All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (12 Viewers)

Maxp · Feb 25, 2020

I fear we are really going to be in a bad place due to the obvious cuts to the federal agencies that deal with infectious disease, but also the negative effect the Affordable Care act has had on non urban hospitals. Our front line defenses are ineffectual and our ability to treat the populous is probably at an all time low. Factor in the cost of healthcare and I can see our system crashing. What do you think about the politics of this virus?

DJ1BigTymer · Apr 6, 2020

JimEverett said:
Trump is blamed for 10,000 deaths but [pick your favorite Democratic governor in a state exceeding the case rate per capita] gets a pass because of the unique situation of his/her state?
There are unique situations to countries as well, would you not agree? There are a great deal of similarities between Europe and the U.S. - the freedom of movement across large geographical areas, the fact that both are probably the most visited "countries" on earth for foreign travelers (especially if you include London), rather diverse populations, etc. etc. Both have been hit hard.

Trump is being criticized because of his beliefs that this would be no worse than the seasonal flu and he has convinced his most ardent supporters that is indeed the case. Even today there are those that believe that the "cure is worse than the infection" and that includes trump, despite his public comments during his daily briefings. Once he concludes his national address, he turns to his favorite media sources and continues on with his original comments about the seriousness of this virus.

Do you not notice that his "~~private~~ Fox Newz" comments are of a different tone and message than his addresses to the Nation?

The moose · Apr 6, 2020

Brandon13 said:
I said that I've been following this nationally, which to be more clear I meant that I've been following it at the federal level in addition to my local and state levels. I have not been closely following other states and their elected officials, therefore I do not really know how those politicians have done.

I guess you can get a pass. I would be consumed by what my state was doing and yours has been turning over the ball like a crab leg thief.

Dude all I got to tell you to do in Florida is to hold on. It is gonna get real bad in your state about four to six weeks from now.

Our curve start is from the Mardi gras traffic that was a while ago and have been shut down a while so we are at least closer to an eventual end. It is gonna get way worse but we are at least closer to an end.

Considering how your state and you neighboring states played the denial game you are about a month from knowing close to how bad it is gonna be.

Good luck to you and your family.

The moose · Apr 6, 2020

Brandon13 said:
It's being reported that Boris Johnson has been moved to the ICU.

Yeah he was showing symptoms for a long time.

He is probably in serious trouble.

Who takes over if he doesn't pull thru?

RobF · Apr 6, 2020

JimEverett said:
There are unique situations to countries as well, would you not agree? There are a great deal of similarities between Europe and the U.S. - the freedom of movement across large geographical areas, the fact that both are probably the most visited "countries" on earth for foreign travelers (especially if you include London), rather diverse populations, etc. etc. Both have been hit hard.

The UK and much of Europe also botched their responses, disregarding WHO advice and acting too slowly and too weakly to adequately address the situation.

The US, at the federal level and some states, botched it even more.

RobF · Apr 6, 2020

The moose said:
Yeah he was showing symptoms for a long time.

He is probably in serious trouble.

Who takes over if he doesn't pull thru?

Dominic Raab - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominic_Raab - is deputizing while Boris Johnson is out of action.

If Johnson couldn't return to duty, the Conservative party would at some point have a leadership election which would determine the new PM.

Saintamaniac · Apr 6, 2020

Brandon13 said:
It's being reported that Boris Johnson has been moved to the ICU.

Yet another example of playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes. I bet he wasn't expecting those chickens to come home to roost. If he pulls through hopefully he will have learned a lesson.

Saintamaniac · Apr 6, 2020

The attitudes of those who didn't take this seriously from the start or called it hoax has made me cold to those individuals when they get infected with this virus. I have lost love ones to this virus...the same virus that they called a hoax. I have no feelings of sympathy for anyone who gets the virus and previously called it a hoax or believed that it wasn't that serious. All I can say to them is if they believe very hard that it's a hoax, maybe it will turn out to be a hoax and that 103 fever will magically disappear just like trump said it wlll magically go away.

Beach Friends · Apr 6, 2020

Dragon said:
No it says that several has followed the example of the one quoted and more are expected to do so after evaluating the findings.

So, has Sweeden actually stopped its test or not?

MT15 · Apr 6, 2020

Farb said:
Everyone is a victim in identity politics- unless you get diddled by Biden.

you don’t give a shirt about identity politics, in fact you engage in it regularly. Save us the sanctimony.

SaintForLife · Apr 6, 2020

zztop said:
Lets take a moment to pause and reflect on the true heroes of this ordeal

News media, liberals mock conservatives for early pandemic comments they made themselves

Analysis of three months of public comments shows health officials, liberals and media personalities made comments similar to conservatives now being mocked.

justthenews.com

wardorican · Apr 6, 2020

JimEverett said:
Poor leadership where? Surely not just the President, right?

Why are the states hrdest hit by the virus (so far) states led by Democrats? Is it poor leadership from Italy, Spain, France, Germany, Netherlands, UK, etc. that has caused hospitalizations, death, economic struggles, etc?

It is really sort of gross watching people try to use this virus to score political points.

You're right. Plenty of other countries have failed. Many have made poor leadership decisions. However, a lot of it is beyond their control. We're free nations, with freedom comes many challenges.

Speaking of being gross trying to make a political point. You think the problem with the few states with Covid-19 outbreaks is because they're Democrats? Or maybe just that they are some of the more populous states?

But cut the crap. He was flat out lying to the American people about this. He was downplaying it. Or misleading us, or just not doing anything for far too long. There are others, and there will be an accounting. Thank goodness most of our Governors at least took some form of action and local officials in the larger cities did what they could.

Fact check: A timeline of how President Trump responded to the coronavirus

Mayor Lori Lightfoot and Governor JB Pritzker have not shied away from criticizing the White House over its response to the coronavirus or calling it inadequate. In Washington, D.C., Presiden…

wgntv.com

Late January
President Trump downplaying (almost ignoring) the threat.
“Hopefully, it won’t be as bad as many people say it will be,” he said on January 30. “We have it under control.
Then on February 3rd he said: “We’ve pretty much shut it down coming from China.”
February 5th
The Senate impeachment vote distracts the nation. But five days later, the president raises COVID-19 at a campaign rally.
“Looks like by April when it gets warmer it will go away,” he said.
February 25
As Coronavirus ravages South Korea, Iran and Italy in late February, President Trump tweets the virus is under control and the stock market is starting to look very good.
“We’re very close to a vaccine,” he said on February 25.

How sad is this statement. From our President. It's just so pathetic they way he talks. If a co-worker said something like this, you'd probably laugh at him.

March 11 & 13
No more denial. The World Health Organization declares the outbreak a pandemic, and President Trump addresses the nation.

“Today, I am officially declaring a national emergency, two very big words,” Trump said

Trump's own words contradict claim he's always viewed coronavirus as 'very serious'

President Trump's claims he 'felt it was a pandemic long before it was called one' and that he "always viewed it as very serious' are contradicted by his own words.

abcnews.go.com

Aren't you tired of him always lying about things?

wardorican · Apr 6, 2020

JimEverett said:
In the way I am thinking about the terms "criticism" is different than "blame" and/or some sort of partisan diatribe. Its the latter that seem to be directed at Trump/Republicans by people on this board: as in "trump's lack of leadership = 9,500 dead" or "Republican Governor will be responsible for x number of death because he won't do x, y, or z." Or posting some video showing that only Republicans are to blame for a lack of seriousness towards the virus in January, February, and into March.

I have no desire to blame Cuomo or any other Governor for the deaths and sickness that are happening. I am not even willing to criticize them at this time. It just seems laughable that while on the one hand pinning everything at the feet of Trump (who certainly deserves criticism) while ignoring Democrats (where every state above the average per capita is a state with a democrat in charge).

Which one of those Democratic Governors got on TV and said this virus is just like the flu, not a big deal. don't worry.

Which ones appointed not government officials to run parts of their task forces?

Which ones have the power to stop all international travel?

SaintForLife · Apr 6, 2020

wardorican said:
You're right. Plenty of other countries have failed. Many have made poor leadership decisions. However, a lot of it is beyond their control. We're free nations, with freedom comes many challenges.

Speaking of being gross trying to make a political point. You think the problem with the few states with Covid-19 outbreaks is because they're Democrats? Or maybe just that they are some of the more populous states?

But cut the crap. He was flat out lying to the American people about this. He was downplaying it. Or misleading us, or just not doing anything for far too long. There are others, and there will be an accounting. Thank goodness most of our Governors at least took some form of action and local officials in the larger cities did what they could.

Fact check: A timeline of how President Trump responded to the coronavirus
Mayor Lori Lightfoot and Governor JB Pritzker have not shied away from criticizing the White House over its response to the coronavirus or calling it inadequate. In Washington, D.C., Presiden…
wgntv.com

How sad is this statement. From our President. It's just so pathetic they way he talks. If a co-worker said something like this, you'd probably laugh at him.

Trump's own words contradict claim he's always viewed coronavirus as 'very serious'
President Trump's claims he 'felt it was a pandemic long before it was called one' and that he "always viewed it as very serious' are contradicted by his own words.
abcnews.go.com

Aren't you tired of him always lying about things?

What about prominent Democrats like Pelosi and Cuomo, multiple articles from the media, as well as the CDC all downplaying it around the same time as Trump?

SaintForLife · Apr 6, 2020

wardorican said:
Which one of those Democratic Governors got on TV and said this virus is just like the flu, not a big deal. don't worry.

Which ones appointed not government officials to run parts of their task forces?

Which ones have the power to stop all international travel?

News media, liberals mock conservatives for early pandemic comments they made themselves

Analysis of three months of public comments shows health officials, liberals and media personalities made comments similar to conservatives now being mocked.

justthenews.com

wardorican · Apr 6, 2020

SaintForLife said:
News media, liberals mock conservatives for early pandemic comments they made themselves
Analysis of three months of public comments shows health officials, liberals and media personalities made comments similar to conservatives now being mocked.
justthenews.com

That's cute, but did you actually read the linked articles, or just the crappy summaries that article used? I'll use the Hannity one to start with.

And another note. It should be obvious, but the Daily Show generally uses TV news blurbs to make fun of. None of the "others who said similar" were on TV. OMG, someone from an online news publication wrong something that sounds like a smarter way of saying almost the same idea! They should be mocked too!

Criticized personality: Sean Hannity of Fox News: "The sky is falling, we are all doomed, the end is near…or at least that’s what the media mob would like you to think.”
Others who said similar:
Wired, Robert Dingwall: "We should deescalate the war on coronavirus."
New York Governor Andrew Cuomo: “It is about the vulnerable. It's not about 95% of us. It's about a few percent who are vulnerable. That's all this is about. Bring down that anxiety, bring down that fear, bring down that paranoia.”
New York Times, Dr. David Katz: Is Our Fight Against Coronavirus Worse Than the Disease. "As much as 99 percent of active cases in the general population are ‘mild’ and do not require specific medical treatment.”
CDC: (current guidance through at least April 4) “The immediate risk of being exposed to this virus is still low for most Americans.”

Hannity gets crap mostly for his approach. His dismissive, smug, jackass way of talking about "the left". I don't know what else he said in that video, but I'm sure it was a far cry from just trying to put it in perspective, vs completely down playing it.

Cuomo was correct. The fear is mostly for the older and folks with other conditions. Most people don't need to be afraid of it. I'm not afraid of it, I'm afraid of being part of the problem causing a bunch of folks to die. I mean, don't get me wrong, I'd also rather not catch it.

Dr. Katz, that's a cute 1 sentence remark from a pretty well thought out article. His whole point was about instead of having everyone stay home, have the elderly and sickly stay home and keep everyone else out there, because the risk would be lower. He didn't think our current way of doing it would be very effective.

Opinion | Is Our Fight Against Coronavirus Worse Than the Disease? (Published 2020)

There may be more targeted ways to beat the pandemic.

www.nytimes.com

The data from South Korea, where tracking the coronavirus has been by far the best to date, indicate that as much as 99 percent of active cases in the general population are “mild” and do not require specific medical treatment. The small percentage of cases that do require such services are highly concentrated among those age 60 and older, and further so the older people are. Other things being equal, those over age 70 appear at three times the mortality risk as those age 60 to 69, and those over age 80 at nearly twice the mortality risk of those age 70 to 79.

These conclusions are corroborated by the data from Wuhan, China, which show a higher death rate, but an almost identical distribution. The higher death rate in China may be real, but is perhaps a result of less widespread testing. South Korea promptly, and uniquely, started testing the apparently healthy population at large, finding the mild and asymptomatic cases of Covid-19 other countries are overlooking. The experience of the Diamond Princess cruise ship, which houses a contained, older population, proves the point. The death rate among that insular and uniformly exposed population is roughly 1 percent.
We have, to date, fewer than 200 deaths from the coronavirus in the United States — a small data set from which to draw big conclusions. Still, it is entirely aligned with the data from other countries. The deaths have been mainly clustered among the elderly, those with significant chronic illnesses such as diabetes and heart disease, and those in both groups.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/03/...on=CompanionColumn&contentCollection=Trending
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/02/...on=CompanionColumn&contentCollection=Trending

This is not true of infectious scourges such as influenza. The flu hits the elderly and chronically ill hard, too, but it also kills children. Trying to create herd immunity among those most likely to recover from infection while also isolating the young and the old is daunting, to say the least. How does one allow exposure and immunity to develop in parents, without exposing their young children?
The clustering of complications and death from Covid-19 among the elderly and chronically ill, but not children (there have been only very rare deaths in children), suggests that we could achieve the crucial goals of social distancing — saving lives and not overwhelming our medical system — by preferentially protecting the medically frail and those over age 60, and in particular those over 70 and 80, from exposure.

At the time the CDC was correct. Heck, even with a few thousand known cases in South Florida, with over 6 million people, it would be pretty low odds for me to catch it.

wardorican · Apr 6, 2020

SaintForLife said:
News media, liberals mock conservatives for early pandemic comments they made themselves
Analysis of three months of public comments shows health officials, liberals and media personalities made comments similar to conservatives now being mocked.
justthenews.com

isn't that still correct?

He's not telling people to ignore it and go about their lives. Just not to have millions in a city panic and cause problems.

bdb13 · Apr 6, 2020

SaintForLife said:
News media, liberals mock conservatives for early pandemic comments they made themselves
Analysis of three months of public comments shows health officials, liberals and media personalities made comments similar to conservatives now being mocked.
justthenews.com

Video, Audio, Photos & Rush Transcript: Governor Cuomo: In Time of COVID-19 Pandemic be 'Socially Distanced, But Spiritually Connected'

Governor Cuomo urged Americans to be 'socially distanced, but spiritually connected' during the time of the COVID-19 pandemic.

www.governor.ny.gov

I was ready to say fork Cuomo but then I looked and that first one is out of context (and from March 23, right?) and is not really comparable to what Trump has said nor is it even bad. He's saying stay calm because most of you won't die even though many of you will catch it. Am I misreading it? Have had a couple drinks..

Didn't look up the other one up though

superchuck500 · Apr 6, 2020

Navarro circulated a warning memo in late January.

All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (12 Viewers)

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