All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (6 Viewers)

[Maxp]

I fear we are really going to be in a bad place due to the obvious cuts to the federal agencies that deal with infectious disease, but also the negative effect the Affordable Care act has had on non urban hospitals. Our front line defenses are ineffectual and our ability to treat the populous is probably at an all time low. Factor in the cost of healthcare and I can see our system crashing. What do you think about the politics of this virus?

 

[JimEverett]

I guess it depends on how much the Republicans want to be identified as a law and order party.

I am sure there are plenty Republicans calling the police on their neighbors as well.

I see it around here -a very REpublican county.

More than 5 people having a cookout in a backyard and I don't think they are family - call the police.

People going to Lowe's for flowers???? - The police should stop that.

I saw some kids walking together down the street - call the police.

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

I am sure there are plenty Republicans calling the police on their neighbors as well.

Probably, however (and I may be wrong), on this particular issue, it appears to be Republican aligned political leaders, or at least those more closely associated with Trump, who appear to be either outright calling on people to break local laws or at least publicly support those who are. I'm not too aware of Democratic or liberal aligned groups calling on people to break this particular law.

I'm on the record as generally being against the over-criminalization of lots of actions, and heavy police involvement. And my inclination is to not support tip lines for misdemeanors, including this. I think occasional police patrols to break up and fine egregious violations is more my preferred style.

But this is definitely in keeping with a tradition of other government-citizen crime prevention initiatives.

Also, I'm a big believer in civil disobedience. But a big part of civil disobedience is believing in your cause enough to go to jail over it, pay high fines and so on.

 

[RobF]

Almost all of the countries of Western Europe are showing signs of the virus waning except Sweden, Netherlands and the UK. I don't know what is going on with the Netherlands, but the UK was very late to implement precautions, and Sweden still hasn't fully implemented precautions.

The Netherlands thought they could take a herd immunity approach initially, which morphed into an 'intelligent lockdown.' So similar to the UK to some extent. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52135814

 

[Heathen]

Oooohhhh, there are some kids playing basketball outside- quick, call the police!

How many people are calling the police on kids playing basketball vs. how many are gathering together and having protests during a pandemic and what are the ramifications of each in comparison?

I think it's obvious that one is at this point in time a much more dangerous endeavor.

It's pretty shocking that not all of us can agree on that. It seems to me common sense.

 

[Heathen]

I am sure there are plenty Republicans calling the police on their neighbors as well.

I see it around here -a very REpublican county.

More than 5 people having a cookout in a backyard and I don't think they are family - call the police.

People going to Lowe's for flowers???? - The police should stop that.

I saw some kids walking together down the street - call the police.

That's interesting. I live in a pretty heavily democratic city and do not notice that. It's pretty low key, but there's hardly anyone out also. Just anecdotal of course.

 

[dtc]

What's happening here?

20 years ago, if Bush or Reagan had told us there was a virus and we needed to stay inside, it would have been our patriotic duty and everyone would have been on board. It's like we've lost our freaking minds with all the nonsense going on.

 

[JimEverett]

What's happening here?

20 years ago, if Bush or Reagan had told us there was a virus and we needed to stay inside, it would have been our patriotic duty and everyone would have been on board. It's like we've lost our freaking minds with all the nonsense going on.

Well, remember - there was a small but very vocal set of people who thought Reagan was soft on the USSR.

 

[wardorican]

Except when the protesters are not 'far right', like in California?
https://www.dailywire.com/news/fed-up-california-county-that-went-for-clinton-protests-lockdown

I realize I'm late to the party, but are you suggesting that every single person in a county has to vote the same way? That a 'liberal' county can't have non liberal protesters? I don't see anything on anyone suggesting a political allegiance. That's some weak connecting the dots by the Daily Wire.

I don't think the whole "don't make me stay home" crowd is just tea party conservatives, but I'd wager a lot are. I'm sure some Bernie bros are in there too, but I don't see many of them standing outside the Michigan Capital locked and loaded.

 

[wardorican]

Enlisting citizens to turn in their friends, family members and neighbors is a hallmark of authoritarian regimes, isn't it?

And neighborhood watch groups.

Is that right?

Yep, along with "if you see something, say something", and so on. The government has always enlisted citizens to report crimes.

I actually probably like the practice less than you do, but I'm not sure this is a huge step towards an authoritarian regime.

Let's put it another way...Friends, family members and neighbors putting others in danger of unnecessary sickness is the definition of patriotic, right?

Oooohhhh, there are some kids playing basketball outside- quick, call the police!

I guess it depends on how much the Republicans want to be identified as a law and order party.

It's Time for Police to Start Snitching

Communities of color are actually disproportionately likely to report crimes—it’s police themselves who have maintained a corrosive culture of silence.

www.theatlantic.com

If You See Something, Say Something® | Homeland Security

www.dhs.gov

Why ‘He Should Have Just Complied’ Does Not Apply to Stephon Clark

Since reporting Tuesday night on the shooting death of Stephon Clark at the hands of the Sacramento Police Department, I have gotten many of the same responses from people both on Twitter and in the comments section on The Root.

www.theroot.com

This whole exchange is kind of tragically funny.

We need to encourage snitching.. if you see something say something. He should have complied.

It's easy to be on the side of law and order, and complying with lawful orders when it's not you, or when the "perp" isn't white.

All of these whiny paramilitary wannabe's crying about not being able to get a hair cut should just grab a pair of clipper and give themselves a high and tight.

 

[wardorican]

What's happening here?

20 years ago, if Bush or Reagan had told us there was a virus and we needed to stay inside, it would have been our patriotic duty and everyone would have been on board. It's like we've lost our freaking minds with all the nonsense going on.

It's because a lot of people aren't patriotic. They're fake and selfish. They feign love of country, but what they love is not having to be responsible for anything.

 

[JimEverett]

It's because a lot of people aren't patriotic. They're fake and selfish. They feign love of country, but what they love is not having to be responsible for anything.

That is easy to say when your family has not enough food to eat and the bills are paid. I am sure most of the people protesting are political activists, but there are a lot of people who want this lockdown to end so they don't lose their house and have to go on welfare.

 

[wardorican]

That is easy to say when your family has not enough food to eat and the bills are paid. I am sure most of the people protesting are political activists, but there are a lot of people who want this lockdown to end so they don't lose their house and have to go on welfare.

It's not that easy for me to say. I've been part time laid off. I'll be seeing a significant hit and have to go on unemployment, and hope they don't take weeks to figure it out. sure, we'll have our bills paid and food on the table, but only if we're careful.

While, it may have not been a lot, that 'stimulus' payment would help a lot of folks. I mean, for us, with two working adults and one child under 17, it was $2900. That covers at least a month of bills for us, and we're in expensive arse south Florida.

And I know folks are struggling. I've been doing the little I can with a few I know, but now I'm partially in their boat too. Not as bad, but not great.

I'm all for reopening some aspects of the economy, but I'm a stickler on the how. What protections will be put in place for air travel? for example.

 

[dtc]

That is easy to say when your family has not enough food to eat and the bills are paid. I am sure most of the people protesting are political activists, but there are a lot of people who want this lockdown to end so they don't lose their house and have to go on welfare.

Those same people are being given money hand over fist. In fact, anyone poor enough to be on the verge of losing their house ust been given 600 per week plus $1200 and unemployment. Someone on the verge is making more money in the short term than they were a month ago.

It does suck to not be able to work. Trust me. I'm losing money hand over fist, but these activists are being stupid and crazy. They're risking their lives and the wellbeing of others in order to prosecute some stupid point about freedom.

And the worst thing is, it's all just stupidity that would hever have occurred on this scale were it not for the delusional conspiracy nonsense coming from Trump and the right-wing media.

It's become a contination of butteremails, black muslim president, and Whitewater and it's painful to watch.

 

[not2rich]

That is easy to say when your family has not enough food to eat and the bills are paid. I am sure most of the people protesting are political activists, but there are a lot of people who want this lockdown to end so they don't lose their house and have to go on welfare.

I think we all get that, but regardless of state or local orders, the economy can't really start to get going again until people who can afford not to not expose themselves unnecessarily can feel safe putting themselves in high risk exposure situations. Speaking for myself, if I feel like the virus is essentially running rampant and the government isn't properly containing or mitigating it, I'm not going to engage in activities that involve an unreasonable risk of infection, nor am I going to be in close contact with my elderly parents since I could unknowingly infect them.

I agree that the "lockdowns" aren't sustainable beyond a few weeks, but that's why there needs to be a unified message from government for a reasonable, careful reopening. And we're not getting that.

Quite bluntly, if the concern of conservatives is to help the newly unemployed, they should be pushing the Federal government to shovel as much money out of the door to not only small businesses and individuals, but also the state governments and hospitals. If the concern is protect both the economy and public health, that's the only way.

 

[Beach Friends]

It's Time for Police to Start Snitching

Communities of color are actually disproportionately likely to report crimes—it’s police themselves who have maintained a corrosive culture of silence.

www.theatlantic.com

If You See Something, Say Something® | Homeland Security

www.dhs.gov

Why ‘He Should Have Just Complied’ Does Not Apply to Stephon Clark

Since reporting Tuesday night on the shooting death of Stephon Clark at the hands of the Sacramento Police Department, I have gotten many of the same responses from people both on Twitter and in the comments section on The Root.

www.theroot.com

This whole exchange is kind of tragically funny.

We need to encourage snitching.. if you see something say something. He should have complied.

It's easy to be on the side of law and order, and complying with lawful orders when it's not you, or when the "perp" isn't white.

All of these whiny paramilitary wannabe's crying about not being able to get a hair cut should just grab a pair of clipper and give themselves a high and tight.

Ward, I am not really sure what you went to such lengths to prove here. Unless one is trying to show the price we pay when the media acts too hastily in covering police related shootings, the Stephon Clark case is a poor choice.

I don't want to get derailed off the topic too far, but there was a detailed investigation of that shooting and the evidence strongly suggests that was a tragic case of suicide by cop.

 

[Dragon]

Coronavirus patients taking hydroxychloroquine, a treatment touted by President Trump, were no less likely to need mechanical ventilation and had higher deaths rates compared to those who did not take the drug, according to a study of hundreds of patients at US Veterans Health Administration medical centers.
The study, which reviewed veterans' medical charts, was posted Tuesday on medrxiv.org, a pre-print server, meaning it was not peer reviewed or published in a medical journal. The research was funded by the National Institutes of Health and the University of Virginia

While this still remains to be peer reviewed, it is the third study showing issues with hydroxychloroquine. (The other two, a french and a swedish studies)

Just show that it is important to do ensure proper testing!

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/21/health/hydroxychloroquine-veterans-study/index.html

 

[The moose]

It's not that easy for me to say. I've been part time laid off. I'll be seeing a significant hit and have to go on unemployment, and hope they don't take weeks to figure it out. sure, we'll have our bills paid and food on the table, but only if we're careful.

While, it may have not been a lot, that 'stimulus' payment would help a lot of folks. I mean, for us, with two working adults and one child under 17, it was $2900. That covers at least a month of bills for us, and we're in expensive arse south Florida.

And I know folks are struggling. I've been doing the little I can with a few I know, but now I'm partially in their boat too. Not as bad, but not great.

I'm all for reopening some aspects of the economy, but I'm a stickler on the how. What protections will be put in place for air travel? for example.

I am with you. Broke but will figure it all out.

I don't see anything except for a dead cat bounce to this whole economy. A mad rush then they realize they can't really afford anything or get scared. Or worst yet they don't need that 5 buck coffee anymore or they actually learned how to cook better.

People will only do what they are comfortable with doing. The government needs to take the lead and test. Testing will build consumer confidence. Consumer confidence is the key to getting consumers after all this.

I know for one I finally quit smoking and don't drink crazy expensive coffees anymore. That is gonna free up major cash if work comes back well.

I see that new cheap motorcycle in my future because Americans are not gonna have toy money for a long time.

 

[The moose]

What do you have to loose?

Well it looks like your life. Doesn't seem to be a game changer.

NIH Panel Recommends Against Drug Combination Promoted By Trump For COVID-19

The group of experts, assembled under the agency run by Dr. Anthony Fauci, warns that using a combination of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin could result in potential toxicities.

www.npr.org