campaign was conspiring with Russia was created by Hillary's team, but....we know for a fact that members of Trump's campaign met with who they thought was a Russian government lawyer offering them dirt on Hillary.

So, I take it that your position is that Hillary's team completely made up a story that Trump's campaign was conspiring with Russia...but they were incredibly lucky in that members of Trump's campaign were actually conspiring with Russia.

As for discussing sanctions on Russia. Here is an article from 2017 where Sean Spicer says that the meeting was to discuss adoptions. There are sanctions on Russia that relate to american families adopting Russian children.

Sean Spicer still thinks Trump Jr. met with Russians because of adoption

Vox is a general interest news site for the 21st century. Its mission: to help everyone understand our complicated world, so that we can all help shape it. In text, video and audio, our reporters explain politics, policy, world affairs, technology, culture, science, the climate crisis, money...

www.vox.com

As for the woman being a client of Fusion GPS, that's not the least bit relevant. The only thing that is relevant in this issue is what the members of Trump's campaign thought she was. They thought she was an attorney for the Russian government, and they thought she was offering them dirt on Hillary.

Trying to get information from the Russian lawyer isn't evidence of collusion. I realize that's the last thing to try to use for examples of collusion because most of the other ones have fallen flat or been debunked.

I stated after your post that I misunderstood what you meant by sanctions and I was already aware that the Magnitsky Act was discussed.

As I said earlier, what's ironic is that it was actually Hillary ,through her lawyers, who was the one who actually colluded with Russia. Russian Igor Danchenko collaborated with long time Clinton ally Charles Dolan to create the BS Steele Dossier(Clinton Dossier).

Obama was told by Brennan about Hillary's plan to cook up the Trump Russia collusion.

CIA told Obama of claim Hillary Clinton conjured Trump-Russia scandal: spy chief

Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe on Tuesday revealed a bombshell allegation that Hillary Clinton ordered “a campaign plan to stir up a scandal” by linking President Trump to Russia …

nypost.com

Hillary was ultimately responsible for the creation of the Trump Russia collusion, Steele Dossier, Alfa hoax, Trump using Russian phones BS. It's actually very relevant considering that since the company Hillary hired to create the Steele Dossier was coordinating with the Russian lawyer by meeting her before and after the meeting.

 

[SaintForLife]

It's funny that people still believe that Hillary hired people to create what became the Steele Dossier...

The Steele Dossier origin was Republican opposition research, funded by Paul Singer and the Washington Free Beacon. After they stopped funding, the DNC picked up on the same research and began funding it. Steele wasn't on the research then but picked up where the original research by Fusion GPS led.

How could the Steele Dossier have been started before Steele was involved? It was all made up or taken from already public reporting from Igor Danchenko and Clinton ally Charles Dolan.

It was normal opposition research until Hillary took over and they hired Steele. Can you show that any of the original opposition research before Steele made it on to the Dossier?

 

[SaintForLife]

This whole episode is the result of the Dems inability to speak clearly and the Reps skill at confusion.

The very basics are that the FBI was listening in on Russian phone calls, as is their custom, when what do you know there were Trump campaign people on the other end of those calls.
So the Feds followed up on that, as they're supposed to do.

The FBI was able to listen in on those phone calls because of the made up Clinton Dossier that was included in the fraudulent FISA warrants.

 

[V Chip]

How could the Steele Dossier have been started before Steele was involved? It was all made up or taken from already public reporting from Igor Danchenko and Clinton ally Charles Dolan.

It was normal opposition research until Hillary took over and they hired Steele. Can you show that any of the original opposition research before Steele made it on to the Dossier?

The whole of the Fusion GPS research became known as the Steele Dossier, but it wasn't exclusively research done by Steele.

I mean as much as you obsess over it, I figured you would already know this. Interesting that you didn't.

 

[SaintForLife]

When is this investigation ending? It feels like it's been going on for over a decade with very little of substance. Durham needs to stop grifting off the government by keeping his never ending investigation going.

It's been going on for a while due to two main factors. Hillary and her lawyers used attorney client privilege to hide their illegal actions so it has taken a while for Durham to fight in court to get those records which he did and is trying to get more. Also Covid allowed all the people he needed to interview to delay their interviews or testimonies.

 

[V Chip]

It was normal opposition research until Hillary took over and they hired Steele. Can you show that any of the original opposition research before Steele made it on to the Dossier?

Seriously, this stuff has been known for a LONG time... and yet you didn't know this?

"Early on, Fusion’s probe of Trump was given a huge boost by Wayne Barrett, an investigative reporter for the Village Voice. Barrett, who was suffering from a terminal illness, bequeathed his voluminous files on Trump to the firm. His findings opened up Trump’s past dealings, including tax and bankruptcy problems, potential ties to organized crime, and numerous legal entanglements. They also revealed that Trump had an unusually high number of connections to Russians with questionable backgrounds. As his son Don, Jr., boasted in 2008, Russians “make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of a lot of our assets.” (Trump denied having any business ties to Russia during his campaign, but, later, his former lawyer Michael Cohen admitted that Trump’s associates were trying to negotiate a deal for him in Moscow at the time. The business angle was one of the subjects on which Steele’s dossier was prescient.)

The more the Fusion team learned, the more alarmed it grew. By the spring of 2016, Simpson and Fritsch write, they were no longer just in it for the money. They were convinced they needed “to do what they could to keep Trump out of the White House.”

For months, Fusion GPS gathered information about Trump, focusing on his business and entertainment activities. When Trump became the presumptive nominee on May 3, 2016, the conservative donor stopped funding the research on him

in March 2016, Fusion GPS approached Perkins Coie and, knowing the Clinton campaign and the DNC were its clients, inquired whether its clients wished to pay Fusion GPS "to continue research regarding then-presidential candidate Donald Trump, research that Fusion GPS had conducted for one or more other clients during the Republican primary contest. In April 2016, Elias [from Perkins Coie] hired Fusion GPS to perform opposition research on Trump.

In June 2016, as part of its work for Perkins Coie, Fusion GPS hired Orbis Business Intelligence, a private British intelligence firm, to look into connections between Trump and Russia. Orbis co-founder Christopher Steele, a retired British MI6 officer with expertise in Russian matters, was hired as a subcontractor to do the job.

Before the DNC and Hillary were even contacted, Fusion GPS had information on Trump's business ties to Russia that were lied about by those involved and those were being investigated more before the Republican funding was withdrawn. Steele wasn't even hired until months after this information was already known.

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

SFL still obessing over Hillary in 2022? Maybe if she had one tenth the sway over the DNC as Trump had over the GOP then... okay.

 

[cuddlemonkey]

Trying to get information from the Russian lawyer isn't evidence of collusion. I realize that's the last thing to try to use for examples of collusion because most of the other ones have fallen flat or been debunked.

I stated after your post that I misunderstood what you meant by sanctions and I was already aware that the Magnitsky Act was discussed.

As I said earlier, what's ironic is that it was actually Hillary ,through her lawyers, who was the one who actually colluded with Russia. Russian Igor Danchenko collaborated with long time Clinton ally Charles Dolan to create the BS Steele Dossier(Clinton Dossier).

Obama was told by Brennan about Hillary's plan to cook up the Trump Russia collusion.

CIA told Obama of claim Hillary Clinton conjured Trump-Russia scandal: spy chief

Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe on Tuesday revealed a bombshell allegation that Hillary Clinton ordered “a campaign plan to stir up a scandal” by linking President Trump to Russia …

nypost.com

Hillary was ultimately responsible for the creation of the Trump Russia collusion, Steele Dossier, Alfa hoax, Trump using Russian phones BS. It's actually very relevant considering that since the company Hillary hired to create the Steele Dossier was coordinating with the Russian lawyer by meeting her before and after the meeting.

"Trying to collude isn't evidence of collusion" is a weird hair to split.

 

[RebSaint]

This thing will have a longer shelf life than butteremails.
I'm also not at all surprised that Trump (and the alt-right's) connection to Russia and Putin is all one giant conspiracy that includes All of the following: The Democratic Party!!!!!! Big Tech!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Media!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They're all in on censoring the Truth with a capital T. I mean, it's so simple, right? The Real [tm] connection between Putin is with the Democrats, not Trump or anybody affiliated with him.
This crap is beyond just absurd and landing into tin-foil, fantasy-land.

 

[Farb]

Trump created "the Russiagate BS" by peddling dictator Putin day and night.

End of story.

Fact be damn, am I right! It is Trump after all, he has to be guilty, the media has told you this over and over, they would never cover up something for the benefit of the democratic party.

 

[Farb]

I don't really follow this story that closely because it's trivial in the grand scheme of things but... just so you know allegations in a complaint are not evidence.

Indeed, We learned that in all the impeachments of Trump.